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I totally agree with you about Britain's obsession with academic qualifications at the expense of practical apprenticeships.

by Pitarou 11y ago

realusername 11y ago
While I agree with you (French guy living there now), It's even worse on the other side of the Channel.
- lucaspiller 11y ago
  Also take a look at Spain, where higher education is basically free (compared to the UK). In a lot of cases, jobs that don't need a degree are requiring candidates to have them, before they are even considered for the position. I like how things work in Eastern Europe, where education isn't expensive but you need to actually work hard and be good (and get kicked out if you aren't) to get a degree.
  - realusername 11y ago
    I don't really know for Spain, but the price of education is not always the whole picture. In France it's mostly free (or really close to free) but the culture regarding degrees is vastly different compared to the UK. For engineering for example, you have an official definition of engineer and if you don't have the official engineering degree, you will never be considered an engineer, whatever you do (even 10 years after graduation).
    - screwt 11y ago
      > if you don't have the official engineering degree, you will never be considered an engineer The same is true in the UK - apart from the fact that we overload the term 'engineer' to mean both 'someone who fixes things' and 'someone with a particular professional qualification (similar to a doctor or lawyer)'. Becoming a Chartered Engineer requires a relevant masters degree, some years of professional experience and then qualifying exams - which is similar to other professions such as medicine or law. And these professional qualifications exist for a reason - e.g. someone has to sign off on a new bridge project and say that it will be safe. I don't want that person to be someone who reckons they know what they're doing just because they've done it for 10 years. NB: There are good reasons why software is (and should, IMO) be considered differently to a field such as structural engineering. And indeed, very few software engineers bother trying to achieve chartership.
  - spdionis 11y ago
    > and get kicked out if you aren't Or pay...

I totally agree with you about Britain's obsession with academic qualifications at the expense of practical apprenticeships.

by Pitarou 11y ago

I totally agree with you about Britain's obsession with academic qualifications at the expense of practical apprenticeships.

realusername 11y ago

While I agree with you (French guy living there now), It's even worse on the other side of the Channel.

lucaspiller 11y ago
Also take a look at Spain, where higher education is basically free (compared to the UK). In a lot of cases, jobs that don't need a degree are requiring candidates to have them, before they are even considered for the position. I like how things work in Eastern Europe, where education isn't expensive but you need to actually work hard and be good (and get kicked out if you aren't) to get a degree.
- realusername 11y ago
  I don't really know for Spain, but the price of education is not always the whole picture. In France it's mostly free (or really close to free) but the culture regarding degrees is vastly different compared to the UK. For engineering for example, you have an official definition of engineer and if you don't have the official engineering degree, you will never be considered an engineer, whatever you do (even 10 years after graduation).
  - screwt 11y ago
    > if you don't have the official engineering degree, you will never be considered an engineer The same is true in the UK - apart from the fact that we overload the term 'engineer' to mean both 'someone who fixes things' and 'someone with a particular professional qualification (similar to a doctor or lawyer)'. Becoming a Chartered Engineer requires a relevant masters degree, some years of professional experience and then qualifying exams - which is similar to other professions such as medicine or law. And these professional qualifications exist for a reason - e.g. someone has to sign off on a new bridge project and say that it will be safe. I don't want that person to be someone who reckons they know what they're doing just because they've done it for 10 years. NB: There are good reasons why software is (and should, IMO) be considered differently to a field such as structural engineering. And indeed, very few software engineers bother trying to achieve chartership.
- spdionis 11y ago
  > and get kicked out if you aren't Or pay...