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> Programmers are abstract thinkers, and it's disgusting to see them lower themselves and adopt the semantics and memes of obvious cultural constructs like race

> Programmers are abstract thinkers, and it's disgusting to see them lower themselves and adopt the semantics and memes of obvious cultural constructs like race. You have to be joking. This is sarcasm, right?

dracht 11y ago
There is a lot of overlap between the HN user base and the delusional SJW ilk that is running Github into the ground. People here are defending the blatantly racist sentiments mentioned in the article. They are performing some serious mental gymnastics to both hold the belief that race is an irrelevant social construct and that too many people of one race (cough whiteys cough) in one place is bad.
- dang 11y ago
  There's a lot of overlap between the HN user base and both sides of this argument, because the tech community itself is divided and HN reflects that. Each side feels that the other is over-represented here, but that's probably just cognitive bias.
blueflow 11y ago
From my view, race seems arbitrary. You could also split people into blue-eyed and brown-eyed or something. It still doesn't say anything about that person. Its just that many normal persons act like its a huge difference.
- knn 11y ago
  Many people would agree with you that race doesn't say that much about a person. However, it's quite naive to argue that racial issues are not a part of every day life. We live in a world built on racial divides and conflicts. It's obviously venerable to strive towards a non-racist society, but to do so one needs to understand the issues at hand.
  - blueflow 11y ago
    I'm refusing to accept the split between "we" and "they" based on appearance or minor biological factors. Show me a discrete situation where this results in bad decision making on my side, and I'll change my behavior.
  - 13thLetter 11y ago
    Sure, but that emphatically does not mean abandoning principles of merit and equality and letting bullies and shakedown artists run your companies, as Github and too many others are doing.
- anotherc 11y ago
  > From my view, race seems arbitrary. You could also split people into blue-eyed and brown-eyed or something. You could pick any societal construct or experience and say it doesn't matter to you. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist. You could say money is just paper and ones and zeros in a database so you shouldn't have to use it but you are deluding yourself.
  - blueflow 11y ago
    Its a pretend-game anyway and i'm well aware of it. Money justifies itself because it allows trade and therefore specialization of individuals. Its required for the technological progress we already done. Same goes with Companies, Math, or most Science things. Race is used by people who want to discriminate (independent of direction) or seek justification by victim-hood (and everything derived). Both are harmful behaviors. I will not support that.
reitanqild 11y ago
Why would it be? Are things really so much different where you live as compared to western Europe?
proc0 11y ago
Nope. But I don't know what you're getting at. As a programmer, I just care that you write good code. In fact, I might as well be interacting with your mind across the internet, and don't even have to look at you in the face, and we will be collaborating just fine. Why does it matter for someone who deals with 0's and 1's what the color of the skin of your coworker is? Once again, if you're a programmer and you're swimming in abstractions and code, my coworker might as well be a robot, and I could give two shits.
- anotherc 11y ago
  > Why does it matter for someone who deals with 0's and 1's what the color of the skin of your coworker is? It seems crazy to me that someone would have to explain this on a public forum.If you are a white male I'm sure it might be hard for you to understand why race, gender, and class matter and how they intersect with your life, your work, and that of your colleagues.
  - JoeAltmaier 11y ago
    Lets not deliberately ignore the point that was trying to be made. Its possible in this industry, to not even know the race or ethnicity of a coworker. That's a positive thing.
    - malandrew 11y ago
      Lol. So true. I had a co-worker that I talked with several times a week about technical issues via HipChat for almost a year before I met him in person and the entire time I knew nothing about him other than he was a guy or identified as a guy and he was really good at his job (we have a few trans co-workers, so I don't assume cis-male). When I finally met him, it turns out that he was on the same floor about 50 meters away despite the fact that we're at a company with 1500 engineers spread across multiple offices.
  - Khaine 11y ago
    NO IT FUCKING DOESN"T STOP WITH THIS BULLSHIT If you contribute to an open source product under then name 'anotherc', nobody cares if you are black, white, pink, male or female. All they will care about is the quality of your code Likewise at work, all that people should care about is the quality of your work, and being respectful of others. IF YOU THINK SOMEONES RACE MATTERS YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM

dracht 11y ago

There is a lot of overlap between the HN user base and the delusional SJW ilk that is running Github into the ground. People here are defending the blatantly racist sentiments mentioned in the article. They are performing some serious mental gymnastics to both hold the belief that race is an irrelevant social construct and that too many people of one race (cough whiteys cough) in one place is bad.

