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I've noticed you doing this over and over; you extrapolate an impossibly generalized statement from a user, inferring details which were not implied or explicit

I've noticed you doing this over and over; you extrapolate an impossibly generalized statement from a user, inferring details which were not implied or explicitly stated. He made no such opinion statement on copyrights or patents. Your views on privacy have been questioned ad nauseum on HN, and your replies frequently do not address the very real concern that people raise: the misuse of "private" information by those in authority. Or, if you do, it's a very hand-wavy statement to the effect of "if information was freely available to anyone, that power wouldn't be a big deal". It's simply not a response that addresses the facts: the concern by those with a desire to protect their privacy stems from their "private" information being used by someone in a position to do physical, economical or psychological harm to them. You've never addressed that, that I can see. Your government, unless you are the sole government of your own little island somewhere, is in a position to harm you. They give a vanishingly small number of fucks about your life as an individual, and wouldn't bat an eye at taking your "private" information out of context and using it to disrupt your life if it suits their needs. I know statements like mine will never convince you that your perception of how the real world works is quite different from its realities; I do not make them to convince you. I appreciate the seed of hope for the future that you believe you're sowing by arguing your point on HN, and it would be an amazing place to live. Given, however, the ways in which the human condition manifests itself in a society where there are people with power over others - no matter where that power comes from - that world is a fiction. In our reality, we lowly citizens have few advantages over the powerful few, and until the human condition evolves to allow a Gene Roddenberry-esque utopian society to form on Earth, the right to privacy will always be sacred to those of us who want to have some semblance of control over our future.

miguelrochefort 11y ago
Generally, when I disagree with a person, it's not about reality or the present. I disagree about the possibilities, the future. Nobody is saying that society is perfect, nor does anybody claim that we can get rid of all forms of privacy today and live happily. That wouldn't be reasonable. The reason I comment is because I'm convinced that a lot of people here never asked themselves - not even once - what privacy is and what purpose it serves. People blindly accept the idea that privacy is not only necessary, but a desired aspect of society. I find that idea destructive. The worst (and most telling) part is the blatant contradictions that people demonstrate across recurring debates. Gun control, SOPA/PIPA, Net Neutrality, Privacy/NSA, Patents/Copyrights, are all the same debates. They're all precisely the very same issues. Yet, people (who I feel lack the ability to generalize) appear to see these issues as different and unrelated things. The worst part, they hold different positions across these topics, effectively contradicting themselves. That is baffling. You can probably tell that I'm not a great communicator. I'm genuinely trying to be helpful, but most people don't put any effort into trying to understand what I'm struggling to convey. I don't blame people for that, but that sure is frustrating to me. TL;DR: I generalize to a level that prevents me from understanding or being understood by others.
- jnbiche 11y ago
  > The reason I comment is because I'm convinced that a lot of people here never asked themselves - not even once - what privacy is and what purpose it serves. In fact, the people I know who have actually thought about privacy and its implications the most, myself included, are the ones who hold it dearest. The people that I know who have never stopped to think about these issues are the ones who don't care what information big companies and the government has about them. >TL;DR: I generalize to a level that prevents me from understanding or being understood by others. Hmm. Maybe try another approach? Maybe try being specific about what you want and/or advocate for?
  - miguelrochefort 11y ago
    I believe that generalization is good. Many of the problems we face today are symptoms of lack of generalization.
- spdustin 11y ago
  But I have asked myself, as have others, and came to conclusions that I've shared and that you've never addressed. You're quite adept at providing non-answers, and I do believe you when you say you feel misunderstood. I've read more of your comments and your submissions, and feel that I understand you even more than you're willing to give credit for. And there's the rub: you have been unable to give that credit. You've been given insights, raw honesty, carefully considered and thoughtful replies, and to each you've carefully and artfully worded a response that almost seems to show the same considered sympathetic thoughtfulness you are seeking from others. I don't know if it was a particular incident or if the particular way you perceive the world and how it perceives you is due to literal differences in your wiring, but I fear that you will find yourself butting up against the same walls every time you choose to engage in this dialog. It's not because I or the others responding are being recalcitrant, it's because you do not seem to be able to participate in that step beyond turn-taking: perspective-taking. I don't mean any disrespect, and if you care to read my past comments you will learn that I am sincere when I share the perception I have about you. I feel, for others reading, the need to disclaim more overtly that I do not share this perception in any derogatory way, and it comes from a place of understanding. My perception is that your difficulty with placing yourself in the mind of others, or your challenges with understanding why on earth people don't think the same thing you do... Well, both are very much the kinds of issues that those, like my son, on the autism spectrum have. I'd very much like to chat with you. Drop me a line at my username at gmail dot com if you feel there is something to what I've said.

