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Reading the twitter comments at https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/694802955170553861 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/694802955170553861 is super depressin

by dsp1234 11y ago

Reading the twitter comments at https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/694802955170553861 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/694802955170553861 is super depressing. The mob cheering for blood. It's a bad review of an event that was poorly executed. Turning around and cancelling a preorder is just childish. I honestly hadn't realized that he had such thin skin.

JumpCrisscross 11y ago
My worry, seeing this, is in what he might feel entitled to do to a current owner who pisses him off.
- forthefuture 11y ago
  He can't do illegal things. It's perfectly within his rights to deny someone service beforehand.
  - dsp1234 11y ago
    Since Tesla vehicles have a lot of functionality that is basically SaaS (firmware updates, functionality updates, remote start/unlock via application, etc), if Tesla were to say "You gave us a bad review, we're not going to provide you any updates to your vehicle and you are not allowed to use any of our authorized service centers for repairs", what law would they be breaking?
    - tamana 11y ago
      Check your contract. When you buy a Tesla, what OTAs are you buying?
      - marssaxman 11y ago
        ...and this is why I will never buy a Tesla, no matter how cool they might be.
fennecfoxen 11y ago
I'd like to hope that if I'd somehow ended up in a similar situation, I'd have expedited this guy's Tesla order out of spite, not cancelled it.
- samastur 11y ago
  That's the spirit. Award asshole customers at the expense of those who can wait. </sarcasm>
  - Someone1234 11y ago
    Calling him an "asshole" seems unfair. He had a legitimate grievance (2 hour delayed start, without apology) that is factually true (the whole event was streamed, we KNOW it started 2 hours later than scheduled). If Musk has just said "sorry for the delay" at the start of the event, all of this could have been avoided. But no, no apology, and then petty revenge when someone complains about it.
- usaphp 11y ago
  I completely disagree. That would give other people a reason to be rude and receive their order faster. What Musk did will now make people think before being rude I guess.
  - pc86 11y ago
    When a child throws a temper tantrum you don't give them what they want. You also don't slap them or lock them in the closet. You ignore them, which is what Tesla should have done.
varjag 11y ago
It's petty revenge and tantrums that give our industry leaders a human dimension.
- dhimes 11y ago
  I almost spit out my coffee laughing at this!
taf2 11y ago
I would do exactly the samething. When pre-releasing an early product which is what tesla is doing with model X - it's looking for people they can trust to provide not just a great car but really the first set of product testers. It's the best way to build a new product. Find devoted customers and work with them to build a great product for them. Now if one of those customers decides to turn this into negative press, they need to be fired because they are not the customer that will make such a process work. Buying a model X at this stage is more like paying to get the car early and be a QA team member. The perk, is you get to play with the new and shiny first. Keep in mind at this stage the guy got his 5k refund and just lost his place in line. A real first world crisis...
- ghaff 11y ago
  Wow. Just wow. Now a $100K+ car is just a buggy beta product--because Elon Musk? And, if they didn't get that memo, fire them as customers?
  - taf2 11y ago
    No, but you can be selective about which customers and this was not a 100k purchase this was a 5k deposit... Really though my point is nothing to do with telsa. My point was you need to fire customers sometimes and it's a difficult balance. In pre release phase of a product it is an acceptable approach.
    - ghaff 11y ago
      Not to pick on you, but it looks as if I can go to Tesla's website, fill out a short form to reserve a Model X, and click on a Visa button to give them a $5K deposit. I don't see anything on there about being a product tester or working with Tesla to build a great product or being fired as a customer if I don't keep my mouth shut about my experiences. Of course a beta program is a different situation. When I've been a beta tester for various products, I expect them to be buggy (and typically have had to sign NDAs or at least have an implicit agreement not to talk publicly about my experiences).
ghaff 11y ago
Tesla seems to have a pretty well-established track record in which criticism is dealt with by going full-on attack mode. One can argue about how fair or unfair the criticism was in individual cases--running out of juice, ruining batteries by letting them de-charge, etc--and those cases have been debated at great length with nothing to be gained by rehashing them. Nonetheless, for better or worse, more sane PR would typically acknowledge any valid criticisms/lack of education/etc. and move on. Tesla's mode is to essentially universally go on the offensive. [EDIT: To just add, as someone who is not "in" PR but deals with PR in various ways regularly, sometimes an aggressive response is indeed called for. But it shouldn't be the default response.]
rplnt 11y ago
> I honestly hadn't realized that he had such thin skin. Just few weeks back there was this Blue Origin pissing contest about nothing.
gvb 11y ago
The skin has always been thin. This is the same company that had a three-year (losing) libel battle with Top Gear for a bad review. http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/mar/05/top-gear-tesla-jeremy-clarkson http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/mar/05/top-gear-tesla-...
- aedron 11y ago
  Don't forget the whole debacle with Tesla's original founder Martin Eberhart. After he was fired, the first edition Tesla he was entitled to was given to a C level executive instead. Then the car they gave him instead was somehow badly damaged during delivery. See a pattern?
- beeboop 11y ago
  "Bad review" is misleading. They sued because they outright lied in the review (saying the battery died when it did not). Not really any different from NBC rigging the Chevrolet truck explosion back in the 90s, in which NBC lost tons of credibility and was sued by GM for libel (and settled for $1mm). Both were journalistic bullshit, but everyone loves Jeremy too much to call him on it.
  - gvb 11y ago
    a) They implied it ran out of battery, they did not actually say it was out of battery: Tesla complained about a passage of Clarkson's commentary in which he said: "Although Tesla say it will do 200 miles, we worked out that on our track it would run out after just 55 miles and if it does run out, it is not a quick job to charge it up again." Clarkson and others are then shown pushing the Roadster into the Top Gear hangar and recharging it. Note that he says "worked it out", indicating calculations. They then reinforced the viewer's natural misconception by pushing the car (unnecessarily) to the charger. b) Appeal court judge Lord Justice Moore-Bick ruled that the programme did not libel Tesla. c) Everybody except Tesla knows Top Gear is an entertainment show that uses cars as props, just like Mork and Mindy was an entertainment show poking fun of human foibles, not a show about aliens.
    - 11y ago

by dsp1234 11y ago

JumpCrisscross 11y ago

My worry, seeing this, is in what he might feel entitled to do to a current owner who pisses him off.

forthefuture 11y ago
He can't do illegal things. It's perfectly within his rights to deny someone service beforehand.
- dsp1234 11y ago
  Since Tesla vehicles have a lot of functionality that is basically SaaS (firmware updates, functionality updates, remote start/unlock via application, etc), if Tesla were to say "You gave us a bad review, we're not going to provide you any updates to your vehicle and you are not allowed to use any of our authorized service centers for repairs", what law would they be breaking?
  - tamana 11y ago
    Check your contract. When you buy a Tesla, what OTAs are you buying?
    - marssaxman 11y ago
      ...and this is why I will never buy a Tesla, no matter how cool they might be.

fennecfoxen 11y ago

I'd like to hope that if I'd somehow ended up in a similar situation, I'd have expedited this guy's Tesla order out of spite, not cancelled it.

samastur 11y ago
That's the spirit. Award asshole customers at the expense of those who can wait. </sarcasm>
- Someone1234 11y ago
  Calling him an "asshole" seems unfair. He had a legitimate grievance (2 hour delayed start, without apology) that is factually true (the whole event was streamed, we KNOW it started 2 hours later than scheduled). If Musk has just said "sorry for the delay" at the start of the event, all of this could have been avoided. But no, no apology, and then petty revenge when someone complains about it.
usaphp 11y ago
I completely disagree. That would give other people a reason to be rude and receive their order faster. What Musk did will now make people think before being rude I guess.
- pc86 11y ago
  When a child throws a temper tantrum you don't give them what they want. You also don't slap them or lock them in the closet. You ignore them, which is what Tesla should have done.

varjag 11y ago

It's petty revenge and tantrums that give our industry leaders a human dimension.

dhimes 11y ago
I almost spit out my coffee laughing at this!

taf2 11y ago

I would do exactly the samething. When pre-releasing an early product which is what tesla is doing with model X - it's looking for people they can trust to provide not just a great car but really the first set of product testers. It's the best way to build a new product. Find devoted customers and work with them to build a great product for them. Now if one of those customers decides to turn this into negative press, they need to be fired because they are not the customer that will make such a process work. Buying a model X at this stage is more like paying to get the car early and be a QA team member. The perk, is you get to play with the new and shiny first. Keep in mind at this stage the guy got his 5k refund and just lost his place in line. A real first world crisis...

ghaff 11y ago
Wow. Just wow. Now a $100K+ car is just a buggy beta product--because Elon Musk? And, if they didn't get that memo, fire them as customers?
- taf2 11y ago
  No, but you can be selective about which customers and this was not a 100k purchase this was a 5k deposit... Really though my point is nothing to do with telsa. My point was you need to fire customers sometimes and it's a difficult balance. In pre release phase of a product it is an acceptable approach.
  - ghaff 11y ago
    Not to pick on you, but it looks as if I can go to Tesla's website, fill out a short form to reserve a Model X, and click on a Visa button to give them a $5K deposit. I don't see anything on there about being a product tester or working with Tesla to build a great product or being fired as a customer if I don't keep my mouth shut about my experiences. Of course a beta program is a different situation. When I've been a beta tester for various products, I expect them to be buggy (and typically have had to sign NDAs or at least have an implicit agreement not to talk publicly about my experiences).

ghaff 11y ago

Tesla seems to have a pretty well-established track record in which criticism is dealt with by going full-on attack mode. One can argue about how fair or unfair the criticism was in individual cases--running out of juice, ruining batteries by letting them de-charge, etc--and those cases have been debated at great length with nothing to be gained by rehashing them. Nonetheless, for better or worse, more sane PR would typically acknowledge any valid criticisms/lack of education/etc. and move on. Tesla's mode is to essentially universally go on the offensive. [EDIT: To just add, as someone who is not "in" PR but deals with PR in various ways regularly, sometimes an aggressive response is indeed called for. But it shouldn't be the default response.]

rplnt 11y ago

> I honestly hadn't realized that he had such thin skin. Just few weeks back there was this Blue Origin pissing contest about nothing.

gvb 11y ago

The skin has always been thin. This is the same company that had a three-year (losing) libel battle with Top Gear for a bad review. http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/mar/05/top-gear-tesla-jeremy-clarkson http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/mar/05/top-gear-tesla-...

aedron 11y ago
Don't forget the whole debacle with Tesla's original founder Martin Eberhart. After he was fired, the first edition Tesla he was entitled to was given to a C level executive instead. Then the car they gave him instead was somehow badly damaged during delivery. See a pattern?
beeboop 11y ago
"Bad review" is misleading. They sued because they outright lied in the review (saying the battery died when it did not). Not really any different from NBC rigging the Chevrolet truck explosion back in the 90s, in which NBC lost tons of credibility and was sued by GM for libel (and settled for $1mm). Both were journalistic bullshit, but everyone loves Jeremy too much to call him on it.
- gvb 11y ago
  a) They implied it ran out of battery, they did not actually say it was out of battery: Tesla complained about a passage of Clarkson's commentary in which he said: "Although Tesla say it will do 200 miles, we worked out that on our track it would run out after just 55 miles and if it does run out, it is not a quick job to charge it up again." Clarkson and others are then shown pushing the Roadster into the Top Gear hangar and recharging it. Note that he says "worked it out", indicating calculations. They then reinforced the viewer's natural misconception by pushing the car (unnecessarily) to the charger. b) Appeal court judge Lord Justice Moore-Bick ruled that the programme did not libel Tesla. c) Everybody except Tesla knows Top Gear is an entertainment show that uses cars as props, just like Mork and Mindy was an entertainment show poking fun of human foibles, not a show about aliens.
  - 11y ago