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This "FOQ" does not come off as anything but something written by someone on a very high horse. For a project owner to need to write a page about these common

This "FOQ" does not come off as anything but something written by someone on a very high horse. For a project owner to need to write a page about these common questions, why would you not instead implement these common requests? I've often done this in some of my projects, which could be considered a microcosm of this. I've never heard of this application, but if there is a module system, why not write a few modules for some other people? Unless your api is horrible, it shouldn't be too difficult to implement all of the "Why Didn't You Implement My Favorite Feature?" if you are familiar with the code base.

notacoward 11y ago
> why would you not instead implement these common requests? Because time is finite. Apparently you're one of the few developers that doesn't have 10x more feature requests than you have resources to work on them. Good for you. However, that's not the norm. > why not write a few modules for some other people? See above. It's a mistake to generalize from young and/or small projects to those that have become large and complex over time.
- gravypod 11y ago
  On every project that I have worked on, developer support for projects increased with the amount of users. I would understand if there was no one using this project and it was a one-person operation, but if you are getting so many requests that it is literally impossible to comply with the top 5% of them then you should have made friends with enough people in your community who would be suited for doing these tasks. Don't get me wrong, I am not saying do every single request and I am definitely not saying spend most of your time doing requests. But my the developers admission, "Taskwarrior [...] is easy to programmatically convert to any other data interchange format." If it would make that many people happy, to the point where you need to have a link handy to tell them "no", then it might be worth it just to write the feature that everyone seems to want, even if it is in an optionally usable format like a 'module'.
  - xioxox 11y ago
    I've haven't noticed any increase in developers with my main project, which is very user heavy. It's a multiplatform GUI application, something which attracts a lot of non programmers. If you write some sort of library, you're going to get a lot of development help. That's not the case for a GUI app lots of people can use.
  - notacoward 11y ago
    > On every project that I have worked on, developer support for projects increased with the amount of users. Cool anecdote, bro. Some projects are fortunate that way, but I'd say it's only those in the "Goldilocks" zone in which your user based overlaps significantly with average-developer skills. At one end of the scale, as another responder pointed out, the vast majority of people who care about your project will be below that level technically. At the other end of the scale, as for example when working on a distributed filesystem, the inherent difficulty of the project itself will be above that level. Either way, you'll get very few developers relative to the number of people making demands. The specific domain of a project also makes a difference here. If your projects are in a specialty and at a level where you get lots of developers, as I said, good for you. That doesn't mean your situation is sufficiently common to justify your callow dismissal of others' experience or concerns.
    - dang 11y ago
      Please don't be personally abrasive in HN comments. This post would be fine without the snarky swipe at the beginning and the personal swipe at the end.
tptacek 11y ago
For a project owner to need to write a page about these common questions, why would you not instead implement these common requests? The whole document is about answering each of those common questions individually.
- gravypod 11y ago
  If it gets to the point where someone says "can you implement X, Y, and Z for me, it would make my life much better" isn't it better to just implement it and make everyone happier rather than write a web page just telling them essentially to get out?
  - tptacek 11y ago
    See: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11054501 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11054501 and note that none of the reasoning on that page includes "so we can write this web page".
  - dalke 11y ago
    Hey, can you rewrite your code in Visual Basic/Objective C? It would make my life so much better to be able to support Windows 95/the iPad. Hey, can you rewrite your documentation in Swedish? It would make my life so much better? Hey, can you implement I/O using size in English units instead of metric? It would make my life much better. Hey, can you add a GUI for me? It would make my life much better than using the command-line.
    - gravypod 11y ago
      Come on, you know that is an absolute mischaracterization of what I am saying. If those where the problems in this document, I would agree. However that is not the case.
      - dalke 11y ago
        Okay, "Can you rewrite the documentation in Markdown instead of HTML? That would be so much better for me." "Can you switch from Atlassian to the Github issue tracker? That would be so much better for me. "Can you switch from a custom CI solution to Travis? That would be so much better for me." Then two years later someone comes along and says: "Can you rewrite the documentation in reStructuredText instead of Markdown? That would be so much better for me." "Can you switch from git to mercurial? That would be so much better for me." And so on. When does the madness stop?
throw12121 11y ago
Q: Why won't you spend your free time implementing my favorite feature? If you're not paying us, you need to convince us that your feature is so great, that it's worth giving up our free time to work on. This is open source. Scratch thine own itch.
- gravypod 11y ago
  Not everyone knows how to program. If a programmer asks for a feature, tell a programmer to write it, if someone who is interested in programming help them write a feature, but if enough people officially request a feature it's better to just help the lot of them.
  - ben336 11y ago
    Thats equivalent to saying "if enough people have strong feelings about how you should spend your free time, you should listen to them". Would you really support that in any context that didn't involve "open source"?
    - Chris2048 11y ago
      Depends on how you interpret putting code online, and how it is done. If I started/declared a running club, there maybe expectations on how I spend my time - I initiated the expectation.
  - dalke 11y ago
    I wrote a simple RSS package in 2003. I still get support emails about it. I don't even remember how the code works. I wrote some introductory Python code 10+ years ago, for one of my classes. I put it online. I now get random college students emailing me personally to ask for help doing their homework. I distribute some of my software for free. I've since had people demand (yes, demand) essentially hours of free support time to debug their hardware configuration for them because they don't know enough to do it themselves. When do I get to decide what is "better" for me, rather than do things which are "better" for others?