dang 11y ago
There's a lot of overlap between the HN user base and both sides of this argument, because the tech community itself is divided and HN reflects that. Each side feels that the other is over-represented here, but that's probably just cognitive bias.

blueflow 11y ago

From my view, race seems arbitrary. You could also split people into blue-eyed and brown-eyed or something. It still doesn't say anything about that person. Its just that many normal persons act like its a huge difference.

knn 11y ago
Many people would agree with you that race doesn't say that much about a person. However, it's quite naive to argue that racial issues are not a part of every day life. We live in a world built on racial divides and conflicts. It's obviously venerable to strive towards a non-racist society, but to do so one needs to understand the issues at hand.
- blueflow 11y ago
  I'm refusing to accept the split between "we" and "they" based on appearance or minor biological factors. Show me a discrete situation where this results in bad decision making on my side, and I'll change my behavior.
- 13thLetter 11y ago
  Sure, but that emphatically does not mean abandoning principles of merit and equality and letting bullies and shakedown artists run your companies, as Github and too many others are doing.
anotherc 11y ago
> From my view, race seems arbitrary. You could also split people into blue-eyed and brown-eyed or something. You could pick any societal construct or experience and say it doesn't matter to you. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist. You could say money is just paper and ones and zeros in a database so you shouldn't have to use it but you are deluding yourself.
- blueflow 11y ago
  Its a pretend-game anyway and i'm well aware of it. Money justifies itself because it allows trade and therefore specialization of individuals. Its required for the technological progress we already done. Same goes with Companies, Math, or most Science things. Race is used by people who want to discriminate (independent of direction) or seek justification by victim-hood (and everything derived). Both are harmful behaviors. I will not support that.

reitanqild 11y ago

Why would it be? Are things really so much different where you live as compared to western Europe?

proc0 11y ago

Nope. But I don't know what you're getting at. As a programmer, I just care that you write good code. In fact, I might as well be interacting with your mind across the internet, and don't even have to look at you in the face, and we will be collaborating just fine. Why does it matter for someone who deals with 0's and 1's what the color of the skin of your coworker is? Once again, if you're a programmer and you're swimming in abstractions and code, my coworker might as well be a robot, and I could give two shits.

anotherc 11y ago
> Why does it matter for someone who deals with 0's and 1's what the color of the skin of your coworker is? It seems crazy to me that someone would have to explain this on a public forum.If you are a white male I'm sure it might be hard for you to understand why race, gender, and class matter and how they intersect with your life, your work, and that of your colleagues.
- JoeAltmaier 11y ago
  Lets not deliberately ignore the point that was trying to be made. Its possible in this industry, to not even know the race or ethnicity of a coworker. That's a positive thing.
  - malandrew 11y ago
    Lol. So true. I had a co-worker that I talked with several times a week about technical issues via HipChat for almost a year before I met him in person and the entire time I knew nothing about him other than he was a guy or identified as a guy and he was really good at his job (we have a few trans co-workers, so I don't assume cis-male). When I finally met him, it turns out that he was on the same floor about 50 meters away despite the fact that we're at a company with 1500 engineers spread across multiple offices.
- Khaine 11y ago
  NO IT FUCKING DOESN"T STOP WITH THIS BULLSHIT If you contribute to an open source product under then name 'anotherc', nobody cares if you are black, white, pink, male or female. All they will care about is the quality of your code Likewise at work, all that people should care about is the quality of your work, and being respectful of others. IF YOU THINK SOMEONES RACE MATTERS YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM