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I spent my teenage years building fan sites and social networking sites for games. I made enough money to pay off college, get a nice apartment by the water and

I spent my teenage years building fan sites and social networking sites for games. I made enough money to pay off college, get a nice apartment by the water and have a couple k leftover come graduation. I was curious why I wasn't getting a lot of hits on my resume, so I talked to a recruiter at a networking event who had seen my application (for one of the "unicorns") and she said they where uncomfortable with how entrepreneurial it looked. I removed the sections from my resume, removed all of my contract work too - only listed the internships and found some other grads (that got jobs) resumes to copy the language style. Pretty much instantly my resume was getting me double or triple the interviews. Bummer too, because I worked my ass off and always had the false impression that employers would like that. Sometimes its the gap between marketing (how they want the company to appear) and HR I think. Marketing wants innovators, HR wants workhorses that move in a strait line and don't try new things.

rorykoehler 11y ago
Interesting. Perhaps something I can learn from. What kind of companies have you worked for (large corps / startups / SMEs?) and what kind of work do you do for them (any specialisations)? How do these experiences contrast to your pre-employment/self-employment experiences?
- CryoLogic 11y ago
  I do full-stack development. Front-end, back-end, some server admin, DB, UX, SEO, etc. I worked at a F500 building tools to visualize big data and had a great time. Learned a lot and had a lot of freedom. Afterwards, a VC funded startup - didn't really fit in, most of my co-workers where hardcore academics and it had a lot of micromanaging. Also did some contract gigs, subcontracting for another company which could be good, bad or neutral (all depends on the client). Self-employement is awesome, because you get to explore a ton of new things. You get to learn about SEO, business models, cutting costs to increase profits, increasing conversions, brand image, UX, etc. You also get to know your audience really well. In my case, the biggest downside is I could never build a strong network because most of my revenue was coming from ads and donations and the target audience was younger. It's easier to network when you are out and about, and always working with people who have their own networks. I'd love to start a company (on a bigger scale) some day, when I have a stronger network, a larger skillset, and some capital so I can make sure I am feeding myself every week :)
  - julian88888888 11y ago
    How did user testing go for the UX portion of your work?
bcjordan 11y ago
It might be a question of commitment signaling. Some reviewers might ding candidates that seem to have a ton of work going on outside of work. Maybe even more so if they see a candidate hasn't held a job > a certain # of years before. Not sure if HR thinks that deeply during resume review, though. If you're not getting past that screen it's probably just match-the-buzzwords-listed-in-posting density—more "filler" words (started awesome website, did amazing things) means less % matching words
tajen 11y ago
Young engineer, I tried being entrepreneurial. I confirm team leads don't like it, even if the company displays the marketing you describe. Better become more skilled in your field than just overly motivated. It's sad that we only understand that after a few years in the job.
lentil_soup 11y ago
Is HR the first line of contact when applying in most companies? Where I work I think we (the developers) get all the resumes that come in and decide to decline or continue the process, HR only handles the logistics
shiftb 11y ago
That's odd. We get excited when we see an entrepreneurial profile like yours. We have several developers who want to start companies and actually try to help them along that path. The benefit to a motivated engineer is you can give them problems to solve instead of specs. The outcome or results can be less predictable but can also be much more effective.
- rorykoehler 11y ago
  How do you feel about the potential for high turnover with entrepreneurial types, as it seems the general consensus is they will inevitably leave to start their own thing? How long do you expect someone to work for you before hiring them, getting them up to speed with your system, and integrating them into the company is a worthwhile investment?
  - golergka 11y ago
    When I get asked this in an interview, I always answer the same way: yes, I will probably go to the next gig faster than other employees. But I will get up to speed faster, and I will produce more output for the business itself in the time I'll spend in your company.
    - rorykoehler 11y ago
      This is the reality but my question was more about perception vs reality.
      - deleted 11y ago
        [deleted]
    - _0ffh 11y ago
      When you leave, much of your knowledge about the thing you helped to build will leave with you. They want that to stick around.
      - 11y ago
golergka 11y ago
May be you should've applied to different companies with different values?
yareally 11y ago
I had a similar background--worked my way through school doing small to medium size freelance projects. Much of my freelance work was contracting for one company (where I was mentored by one the senior developers) and few startups, so it wasn't quite as bad as what you experienced. Some employers think you're not "office material" if you happened to be a hard-working, independent worker that managed to pay their way through school while learning on the job. I assume I probably dodged a bullet working at any of those places, if that's the way they hire. After graduation, I had a few tell companies me that my work during school as sort of a "black mark" and I think it's sort of humorous looking back at it now. Currently, I'm the technical lead for my dev team and the contract work I did while in school is probably the best experience I had for the work I do now. Gave me a broad range of experience that reinforced the theory and concepts I was learning while in school.

