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A huge portion of value with any of these text editors come from plugins and ubiquity. Over the years I have seen text editors come and go as the new "one true

A huge portion of value with any of these text editors come from plugins and ubiquity. Over the years I have seen text editors come and go as the new "one true editor", but only Vim and Emacs have had true staying power. Back when it was hot (some of you are probably too young to remember this) I used jEdit. It is still around and gets some maintenance updates from time to time (http://www.jedit.org/ http://www.jedit.org/), but the plugin ecosystem has languished so you better be ready to roll your own. With Vim and Emacs (Vim for me) I can trust it to go anywhere I want to be. If I'm ssh-ing into a Redhat 5 production server needing to do an emergency fix at 3 in the am Vim is there for me. And when I need syntax support or any plugin under the sun, that is available as well. Vim is also blazingly fast compared to Atom (the latest fad) which is sluggish by comparison. Sublime seems to be falling into that sunsetting stage the same as jEdit Just my 2 cents.

ryannevius 11y ago
I'm not sure I understand what your comment has to do with Sublime...but in any case, Sublime does have a very active plugin ecosystem: https://packagecontrol.io/ https://packagecontrol.io/
- eswat 11y ago
  From OP… > Sublime seems to be falling into that sunsetting stage the same as jEdit
- bigtunacan 11y ago
  I thought my points were fairly clear. 1) Vim and Emacs are already on your production servers so a large number of people have to use them anyway so that's extra mental overhead. 2) Sublime development is languishing this will eventually lead to a stalled plugin pipeline and the need to learn a new tool or write your own plugins. 3) Stick with a tool that you can have a level of faith will still be well supported for the next 20 years.
  - oldmanjay 11y ago
    Not all of us are stuck in the cult of the editing paradigm of the 70s despite the fervent mistaken belief that it is objectively superior.
    - pachydermic 11y ago
      How is sublime fundamentally different? Sure, it might be shinier and easier to get into, but is it a different "paradigm"? No way. If anything, vim is the most unique editor with the most unique "paradigm" I've ever really had much experience with. Atom, Sublime and Emacs all seem pretty much the same in terms of how you interact with them. Pretty sure saint ignucius will damn you to proprietary software hell for dissing on the One True Editor (tm).
      - wodenokoto 11y ago
        If vim is different from sublime, then sublime must, by definition, be different from vim. Parent is saying that vim is a 70's paradigm and people not stuck in the past enjoy the modern paradigm that sublime follows.
        pachydermic 11y ago
        Emacs is also from the 70s, so that's why what he said doesn't really make sense.
  - ashwinaj 11y ago
    > 1) Vim and Emacs are already on your production servers so a large number of people have to use them anyway so that's extra mental overhead. Production servers usually have no vim plugins. Basic vim editing is good enough to get by if you're just looking at logs. In my workplace and I guess it's pretty standard these days (in Linux shops at least) where the code repository resides on a server in a data center and not locally on your laptop/desktop. Here are the issues with this development work flow: - There are a lot of hurdles to go through to install all the vim plugins (no root access, security of plugins etc.) - Which plugin manager to use (Vundle, pathogen or some variant??). Why isn't there a standard for this after all these years? - Unreadable .vimrc file with all sorts of key bindings (Yes I know it's "write once use everywhere", it still is unreadable a few months down the line) - In my experience, using vim on a mounted drive with the plugins I need (git,ctrl-p,ctags,cscope,nerd tree and a few others) is slower as compared to Sublime Text. > 2) Sublime development is languishing this will eventually lead to a stalled plugin pipeline and the need to learn a new tool or write your own plugins. https://packagecontrol.io/stats https://packagecontrol.io/stats I don't think these are low numbers by any means. I'm not a vim basher, I just don't prefer working with it.
ebbv 11y ago
Yes Vim is great. This post has nothing to do with Vim, why did you make a comment about how much you love Vim? Is your point that you think Sublime has no staying power so everyone should just use Vim or Emacs? There's reasons other than staying power to use an application. If I only used applications that I expect to be around forever I'd be paralyzed and unable to make a decision a lot of the time.
- bigtunacan 11y ago
  I agree that staying power is not the only reason to stick with an application, however I don't believe Sublime offers any compellingly advantages over Vim or Emacs and that there are better ways to spend one's time than learning the current text editor of the year.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - ebbv 11y ago
    So because you prefer Vim/Emacs you came into a thread about the new version of another editor and posted a comment about how much you prefer something else? Do you get why that's immature and pointless?
ricardobeat 11y ago
The Java runtime is not bundled with OSX anymore, and with its poor security record it's not something I'm eager to install. Java GUI apps also tend to use too much resources, feel laggy and look bad & non-native, jEdit is not an exception. My dream editor is Sublime3 with an extensible UI layer for plugins in HTML/JS.
- kuschku 11y ago
  > The Java runtime is not bundled with OSX anymore, and with its poor security record it's not something I'm eager to install. Java GUI apps also tend to use too much resources, feel laggy and look bad & non-native, jEdit is not an exception. This is a funny myth. Now to some facts: 1. It’s the Applet part that has a bad security record. Not standalone Applications. 2. Java GUI apps use less resources, are less laggy, and more native than any node.JS app out there. jEdit is not an exception. It’s crazy to see people hype Atom for being node-webkit, extensible, etc, but complain about Java apps for "bundles a whole runtime" (while node-webkit bundles a whole browser), for "so slow and laggy" (but faster than node-webkit), for "looks not native" (but more than node-webkit)
  - popinman322 11y ago
    Consider JetBrains' products, most of which are JVM based. I can't remember any instances where IntelliJ was "laggy" except during processes that inherently take time for larger code bases (indexing, etc.).
    - softinio 11y ago
      Intellij is fantastic !
    - kisstheblade 11y ago
      I found that intellij was indexing all the time, slowly. In comparison eclipse never seems to index anything (and it has great type etc. search capabilities). Intellij really seems like a slow java-app compared with eclipse (which of course is java but using a better toolkit). Yes off topic; sublime rocks! :)
jonwinstanley 11y ago
Vim and Emacs are great for a certain percentage of people, but for the rest of us mere mortals, Sublime is a great choice. It's very fast, handles huge files/projects and has plugins and extensions for a wide range of tasks. The only downside is that the developer retains complete control and updates are few and far between. It would be great if the project could become more open and we could see more focused development on it.
douche 11y ago
Notepad++ is my light-weight text editor, for the stuff I don't already have in my Visual Studio solutions. It's free, it's good, it's fast, and you can run it portable if you want to. Windows only, but that's not a problem for me.
pilif 11y ago
Good old jEdit - I was also a heavy user, usually running CVS HEAD and I even got a few bugfixes of mine commited. Recently, I found its old main author (Slava Pestov) again on the swift-evolution mailing list - this time with an @apple.com address.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
lottin 11y ago
Exactly. When it comes to text editors there's Emacs and there's Vim. The rest are passing fads that seem to appeal mostly to trendy kids.
- banku_brougham 11y ago
  Nope. I absolutely love ST3, writing with it is enjoyment. Vim of course is a requisite skill.

ryannevius 11y ago

I'm not sure I understand what your comment has to do with Sublime...but in any case, Sublime does have a very active plugin ecosystem: https://packagecontrol.io/ https://packagecontrol.io/

eswat 11y ago
From OP… > Sublime seems to be falling into that sunsetting stage the same as jEdit
bigtunacan 11y ago
I thought my points were fairly clear. 1) Vim and Emacs are already on your production servers so a large number of people have to use them anyway so that's extra mental overhead. 2) Sublime development is languishing this will eventually lead to a stalled plugin pipeline and the need to learn a new tool or write your own plugins. 3) Stick with a tool that you can have a level of faith will still be well supported for the next 20 years.
- oldmanjay 11y ago
  Not all of us are stuck in the cult of the editing paradigm of the 70s despite the fervent mistaken belief that it is objectively superior.
  - pachydermic 11y ago
    How is sublime fundamentally different? Sure, it might be shinier and easier to get into, but is it a different "paradigm"? No way. If anything, vim is the most unique editor with the most unique "paradigm" I've ever really had much experience with. Atom, Sublime and Emacs all seem pretty much the same in terms of how you interact with them. Pretty sure saint ignucius will damn you to proprietary software hell for dissing on the One True Editor (tm).
    - wodenokoto 11y ago
      If vim is different from sublime, then sublime must, by definition, be different from vim. Parent is saying that vim is a 70's paradigm and people not stuck in the past enjoy the modern paradigm that sublime follows.
      - pachydermic 11y ago
        Emacs is also from the 70s, so that's why what he said doesn't really make sense.
- ashwinaj 11y ago
  > 1) Vim and Emacs are already on your production servers so a large number of people have to use them anyway so that's extra mental overhead. Production servers usually have no vim plugins. Basic vim editing is good enough to get by if you're just looking at logs. In my workplace and I guess it's pretty standard these days (in Linux shops at least) where the code repository resides on a server in a data center and not locally on your laptop/desktop. Here are the issues with this development work flow: - There are a lot of hurdles to go through to install all the vim plugins (no root access, security of plugins etc.) - Which plugin manager to use (Vundle, pathogen or some variant??). Why isn't there a standard for this after all these years? - Unreadable .vimrc file with all sorts of key bindings (Yes I know it's "write once use everywhere", it still is unreadable a few months down the line) - In my experience, using vim on a mounted drive with the plugins I need (git,ctrl-p,ctags,cscope,nerd tree and a few others) is slower as compared to Sublime Text. > 2) Sublime development is languishing this will eventually lead to a stalled plugin pipeline and the need to learn a new tool or write your own plugins. https://packagecontrol.io/stats https://packagecontrol.io/stats I don't think these are low numbers by any means. I'm not a vim basher, I just don't prefer working with it.

