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When a new rule is introduced, the early panels can be easily solved by trial and error. However, it's a mistake to continue until you can articulate the rule.

When a new rule is introduced, the early panels can be easily solved by trial and error. However, it's a mistake to continue until you can articulate the rule. That means experimenting with a panel even if you accidentally get the correct answer on the first try. Edit: I'm reminded of this game from the New York Times from October: http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/07/03/upshot/a-quick-puzzle-to-test-your-problem-solving.html http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/07/03/upshot/a-quick...

webkike 11y ago
I do not mind new panels introducing concepts; what I mind is the symbols not always being clearly connected with the mechanic they introduce. For example, the black and white symbols that needed to be separated were intuitive.
- devindotcom 11y ago
  MINOR SPOILER/HINT BELOW While I sort of agree, I must say that part of the fun of the game (and much of the challenge) is learning the 'language' of each puzzle. In the case of the little orange suns, it was like learning from scratch, one letter at a time. First panel: "Okay, I can't go between them." Second panel: "Oh, I can, but have to end up on one side... which amounts to having them in the same section. How is that different?" Third panel: "There were 4, and the only path that worked divided them? What the hell?" Fourth panel: "Oh with six I have to make them into groups of two - so maybe I have to divide them equally?" Fifth panel: "Aha, no, it's groups of two!" And now that's part of your vocabulary; you discovered it organically, not by bringing in some outside knowledge like symbols from off the island. Notice there aren't any numbers or letters? Like, anywhere? That's part of it...
  - Chris2048 11y ago
    Spoiler Alert?
    - devindotcom 11y ago
      True, I should have mentioned that and have added. Pretty much everything is spoilery in threads about the game, though. What I described is fairly early and basic, though, not some big revelation. Go try the game if you haven't!
- chasing 11y ago
  Well, it's a puzzle game. So I might argue that not being intuitive is kind of the point. And to that point, maybe one reason I've found so many recent major game titles boring recently is that there is no puzzle to them. They're just activities. Go here. Shoot that. Collect that. It's nice to actually be stumped. And not just frustrated by my lack of hand-eye coordination.
  - secstate 11y ago
    Hmm, a non-intuitive puzzle isn't really a puzzle anymore, is it? Q: I have three oranges and one grapefruit. I have to get all of them through a door that's been glued shut. There is no way to open the door. How do I get the fruit through? A: Blend them and use the tube lying next to the door and pour them through the keyhole. That's a non-intuitive puzzle. You can't intuit that there's a keyhole, a tube and a blender accessible. With creativity it's solvable, but then again, with creativity you also could argue you could use the hole saw nearby and cut a hole in the door and deposit the fruit on the other side. At this point you're just making things up.
    - codeulike 11y ago
      That's different. In a game you can explore and experiment. Your defn of puzzle is very restrictive.
    - chasing 11y ago
      That's not how the puzzles in The Witness work. At least not in my experience with the game so far.

webkike 11y ago

I do not mind new panels introducing concepts; what I mind is the symbols not always being clearly connected with the mechanic they introduce. For example, the black and white symbols that needed to be separated were intuitive.

devindotcom 11y ago
MINOR SPOILER/HINT BELOW While I sort of agree, I must say that part of the fun of the game (and much of the challenge) is learning the 'language' of each puzzle. In the case of the little orange suns, it was like learning from scratch, one letter at a time. First panel: "Okay, I can't go between them." Second panel: "Oh, I can, but have to end up on one side... which amounts to having them in the same section. How is that different?" Third panel: "There were 4, and the only path that worked divided them? What the hell?" Fourth panel: "Oh with six I have to make them into groups of two - so maybe I have to divide them equally?" Fifth panel: "Aha, no, it's groups of two!" And now that's part of your vocabulary; you discovered it organically, not by bringing in some outside knowledge like symbols from off the island. Notice there aren't any numbers or letters? Like, anywhere? That's part of it...
- Chris2048 11y ago
  Spoiler Alert?
  - devindotcom 11y ago
    True, I should have mentioned that and have added. Pretty much everything is spoilery in threads about the game, though. What I described is fairly early and basic, though, not some big revelation. Go try the game if you haven't!
chasing 11y ago
Well, it's a puzzle game. So I might argue that not being intuitive is kind of the point. And to that point, maybe one reason I've found so many recent major game titles boring recently is that there is no puzzle to them. They're just activities. Go here. Shoot that. Collect that. It's nice to actually be stumped. And not just frustrated by my lack of hand-eye coordination.
- secstate 11y ago
  Hmm, a non-intuitive puzzle isn't really a puzzle anymore, is it? Q: I have three oranges and one grapefruit. I have to get all of them through a door that's been glued shut. There is no way to open the door. How do I get the fruit through? A: Blend them and use the tube lying next to the door and pour them through the keyhole. That's a non-intuitive puzzle. You can't intuit that there's a keyhole, a tube and a blender accessible. With creativity it's solvable, but then again, with creativity you also could argue you could use the hole saw nearby and cut a hole in the door and deposit the fruit on the other side. At this point you're just making things up.
  - codeulike 11y ago
    That's different. In a game you can explore and experiment. Your defn of puzzle is very restrictive.
  - chasing 11y ago
    That's not how the puzzles in The Witness work. At least not in my experience with the game so far.