rorykoehler 11y ago

Interesting. Perhaps something I can learn from. What kind of companies have you worked for (large corps / startups / SMEs?) and what kind of work do you do for them (any specialisations)? How do these experiences contrast to your pre-employment/self-employment experiences?

CryoLogic 11y ago
I do full-stack development. Front-end, back-end, some server admin, DB, UX, SEO, etc. I worked at a F500 building tools to visualize big data and had a great time. Learned a lot and had a lot of freedom. Afterwards, a VC funded startup - didn't really fit in, most of my co-workers where hardcore academics and it had a lot of micromanaging. Also did some contract gigs, subcontracting for another company which could be good, bad or neutral (all depends on the client). Self-employement is awesome, because you get to explore a ton of new things. You get to learn about SEO, business models, cutting costs to increase profits, increasing conversions, brand image, UX, etc. You also get to know your audience really well. In my case, the biggest downside is I could never build a strong network because most of my revenue was coming from ads and donations and the target audience was younger. It's easier to network when you are out and about, and always working with people who have their own networks. I'd love to start a company (on a bigger scale) some day, when I have a stronger network, a larger skillset, and some capital so I can make sure I am feeding myself every week :)
- julian88888888 11y ago
  How did user testing go for the UX portion of your work?

bcjordan 11y ago

It might be a question of commitment signaling. Some reviewers might ding candidates that seem to have a ton of work going on outside of work. Maybe even more so if they see a candidate hasn't held a job > a certain # of years before. Not sure if HR thinks that deeply during resume review, though. If you're not getting past that screen it's probably just match-the-buzzwords-listed-in-posting density—more "filler" words (started awesome website, did amazing things) means less % matching words

tajen 11y ago

Young engineer, I tried being entrepreneurial. I confirm team leads don't like it, even if the company displays the marketing you describe. Better become more skilled in your field than just overly motivated. It's sad that we only understand that after a few years in the job.

lentil_soup 11y ago

Is HR the first line of contact when applying in most companies? Where I work I think we (the developers) get all the resumes that come in and decide to decline or continue the process, HR only handles the logistics

shiftb 11y ago

That's odd. We get excited when we see an entrepreneurial profile like yours. We have several developers who want to start companies and actually try to help them along that path. The benefit to a motivated engineer is you can give them problems to solve instead of specs. The outcome or results can be less predictable but can also be much more effective.

rorykoehler 11y ago
How do you feel about the potential for high turnover with entrepreneurial types, as it seems the general consensus is they will inevitably leave to start their own thing? How long do you expect someone to work for you before hiring them, getting them up to speed with your system, and integrating them into the company is a worthwhile investment?
- golergka 11y ago
  When I get asked this in an interview, I always answer the same way: yes, I will probably go to the next gig faster than other employees. But I will get up to speed faster, and I will produce more output for the business itself in the time I'll spend in your company.
  - rorykoehler 11y ago
    This is the reality but my question was more about perception vs reality.
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
  - _0ffh 11y ago
    When you leave, much of your knowledge about the thing you helped to build will leave with you. They want that to stick around.
    - 11y ago

golergka 11y ago

May be you should've applied to different companies with different values?

yareally 11y ago

I had a similar background--worked my way through school doing small to medium size freelance projects. Much of my freelance work was contracting for one company (where I was mentored by one the senior developers) and few startups, so it wasn't quite as bad as what you experienced. Some employers think you're not "office material" if you happened to be a hard-working, independent worker that managed to pay their way through school while learning on the job. I assume I probably dodged a bullet working at any of those places, if that's the way they hire. After graduation, I had a few tell companies me that my work during school as sort of a "black mark" and I think it's sort of humorous looking back at it now. Currently, I'm the technical lead for my dev team and the contract work I did while in school is probably the best experience I had for the work I do now. Gave me a broad range of experience that reinforced the theory and concepts I was learning while in school.