ebbv 11y ago

Yes Vim is great. This post has nothing to do with Vim, why did you make a comment about how much you love Vim? Is your point that you think Sublime has no staying power so everyone should just use Vim or Emacs? There's reasons other than staying power to use an application. If I only used applications that I expect to be around forever I'd be paralyzed and unable to make a decision a lot of the time.

bigtunacan 11y ago
I agree that staying power is not the only reason to stick with an application, however I don't believe Sublime offers any compellingly advantages over Vim or Emacs and that there are better ways to spend one's time than learning the current text editor of the year.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- ebbv 11y ago
  So because you prefer Vim/Emacs you came into a thread about the new version of another editor and posted a comment about how much you prefer something else? Do you get why that's immature and pointless?

ricardobeat 11y ago

The Java runtime is not bundled with OSX anymore, and with its poor security record it's not something I'm eager to install. Java GUI apps also tend to use too much resources, feel laggy and look bad & non-native, jEdit is not an exception. My dream editor is Sublime3 with an extensible UI layer for plugins in HTML/JS.

kuschku 11y ago
> The Java runtime is not bundled with OSX anymore, and with its poor security record it's not something I'm eager to install. Java GUI apps also tend to use too much resources, feel laggy and look bad & non-native, jEdit is not an exception. This is a funny myth. Now to some facts: 1. It’s the Applet part that has a bad security record. Not standalone Applications. 2. Java GUI apps use less resources, are less laggy, and more native than any node.JS app out there. jEdit is not an exception. It’s crazy to see people hype Atom for being node-webkit, extensible, etc, but complain about Java apps for "bundles a whole runtime" (while node-webkit bundles a whole browser), for "so slow and laggy" (but faster than node-webkit), for "looks not native" (but more than node-webkit)
- popinman322 11y ago
  Consider JetBrains' products, most of which are JVM based. I can't remember any instances where IntelliJ was "laggy" except during processes that inherently take time for larger code bases (indexing, etc.).
  - softinio 11y ago
    Intellij is fantastic !
  - kisstheblade 11y ago
    I found that intellij was indexing all the time, slowly. In comparison eclipse never seems to index anything (and it has great type etc. search capabilities). Intellij really seems like a slow java-app compared with eclipse (which of course is java but using a better toolkit). Yes off topic; sublime rocks! :)

jonwinstanley 11y ago

Vim and Emacs are great for a certain percentage of people, but for the rest of us mere mortals, Sublime is a great choice. It's very fast, handles huge files/projects and has plugins and extensions for a wide range of tasks. The only downside is that the developer retains complete control and updates are few and far between. It would be great if the project could become more open and we could see more focused development on it.

douche 11y ago

Notepad++ is my light-weight text editor, for the stuff I don't already have in my Visual Studio solutions. It's free, it's good, it's fast, and you can run it portable if you want to. Windows only, but that's not a problem for me.

pilif 11y ago

Good old jEdit - I was also a heavy user, usually running CVS HEAD and I even got a few bugfixes of mine commited. Recently, I found its old main author (Slava Pestov) again on the swift-evolution mailing list - this time with an @apple.com address.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

lottin 11y ago

Exactly. When it comes to text editors there's Emacs and there's Vim. The rest are passing fads that seem to appeal mostly to trendy kids.

banku_brougham 11y ago
Nope. I absolutely love ST3, writing with it is enjoyment. Vim of course is a requisite skill.