5 ms·

Where in the world are you that google.com's 301 takes over half a second ? It's under 100ms for me.

jrockway 11y ago
I don't get the parent's numbers either. I did: $ time (curl -L www.reddit.com > /dev/null 2>&1) real 0m0.410s user 0m0.040s sys 0m0.008s $ time (curl -L reddit.com > /dev/null 2>&1) real 0m0.389s user 0m0.036s sys 0m0.012s So for Reddit, I'm going to make the cost of the redirect 21 milliseconds.
- negus 11y ago
  you're calculating load time the wrong way - you should not do time check outside the process as you do calling 'time' as another process from shell. consider using curl profiling option next time
- derFunk 11y ago
  With `time` you also calculated the process time curl needs to evaluate the 30x response and the reissued http request to www.
  - Nemo157 11y ago
    Which is valid since this processing time will be included in whatever application the user is using to access the website.
    - derFunk 11y ago
      I'm aware I'm nitpicking and maybe too theoretical now, but the processing time would vary in whatever application the user is using.. I'm with negus here who basically means the same I guess. The generic danger here (regarding benchmarking) is that you're explicitly also benchmarking curl. In case curl/"the web client" would handle 30x redirects super inefficiently, these results could lead to wrong assumptions.
- wangman 11y ago
  This is because reddit.com and www.reddit.com gets you the http-versions, which both are redirected to https Try this: curl -sL https://{www.,}reddit.com https://{www.,}reddit.com -o\ /dev/null{,\ } -w "%{time_redirect}\n"
  - buzzdenver 11y ago
    Can I ask you to explain that "-o\ /dev/null{,\ }" magic ?
    - drostie 11y ago
      It's not magic -- it's some form of crude error. So first off what this does is, it expands to the expression: '-o /dev/null' '-o /dev/null ' Even if we remove the latter space by just using `{,}` instead of `{,\ }` curl still returns for me an error code 23 -- CURLE_WRITE_ERROR. curl seems to interpret `'-o /wtf'` as a command to write to the file ` /wtf`, so this only makes sense if you have a directory called ` ` in the folder you're running from. You can therefore do this correctly with: -o/dev/null{,} and that correctly writes the contents to /dev/null without issuing a curl write error.
      - wangman 11y ago
        Thanks, it sure looks less ugly with -o/dev/null{,} I couldn't find any other way to get curl to stay silent and still output redirect times. Hence the crude hack. (Obviously my bash and curl versions had no problem with the spaces or I wouldn't have posted it)
        d0ugie 11y ago
        Using the curl'ing tips up this branch of comments I programmed a highly sophisticated script and dropped it on github. :) https://github.com/dougsimmons/301debate https://github.com/dougsimmons/301debate
        11y ago
- jjoonathan 11y ago
  I cleared Firefox's cache, opened the waterfall diagram, and looked at the time between when I hit enter (assuming that's 0ms) and the time when the request for the www.* address went out. I was planning to subtract off DNS time if necessary but in all cases it hit the cache and contributed 0ms. I didn't have wireshark open so I don't really know what happened with google. It surprised me too. Maybe something had to be re-transmitted? Now it seems to take 90-100ms. Perhaps I should have done best-of-three, but my point wasn't about precise numbers, it was about orders of magnitude, and "tens to hundreds of ms" is definitely more in line with what I expected than "a few us".
elithrar 11y ago
In most cases it should stay low too: your browser should retain a keep-alive to the web server, so you're not throwing away the connection. Future requests will auto-resolve due to caching of the 301.
manigandham 11y ago
There are plenty of places in the world where internet latency is a big issue, not to mention mobile networks everywhere. There's no reason to add a roundtrip unless absolutely necessary.
lukeschlather 11y ago
Mediocre Wifi can easily add seconds of latency.

I don't get the parent's numbers either. I did: $ time (curl -L www.reddit.com > /dev/null 2>&1) real 0m0.410s user 0m0.040s sys 0m0.008s $ time (curl -L reddit.com > /dev/null 2>&1) real 0m0.389s user 0m0.036s sys 0m0.012s So for Reddit, I'm going to make the cost of the redirect 21 milliseconds.

negus 11y ago
you're calculating load time the wrong way - you should not do time check outside the process as you do calling 'time' as another process from shell. consider using curl profiling option next time
derFunk 11y ago
With `time` you also calculated the process time curl needs to evaluate the 30x response and the reissued http request to www.
- Nemo157 11y ago
  Which is valid since this processing time will be included in whatever application the user is using to access the website.
  - derFunk 11y ago
    I'm aware I'm nitpicking and maybe too theoretical now, but the processing time would vary in whatever application the user is using.. I'm with negus here who basically means the same I guess. The generic danger here (regarding benchmarking) is that you're explicitly also benchmarking curl. In case curl/"the web client" would handle 30x redirects super inefficiently, these results could lead to wrong assumptions.
wangman 11y ago
This is because reddit.com and www.reddit.com gets you the http-versions, which both are redirected to https Try this: curl -sL https://{www.,}reddit.com https://{www.,}reddit.com -o\ /dev/null{,\ } -w "%{time_redirect}\n"
- buzzdenver 11y ago
  Can I ask you to explain that "-o\ /dev/null{,\ }" magic ?
  - drostie 11y ago
    It's not magic -- it's some form of crude error. So first off what this does is, it expands to the expression: '-o /dev/null' '-o /dev/null ' Even if we remove the latter space by just using `{,}` instead of `{,\ }` curl still returns for me an error code 23 -- CURLE_WRITE_ERROR. curl seems to interpret `'-o /wtf'` as a command to write to the file ` /wtf`, so this only makes sense if you have a directory called ` ` in the folder you're running from. You can therefore do this correctly with: -o/dev/null{,} and that correctly writes the contents to /dev/null without issuing a curl write error.
    - wangman 11y ago
      Thanks, it sure looks less ugly with -o/dev/null{,} I couldn't find any other way to get curl to stay silent and still output redirect times. Hence the crude hack. (Obviously my bash and curl versions had no problem with the spaces or I wouldn't have posted it)
      - d0ugie 11y ago
        Using the curl'ing tips up this branch of comments I programmed a highly sophisticated script and dropped it on github. :) https://github.com/dougsimmons/301debate https://github.com/dougsimmons/301debate
        11y ago
jjoonathan 11y ago
I cleared Firefox's cache, opened the waterfall diagram, and looked at the time between when I hit enter (assuming that's 0ms) and the time when the request for the www.* address went out. I was planning to subtract off DNS time if necessary but in all cases it hit the cache and contributed 0ms. I didn't have wireshark open so I don't really know what happened with google. It surprised me too. Maybe something had to be re-transmitted? Now it seems to take 90-100ms. Perhaps I should have done best-of-three, but my point wasn't about precise numbers, it was about orders of magnitude, and "tens to hundreds of ms" is definitely more in line with what I expected than "a few us".

elithrar 11y ago

In most cases it should stay low too: your browser should retain a keep-alive to the web server, so you're not throwing away the connection. Future requests will auto-resolve due to caching of the 301.

manigandham 11y ago

There are plenty of places in the world where internet latency is a big issue, not to mention mobile networks everywhere. There's no reason to add a roundtrip unless absolutely necessary.

lukeschlather 11y ago

Mediocre Wifi can easily add seconds of latency.