4 ms·

Sorry this reply screams "I don't care, I'm tired, I'm stressed, don't make me think." What exactly is your value here? All you're doing is fitting a cog in the

by cpt1138 11y ago

Sorry this reply screams "I don't care, I'm tired, I'm stressed, don't make me think." What exactly is your value here? All you're doing is fitting a cog in the machinery. Since my impression is that a good developer can deal with any situation necessary, I never understood the laundry list of technologies way of fitting a candidate to a "good hire." We know this is the reality of recruiters. Maybe on HN do a better job of selling the industry of tired, stressed, people that don't care working to fill a slot.

coldtea 11y ago
>Sorry this reply screams "I don't care, I'm tired, I'm stressed, don't make me think." Well, if you're expecting anything else from a recruiter being send your resume you'll be in for a hard surprise. The inverse is "I couldn't put in the time to make my CV tidy and intuitive, but you'll have to soldier thru it, because I have the mistaken opinion that I'm a unique snowflake and you don't get hundreds of them". In fact, "don't make me think" is a GREAT advice for anything you want others to read/try/adopt/buy. http://www.amazon.com/Dont-Make-Me-Think-Usability/dp/0321344758 http://www.amazon.com/Dont-Make-Me-Think-Usability/dp/032134... >Since my impression is that a good developer can deal with any situation necessary, I never understood the laundry list of technologies way of fitting a candidate to a "good hire." Even if a good C++ game developer could switch to Javascript front-end development if needed (to give an extreme example), the time it takes to have them familiar with the relevant stack is better spent hiring someone already familiar. And, it's kind of obvious -- both can be just as good. It's just the second is also ready to hit the ground running on the stack a company uses. And, of course, just because someone "can deal with any situation necessary" doesn't mean they'd like to. Some programmers like to program in X or Y languages (or language families), others like building Z or K kind of programs. Just because someone could switch from Haskell to Ruby or from scientific programming to CRUDs doesn't mean they'd also like to. In this case the "laundry list" serves as a way to match hires that are interested in the specific things the company works with.
- new_hackers 11y ago
  agreed, plus if you hire someone that already uses and likes your stack you don't get the constant whining about "if we were using Y it would be sooo much better"
- blakeyrat 11y ago
  Agreed. I've put out a lot of fires in badly-written Ruby code, and at least 2 in badly-written Python code, but I couldn't stand working 8 hours a day with either of those languages. So while my knowing them is definitely valuable, I need some way to convey, "hey I know Ruby, but no I don't like Ruby and I wouldn't accept a position that was primarily Ruby." ("Favorite" isn't a good word for that, but that's the intent I'm needing to convey.)
saint_fiasco 11y ago
Obviously it depends on the job, but if you can't be bothered to make the recruiter's job easy and not make them think, you probably won't be motivated to make customers' life easy either.
- tomjen3 11y ago
  The real question is why did you end up in a pile of 250 resumes in the first place. Why didn't you stand out enough that you can go around this queue?
hluska 11y ago
Have you ever had to sift through 250 resumes to narrow them down to a shortlist of five?? If you haven't, it is very very hard. You simply don't have time to dive deep, figure out a person's unique value, and determine whether they could be a good fit. Therefore, usability becomes very important. The candidates who give a recruiter the information he/she needs in the shortest amount of time possible will rise to the top. Reviewing resumes is mind numbing work predicated on an already broken model. That's by there is so much opportunity in recruiting and why we are starting to see startups that are changing the recruiting industry. Since the skill involved in crafting the perfect resume is a poor predictor of the skill involved in writing software, we are seeing initial screenings based more on job tasks.
thenipper 11y ago
Internal recruiters(which is what I'm talking about) often times are stuck between a variety of competing interests in the company. Being sympathetic to this is only going to help you land a position. Recruiting in general is a more complex issue then just fitting a square plug into a square hole. This complexity combined with the internal politics that are at any company make for a stressed person. Regarding the technologies other folks answered this already. If you have a candidate that can hit the group running rather then having to get up to speed that can be very valuable. I'd imagine even more so due with a startup where you have a limited runway and a need for agility.
Spooky23 11y ago
Too much prose generally hurts you, because words mean things. Example: What inference should I draw when you say "I know X, Y and Z, but my favorite is Z"? I need someone who is good at X. Q: Should I call you? A: I have enough drama, next. Example: You point out that you're reading Donald Trump's autobiography. I'm a member of one of the many tribes the Donald has a problem with. Q: Will I associate you with him? A: Probably. Example: You give me three emails. I need to contact you. Q: Which one should I pick? A: "None of the Above"