notacoward 11y ago

> why would you not instead implement these common requests? Because time is finite. Apparently you're one of the few developers that doesn't have 10x more feature requests than you have resources to work on them. Good for you. However, that's not the norm. > why not write a few modules for some other people? See above. It's a mistake to generalize from young and/or small projects to those that have become large and complex over time.

gravypod 11y ago
On every project that I have worked on, developer support for projects increased with the amount of users. I would understand if there was no one using this project and it was a one-person operation, but if you are getting so many requests that it is literally impossible to comply with the top 5% of them then you should have made friends with enough people in your community who would be suited for doing these tasks. Don't get me wrong, I am not saying do every single request and I am definitely not saying spend most of your time doing requests. But my the developers admission, "Taskwarrior [...] is easy to programmatically convert to any other data interchange format." If it would make that many people happy, to the point where you need to have a link handy to tell them "no", then it might be worth it just to write the feature that everyone seems to want, even if it is in an optionally usable format like a 'module'.
- xioxox 11y ago
  I've haven't noticed any increase in developers with my main project, which is very user heavy. It's a multiplatform GUI application, something which attracts a lot of non programmers. If you write some sort of library, you're going to get a lot of development help. That's not the case for a GUI app lots of people can use.
- notacoward 11y ago
  > On every project that I have worked on, developer support for projects increased with the amount of users. Cool anecdote, bro. Some projects are fortunate that way, but I'd say it's only those in the "Goldilocks" zone in which your user based overlaps significantly with average-developer skills. At one end of the scale, as another responder pointed out, the vast majority of people who care about your project will be below that level technically. At the other end of the scale, as for example when working on a distributed filesystem, the inherent difficulty of the project itself will be above that level. Either way, you'll get very few developers relative to the number of people making demands. The specific domain of a project also makes a difference here. If your projects are in a specialty and at a level where you get lots of developers, as I said, good for you. That doesn't mean your situation is sufficiently common to justify your callow dismissal of others' experience or concerns.
  - dang 11y ago
    Please don't be personally abrasive in HN comments. This post would be fine without the snarky swipe at the beginning and the personal swipe at the end.

tptacek 11y ago

For a project owner to need to write a page about these common questions, why would you not instead implement these common requests? The whole document is about answering each of those common questions individually.

gravypod 11y ago
If it gets to the point where someone says "can you implement X, Y, and Z for me, it would make my life much better" isn't it better to just implement it and make everyone happier rather than write a web page just telling them essentially to get out?
- tptacek 11y ago
  See: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11054501 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11054501 and note that none of the reasoning on that page includes "so we can write this web page".
- dalke 11y ago
  Hey, can you rewrite your code in Visual Basic/Objective C? It would make my life so much better to be able to support Windows 95/the iPad. Hey, can you rewrite your documentation in Swedish? It would make my life so much better? Hey, can you implement I/O using size in English units instead of metric? It would make my life much better. Hey, can you add a GUI for me? It would make my life much better than using the command-line.
  - gravypod 11y ago
    Come on, you know that is an absolute mischaracterization of what I am saying. If those where the problems in this document, I would agree. However that is not the case.
    - dalke 11y ago
      Okay, "Can you rewrite the documentation in Markdown instead of HTML? That would be so much better for me." "Can you switch from Atlassian to the Github issue tracker? That would be so much better for me. "Can you switch from a custom CI solution to Travis? That would be so much better for me." Then two years later someone comes along and says: "Can you rewrite the documentation in reStructuredText instead of Markdown? That would be so much better for me." "Can you switch from git to mercurial? That would be so much better for me." And so on. When does the madness stop?

throw12121 11y ago

Q: Why won't you spend your free time implementing my favorite feature? If you're not paying us, you need to convince us that your feature is so great, that it's worth giving up our free time to work on. This is open source. Scratch thine own itch.

gravypod 11y ago
Not everyone knows how to program. If a programmer asks for a feature, tell a programmer to write it, if someone who is interested in programming help them write a feature, but if enough people officially request a feature it's better to just help the lot of them.
- ben336 11y ago
  Thats equivalent to saying "if enough people have strong feelings about how you should spend your free time, you should listen to them". Would you really support that in any context that didn't involve "open source"?
  - Chris2048 11y ago
    Depends on how you interpret putting code online, and how it is done. If I started/declared a running club, there maybe expectations on how I spend my time - I initiated the expectation.
- dalke 11y ago
  I wrote a simple RSS package in 2003. I still get support emails about it. I don't even remember how the code works. I wrote some introductory Python code 10+ years ago, for one of my classes. I put it online. I now get random college students emailing me personally to ask for help doing their homework. I distribute some of my software for free. I've since had people demand (yes, demand) essentially hours of free support time to debug their hardware configuration for them because they don't know enough to do it themselves. When do I get to decide what is "better" for me, rather than do things which are "better" for others?