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Ask HN: Which industry sector should I target?
Hi, I am curious if anyone could give any suggestions as to an appropriate sector
within the software development industry given my interests.
My interests within the field is not what one would call
narrow. Primarily though, I have a fondness for programming
language theory, compilers, parsing and writing my own DSLs so
that I can make powerful compile-time assertions regarding my
code as well as generate tests automatically from the DSL itself.
My StackOverflow cv has an additional set of tasks that pertain
to my interests, http://stackoverflow.com/cv/filipallberg.
Regarding my primary interests, the only relevant "thing" I have
come up with is web-scraping, but I find it is a dull task as it
is a trivial matter to me.
Machine vision is also something that I think a lot about,
however most of my ideas are consumer-facing utilities and not
something to build a business around. If I get a good idea I'd be
willing to go into business myself.
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- boothead 11y agoWhereabouts are you? If you're interested in PLT, DSLs and compilers, there are some small enclaves in finance that might interest you. edit spelling
- S4M 11y agoWhat small enclaves in finance are you talking about? I know that banks have small scripting languages that enable semi-technical users to describe a derivative product ("if condition1 then payoff1 etc.") but those are old and I doubt they are actively maintained and that banks are hiring people for that.
- boothead 11y agoI was talking about banks. I work for one where we build stuff on top of essentially this paper: http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/um/people/simonpj/Papers/financial-contracts/contracts-icfp.pdf http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/um/people/simonpj/Papers... We're even hiring: https://donsbot.wordpress.com/2016/01/18/haskell-developer-roles-at-standard-chartered-london-singapore/ https://donsbot.wordpress.com/2016/01/18/haskell-developer-r...
- mseebach 11y agoWhat do you want to optimise around? Stable job, 9-17, decent salary? Lost of money, caution to the wind? Be something [for one or more of several values of 'something'] to a lot of people? Fiddle with deeply intellectual CS problems, shielded from pedestrian worries about revenue and users? I personally enjoy the knowledge of having solved a real (business) problem for real people, and being appreciated both financially and personally for this, even when the actual tech going into this isn't very complicated, and especially, doesn't tick off a lot of "hip" boxes. I have also met good people who do not thrive in these circumstances, so it's hard to give generic advice as to what might make you happy.
- throwawayyawa 11y agoI also enjoy this, but not for my current employer (for several reasons I don't feel like going into). How do you do it, as a consultant or as a 9-5 job? Any advice on getting started as someone who graduated 2014?
- mseebach 11y agoI do it as an employee of a company, but it's a pretty sweet fit for consultants/freelancers (I used to be one). I don't have any particular advice, beyond the generic stuff: You'll need a network of people who might (know someone who might) want to pay you to help them achieve business outcomes. Remember that you're selling business results, make sure every line on your invoice is part of a narrative that makes (or reduces risk of losing) money for the business.
- ZeroFries 11y agoIs it possible to go the "work on deeply intellectual problems while shielded from pedestrian worries about revenue and users" route without academia? I suppose just do it on the side until you invent something which is valuable to industry.
- mseebach 11y agoI know of departments in some of the investment banks that are essentially CS R&D. There are some hedge funds (HFT and otherwise) that are basically playgrounds for PhD. Of course, in both cases, your work is ultimately directed by revenue, the shield I'm talking about is more against the tight, client/user responsive iterative process of most modern software development which can make it difficult to carve out the time and space to work on something deeper. Also, I'm not convinced academia is much of a panacea here: I hear there is a nontrivial number of years of pretty severe drudgery before you arrive in the sort of position with a lot of freedom to work on whatever you like.
- danieltillett 11y agoI want to suggest something that I would not normally suggest which is you should pair up with a non-technical founder. What you want to be looking for is someone with deep business experience (15+ years) in a narrow business field. Team up with them and work towards creating something amazing, but tightly focused.
- pedrodelfino 11y agoHave a look at the legal industry. There are quite a few legal tech startups by now. Even web-scraping applications are rare in legal. The sector is famous for being profitable (high margins), rusty and inefficient.
