3 ms·

I could have left this comment on a number of comments here. These are an ugly artifact of hn's eagerness to call bullshit on anything and everything. "Zero UI"

by woah 11y ago

I could have left this comment on a number of comments here. These are an ugly artifact of hn's eagerness to call bullshit on anything and everything. "Zero UI" is a convenient shorthand for saying "interactions with technology not involving a traditional 2d box-based user interface. Zero UI is a lot quicker to say. That's what words are all about. You have a problem with language? Go debunk something that actually needs to be debunked instead of leaving one of the same 10 crabby, predictable comments that are already in this thread. I have no clue if "zero ui" is actually a good thing or whatever, but I know that your comment and the rest like it add nothing new to the conversation.

stonogo 11y ago
Usage evolves naturally. This is some idiot's attempt at branding, and doesn't deserve a free pass just because you feel like arguing to tone.
TrevorJ 11y ago
I understand what you are getting at, but technology and complexity expand at an extraordinary rate in our world, thus reinventing new terms for old ideas is not an innocuous thing, it does real harm. It silo's people and ideas that should be cross pollinating. It raises the barrier to entry to newcomers, and probably worst of all it feeds into the cult of 'newness' where no idea or concept is worth learning if it's older than say, 12 months ago. I'm not being crabby, I'm pointing out that there are over a 100 years of research and knowledge that are useful to help solve these problems which tend to get thrown out when you decide to invent a new term for things that exist already. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affordance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affordance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_factors_and_ergonomics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_factors_and_ergonomics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_design https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_design https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interaction_design#3D_Physical_objects_or_space https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interaction_design#3D_Physical... The interactions we have with technology are far worse than they should be, by and large and I believe that a good portion of the reason is that rather than standing on the shoulders of those who've gone before us, we become seduced instead by new and unpolished ideas, never stopping to let the old ones inform us. I think this is part of the reason our tools for creating things with computers still aren't as useful (in my opinion) and intuitive as this software (from 1963): https://youtu.be/57wj8diYpgY?t=176 https://youtu.be/57wj8diYpgY?t=176 And if new ideas are good, they won't be harmed by a crabby comment or two, they will be improved upon and become stronger as a result. Anyhow, I hope that at least communicates a little better the intent behind my comment. In any case, I appreciate the feedback so thank you for taking the time to comment.
fiatjaf 11y ago
Does yours?
- TrevorJ 11y ago
  I wrote the parent comment, and I actually think his reply was worthwhile. Ideas are things that should be challenged IMO
aikah 11y ago
> I have no clue if "zero ui" is actually a good thing or whatever "Zero UI" is nothing, it doesn't mean anything, because it goes against the definition of UI. Even worse, it kind of creates some confusion as to what is a UI at first place. And then uninformed people (journalists) will start thinking "when there is no screen, there is no UI", which is straight out false, and spread that lie. There is nothing new here, only people that take advantage of the ignorance of others for marketing purposes, labeling something old as brand new. That's dishonest, at best. So yes, this "Zero UI movement" is pure bullshit, and it needs to be called out for what it is. The only invention here is the buzzword.

by woah 11y ago

stonogo 11y ago

Usage evolves naturally. This is some idiot's attempt at branding, and doesn't deserve a free pass just because you feel like arguing to tone.

TrevorJ 11y ago

I understand what you are getting at, but technology and complexity expand at an extraordinary rate in our world, thus reinventing new terms for old ideas is not an innocuous thing, it does real harm. It silo's people and ideas that should be cross pollinating. It raises the barrier to entry to newcomers, and probably worst of all it feeds into the cult of 'newness' where no idea or concept is worth learning if it's older than say, 12 months ago. I'm not being crabby, I'm pointing out that there are over a 100 years of research and knowledge that are useful to help solve these problems which tend to get thrown out when you decide to invent a new term for things that exist already. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affordance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affordance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_factors_and_ergonomics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_factors_and_ergonomics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_design https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_design https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interaction_design#3D_Physical_objects_or_space https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interaction_design#3D_Physical... The interactions we have with technology are far worse than they should be, by and large and I believe that a good portion of the reason is that rather than standing on the shoulders of those who've gone before us, we become seduced instead by new and unpolished ideas, never stopping to let the old ones inform us. I think this is part of the reason our tools for creating things with computers still aren't as useful (in my opinion) and intuitive as this software (from 1963): https://youtu.be/57wj8diYpgY?t=176 https://youtu.be/57wj8diYpgY?t=176 And if new ideas are good, they won't be harmed by a crabby comment or two, they will be improved upon and become stronger as a result. Anyhow, I hope that at least communicates a little better the intent behind my comment. In any case, I appreciate the feedback so thank you for taking the time to comment.

fiatjaf 11y ago

Does yours?

TrevorJ 11y ago
I wrote the parent comment, and I actually think his reply was worthwhile. Ideas are things that should be challenged IMO

aikah 11y ago

> I have no clue if "zero ui" is actually a good thing or whatever "Zero UI" is nothing, it doesn't mean anything, because it goes against the definition of UI. Even worse, it kind of creates some confusion as to what is a UI at first place. And then uninformed people (journalists) will start thinking "when there is no screen, there is no UI", which is straight out false, and spread that lie. There is nothing new here, only people that take advantage of the ignorance of others for marketing purposes, labeling something old as brand new. That's dishonest, at best. So yes, this "Zero UI movement" is pure bullshit, and it needs to be called out for what it is. The only invention here is the buzzword.