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What would you think of a government employee who didn't know the US was a democracy?

icholy 11y ago
This would be a good analogy if the guy didn't know he worked for a tech company.
Lawtonfogle 11y ago
Well it isn't. Officially it is a republic. A democratic one, but a republic. Unofficially political power is so unevenly distributed it should be called an oligarchy. Officially, North Korea is also a republic. Now, if the person thought the President was a king of a monarchy, then I would say they have been listening to too much talk radio.
- throwawaymsft 11y ago
  Originally I was going to say "democratic republic" but then it becomes a game of minutia. Not knowing that Amazon is controlled by a board of directors (elected by shareholders, the owners) is just like not realizing the president is elected and we don't have King Obama.
  - squeaky-clean 11y ago
    > Not knowing that Amazon is controlled by a board of directors (elected by shareholders, the owners) is just like not realizing the president is elected and we don't have King Obama. Sure, and it would be very surprising for anyone not to know that, but I don't see how it makes them any less qualified to do their job.
    - throwawaymsft 11y ago
      If someone believed in King Obama, would your surprise elevate or diminish your confidence in their general-purpose information gathering skills?
- dragonwriter 11y ago
  > Well it isn't. Yes, it is. Or, at least, if not, not for the first reason you present. > Officially it is a republic. A democratic one, but a republic. A democratic republic is still a democracy (usually, a representative democracy, but since any political system which isn't a monarchy can be correctly called a "republic", a direct democracy could also be a democratic republic.) The idea that "democracy" and "republic" are mutually exclusive categories is quite wrong. > Unofficially political power is so unevenly distributed it should be called an oligarchy. And so connected to wealth that it should be called plutocracy, according to some, sure. > Officially, North Korea is also a republic. And a democratic one, too.
philh 11y ago
Depends on the role. For example, I think a postman is a government employee? In that case, about the same as I'd think of an Amazon engineer who didn't know that. I have no idea how they don't know it, and I think a little less of them for it. But if it's not relevant for their work, I don't judge their skill by it, and I don't think less of them than I do of anyone else. If you want me to be - offended? shocked? contemptuous? - of what someone doesn't know, please tell me why it's so important for them to know it. Not just why it could potentially be useful for someone in their role. Why it's so important for anyone in this role, that this particular thing gets singled out, suggests in lieu of all other data that they're incompetent. I'm an engineer at a publicly traded company. (Or so I assume. I could be mistaken.) I can think of dozens of things I don't know that would be useful for me to know. I do know what a publicly traded company is, but this knowledge is not useful for me in my role.
- throwawaymsft 11y ago
  Would you want to work with someone who "is sure" of a trivially verifiable fact? It's ok to be ignorant ("I have no idea who owns what") but to be sure of something that pants-on-head false? What else are they "sure" about?

This would be a good analogy if the guy didn't know he worked for a tech company.

Well it isn't. Officially it is a republic. A democratic one, but a republic. Unofficially political power is so unevenly distributed it should be called an oligarchy. Officially, North Korea is also a republic. Now, if the person thought the President was a king of a monarchy, then I would say they have been listening to too much talk radio.

throwawaymsft 11y ago
Originally I was going to say "democratic republic" but then it becomes a game of minutia. Not knowing that Amazon is controlled by a board of directors (elected by shareholders, the owners) is just like not realizing the president is elected and we don't have King Obama.
- squeaky-clean 11y ago
  > Not knowing that Amazon is controlled by a board of directors (elected by shareholders, the owners) is just like not realizing the president is elected and we don't have King Obama. Sure, and it would be very surprising for anyone not to know that, but I don't see how it makes them any less qualified to do their job.
  - throwawaymsft 11y ago
    If someone believed in King Obama, would your surprise elevate or diminish your confidence in their general-purpose information gathering skills?
dragonwriter 11y ago
> Well it isn't. Yes, it is. Or, at least, if not, not for the first reason you present. > Officially it is a republic. A democratic one, but a republic. A democratic republic is still a democracy (usually, a representative democracy, but since any political system which isn't a monarchy can be correctly called a "republic", a direct democracy could also be a democratic republic.) The idea that "democracy" and "republic" are mutually exclusive categories is quite wrong. > Unofficially political power is so unevenly distributed it should be called an oligarchy. And so connected to wealth that it should be called plutocracy, according to some, sure. > Officially, North Korea is also a republic. And a democratic one, too.

philh 11y ago

Depends on the role. For example, I think a postman is a government employee? In that case, about the same as I'd think of an Amazon engineer who didn't know that. I have no idea how they don't know it, and I think a little less of them for it. But if it's not relevant for their work, I don't judge their skill by it, and I don't think less of them than I do of anyone else. If you want me to be - offended? shocked? contemptuous? - of what someone doesn't know, please tell me why it's so important for them to know it. Not just why it could potentially be useful for someone in their role. Why it's so important for anyone in this role, that this particular thing gets singled out, suggests in lieu of all other data that they're incompetent. I'm an engineer at a publicly traded company. (Or so I assume. I could be mistaken.) I can think of dozens of things I don't know that would be useful for me to know. I do know what a publicly traded company is, but this knowledge is not useful for me in my role.

throwawaymsft 11y ago
Would you want to work with someone who "is sure" of a trivially verifiable fact? It's ok to be ignorant ("I have no idea who owns what") but to be sure of something that pants-on-head false? What else are they "sure" about?