- philodendron 11y agoHaving worked at a fintech startup specializing in decision systems for regulatory compliance, I second this. There are interesting theoretical aspects stemming from the fact that domain is very tricky to model. * There is considerable structural sharing inside finance regulations, but it is not hierarchical * Regulations may be changed at any time, and these changes may be future-dated or back-dated * Users insist on arbitrarily complex exceptions and overrides * Nontechnical users (particularly legal) will insist on being able to vet and introspect In my experience, anyone can do this badly, but to make it scalable and robust requires subtlety and a good understanding of formal logic, ontology and DSL design. It's a good fit for FP. Oh, and there's plenty of room for machine learning: Automated discovery, natural language processing, noncompliance detection, etc. The problem of turning regulations into a expert system that is robust against future changes has not been solved, and there's demand for such systems from even the most sophisticated financial companies, even though everyone expects they'd be able to build such systems in-house.
- tmaly 11y agoI second that. regulatory compliance needs some better solutions
- harperlee 11y agoThat's interesting, may I ask which startup is that? Is it still alive?
- philodendron 11y agoStill alive, last I heard! Droit Financial Technologies http://www.droitfintech.com http://www.droitfintech.com
- lmm 11y agoI've worked 5-6 programming jobs in 5-6 different industries. Honestly the job is pretty similar in any industry. I'd recommend working for whoever pays best and/or a team you get on with.
- sklogic 11y agoYMMV. A cognitive load and inherent complexity can vary dramatically between industries. Compare web frontend development with, say, a mission critical CPU design.
- sanderjd 11y agoI'm always curious when I see comments like this: have you done both things professionally at scale, or are you guessing based on how things seem to you from the outside?
- sklogic 11y agoI have to admit that I did not do any web development, but I have a pretty good idea of what kind of complexity and challenges it does involve. I also know about it from interaction with the frontend developers themselves and from toying around it. I know what kind of tools are available, I know how dead easy debugging is. There is nothing nearly comparable in complexity with a hardware design.
- aeharding 11y agoIt seems like you're being a little biased. Writing the architecture for a new Intel CPU is much more difficult than writing a calculator on an FPGA or designing a circuit board. Similarly, designing and maintaining the UX of Amazon.com is a lot more difficult than a personal website. Is Physics 'harder' than Psychology just because it's 'more hardcore' or 'more pure'? Apples to oranges. You cannot really make comparisons like that.
- sklogic 11y ago
- yitchelle 11y agoI don't have any specific industry for you to get into, but I have a suggestion on how you might be able to find it. Attend as many trade shows as you can and talk to the folks to get an idea of what they are doing, although some of them may be difficult to get to due distance, cost, invites etc. For example, Embedded World in Nürnberg, Germany provides a good cross section of industry that has embedded engineering involvement in it. There will be a similar one for telecommunications, Automotive etc. Good luck on searching for your calling.
- sklogic 11y agoI'm very much into DSLs, and I've been building and using them extensively throughout a very wide spectrum: database engines, CADs, hardware design and verification, compilers, device drivers, HPC (GPGPU).
- j0rd 11y agoIf you like web-scraping, and you're not an idiot, you immediately have an information advantage for anything you decide to do. Do not underestimate this advantage. I would suggest you leverage your interest in web-scraping and use it to customers in what ever niche you believe you can sell them something. Collect your "beta" users through web-scraping, figure out a way to reach them at scale. Build/sell a product they want (you can leverage your information advantage to figure out what this is) This is personally what I do and have created/worked on many bootstrapped companies over my career. Niche for me is fairly irrelevant, as long as I have a pool of interested customers ahead of time. I primarily use my information advantage to figure these out. The additional skills you will need is: * learn to think as a "user/customer" * minor copy-writing skills (or at least understand what shitty copy is and how to improve it) * UX * Data mining & Analytics, Analytics, Analytics * A/B Testing, Iterations, Incremental Improvements (see point above) * Hypothesis Driven Development (https://www.thoughtworks.com/insights/blog/how-implement-hypothesis-driven-development https://www.thoughtworks.com/insights/blog/how-implement-hyp...) My one suggestion is to avoid any projects which do not have a clear monetization strategy. If you're following my blue-print companies that don't make money from day will only incur costs as you reach your pool of customers at scale.
- deskamess 11y agoCan you provide an example or two of a project that involved web scraping? (without divulging client info) I can see how it could be used for price scraping in web retail, but am drawing a blank in other industries.
- TheLogothete 11y agoText analytics, for one.
- mtmail 11y agoAddress parsing from a large web corpus https://github.com/openvenues/libpostal https://github.com/openvenues/libpostal The author uses http://commoncrawl.org/ http://commoncrawl.org/ data, 250TB/3.6b URL and a 100 machine cluster of 8-core machines.
- bjwbell 11y agoLearn the art of writing gpu compilers. Software defined radio is another. If you find web-scraping dull don't pursue it. Life is short.
- sharemywin 11y agoWhich one are you talking about: Damn Small Linux, a very small Linux distribution Definitive software library Domain-specific language, a computer language designed for a specific problem domain
- shade23 11y agoDSL= Domain Specific Languages
- sharemywin 11y agosorry I left the non-technical terms in there I didn't mean to piss everybody off. Thanks for answering.
- jndsn402 11y agoBest of luck to you, I am not in the industry and cannot recommend from that perspective. As a consumer though, augmented reality ( eg Hololens and Magic Leap) seems like it is about to become very big, and probably utilizes machine vision. Can you recommend some resources for learning about web scraping?
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- sharemywin 11y agoyou should look at marketplaces. possibly even ones run by crypto currencies. There are alot of ways to configure a marketplace and it would be nice to abstract that from CRUD operations and such.
- drelihan 11y agoyou're right, web scraping is dull ( it was a big, but important part of my job for a number of years ). The interesting, and non-trivial, part comes on how to use the data you have scraped.
- cableshaft 11y agoI'd just suggest looking into something up and coming that interests you, and start learning whatever you can about that. Industries that will have specific uses for machine-vision: autonomous driving cars, drones, robotics, augmented reality, internet of things Others: crypto-currencies (specifically digital ledgers/blockchains), virtual reality, commercial space exploration, online education, voice recognition, (more as I think of them) Tech that's already big and probably getting bigger: streaming video, instant stock trading based on algorithms, Certainly one of those must be interesting to you. They're all pretty interesting to me.
- lafay 11y agoThe technology to cost-effectively store massive amounts of raw metrics / data and quickly derive insight from it is still a relatively recent development, and so far we've seen turn-key tools to leverage that in just a few areas: 1. Where developers themselves are the likely product users (think Google Analytics, New Relic, Optimizely, Appdynamics) 2. Where there is a direct and immediate connection to $$$ (finance / quant stuff) 3. Generic data science platforms (Cloudera, Hortonworks, Databricks) I think there is still tons of opportunity for industry-specific turn-key data science tools. Especially for verticals where there is a low coincidence of skilled developers with industry domain expertise.
- HFTGuru 11y agoIf you are interested in huge bonuses up to 400k-1M a year for being a developer, then I suggest to you high frequency trading development. The problem is you'll have to move close to an exchange, but the finance industry rewards you handsomely and takes care of it's employees.
- al2o3cr 11y agoIMO your question isn't really answerable: you've listed tools and techniques you enjoy but "sectors" in the industry are primarily about producing results using those. A similar realspace question would be, "I really enjoy building cantilevers and arches. What city should I look for construction work in?" My personal recommendation would be to find people who are doing interesting things and talking about it in public - blog posts, conference talks, etc etc and reach out to them.
- scardine 11y agoYou can do pretty well as a Google for Work reseller. I can make 1 USD per account per month, at 10k accounts it is a pretty good source of passive income.
- leksak 11y agoInteresting proposition for a static income. I'll look into it