by cpt1138 11y ago

coldtea 11y ago

>Sorry this reply screams "I don't care, I'm tired, I'm stressed, don't make me think." Well, if you're expecting anything else from a recruiter being send your resume you'll be in for a hard surprise. The inverse is "I couldn't put in the time to make my CV tidy and intuitive, but you'll have to soldier thru it, because I have the mistaken opinion that I'm a unique snowflake and you don't get hundreds of them". In fact, "don't make me think" is a GREAT advice for anything you want others to read/try/adopt/buy. http://www.amazon.com/Dont-Make-Me-Think-Usability/dp/0321344758 http://www.amazon.com/Dont-Make-Me-Think-Usability/dp/032134... >Since my impression is that a good developer can deal with any situation necessary, I never understood the laundry list of technologies way of fitting a candidate to a "good hire." Even if a good C++ game developer could switch to Javascript front-end development if needed (to give an extreme example), the time it takes to have them familiar with the relevant stack is better spent hiring someone already familiar. And, it's kind of obvious -- both can be just as good. It's just the second is also ready to hit the ground running on the stack a company uses. And, of course, just because someone "can deal with any situation necessary" doesn't mean they'd like to. Some programmers like to program in X or Y languages (or language families), others like building Z or K kind of programs. Just because someone could switch from Haskell to Ruby or from scientific programming to CRUDs doesn't mean they'd also like to. In this case the "laundry list" serves as a way to match hires that are interested in the specific things the company works with.

new_hackers 11y ago
agreed, plus if you hire someone that already uses and likes your stack you don't get the constant whining about "if we were using Y it would be sooo much better"
blakeyrat 11y ago
Agreed. I've put out a lot of fires in badly-written Ruby code, and at least 2 in badly-written Python code, but I couldn't stand working 8 hours a day with either of those languages. So while my knowing them is definitely valuable, I need some way to convey, "hey I know Ruby, but no I don't like Ruby and I wouldn't accept a position that was primarily Ruby." ("Favorite" isn't a good word for that, but that's the intent I'm needing to convey.)

saint_fiasco 11y ago

Obviously it depends on the job, but if you can't be bothered to make the recruiter's job easy and not make them think, you probably won't be motivated to make customers' life easy either.

tomjen3 11y ago
The real question is why did you end up in a pile of 250 resumes in the first place. Why didn't you stand out enough that you can go around this queue?

hluska 11y ago

Have you ever had to sift through 250 resumes to narrow them down to a shortlist of five?? If you haven't, it is very very hard. You simply don't have time to dive deep, figure out a person's unique value, and determine whether they could be a good fit. Therefore, usability becomes very important. The candidates who give a recruiter the information he/she needs in the shortest amount of time possible will rise to the top. Reviewing resumes is mind numbing work predicated on an already broken model. That's by there is so much opportunity in recruiting and why we are starting to see startups that are changing the recruiting industry. Since the skill involved in crafting the perfect resume is a poor predictor of the skill involved in writing software, we are seeing initial screenings based more on job tasks.

thenipper 11y ago

Internal recruiters(which is what I'm talking about) often times are stuck between a variety of competing interests in the company. Being sympathetic to this is only going to help you land a position. Recruiting in general is a more complex issue then just fitting a square plug into a square hole. This complexity combined with the internal politics that are at any company make for a stressed person. Regarding the technologies other folks answered this already. If you have a candidate that can hit the group running rather then having to get up to speed that can be very valuable. I'd imagine even more so due with a startup where you have a limited runway and a need for agility.

Spooky23 11y ago

Too much prose generally hurts you, because words mean things. Example: What inference should I draw when you say "I know X, Y and Z, but my favorite is Z"? I need someone who is good at X. Q: Should I call you? A: I have enough drama, next. Example: You point out that you're reading Donald Trump's autobiography. I'm a member of one of the many tribes the Donald has a problem with. Q: Will I associate you with him? A: Probably. Example: You give me three emails. I need to contact you. Q: Which one should I pick? A: "None of the Above"