miguelrochefort 11y ago

Generally, when I disagree with a person, it's not about reality or the present. I disagree about the possibilities, the future. Nobody is saying that society is perfect, nor does anybody claim that we can get rid of all forms of privacy today and live happily. That wouldn't be reasonable. The reason I comment is because I'm convinced that a lot of people here never asked themselves - not even once - what privacy is and what purpose it serves. People blindly accept the idea that privacy is not only necessary, but a desired aspect of society. I find that idea destructive. The worst (and most telling) part is the blatant contradictions that people demonstrate across recurring debates. Gun control, SOPA/PIPA, Net Neutrality, Privacy/NSA, Patents/Copyrights, are all the same debates. They're all precisely the very same issues. Yet, people (who I feel lack the ability to generalize) appear to see these issues as different and unrelated things. The worst part, they hold different positions across these topics, effectively contradicting themselves. That is baffling. You can probably tell that I'm not a great communicator. I'm genuinely trying to be helpful, but most people don't put any effort into trying to understand what I'm struggling to convey. I don't blame people for that, but that sure is frustrating to me. TL;DR: I generalize to a level that prevents me from understanding or being understood by others.

jnbiche 11y ago
> The reason I comment is because I'm convinced that a lot of people here never asked themselves - not even once - what privacy is and what purpose it serves. In fact, the people I know who have actually thought about privacy and its implications the most, myself included, are the ones who hold it dearest. The people that I know who have never stopped to think about these issues are the ones who don't care what information big companies and the government has about them. >TL;DR: I generalize to a level that prevents me from understanding or being understood by others. Hmm. Maybe try another approach? Maybe try being specific about what you want and/or advocate for?
- miguelrochefort 11y ago
  I believe that generalization is good. Many of the problems we face today are symptoms of lack of generalization.
spdustin 11y ago
But I have asked myself, as have others, and came to conclusions that I've shared and that you've never addressed. You're quite adept at providing non-answers, and I do believe you when you say you feel misunderstood. I've read more of your comments and your submissions, and feel that I understand you even more than you're willing to give credit for. And there's the rub: you have been unable to give that credit. You've been given insights, raw honesty, carefully considered and thoughtful replies, and to each you've carefully and artfully worded a response that almost seems to show the same considered sympathetic thoughtfulness you are seeking from others. I don't know if it was a particular incident or if the particular way you perceive the world and how it perceives you is due to literal differences in your wiring, but I fear that you will find yourself butting up against the same walls every time you choose to engage in this dialog. It's not because I or the others responding are being recalcitrant, it's because you do not seem to be able to participate in that step beyond turn-taking: perspective-taking. I don't mean any disrespect, and if you care to read my past comments you will learn that I am sincere when I share the perception I have about you. I feel, for others reading, the need to disclaim more overtly that I do not share this perception in any derogatory way, and it comes from a place of understanding. My perception is that your difficulty with placing yourself in the mind of others, or your challenges with understanding why on earth people don't think the same thing you do... Well, both are very much the kinds of issues that those, like my son, on the autism spectrum have. I'd very much like to chat with you. Drop me a line at my username at gmail dot com if you feel there is something to what I've said.