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> when the Senior Research Fellow from DuPont (back from when the fabled Experimental Station was still a thing) who is teaching one really good graduate level

by munin 11y ago

> when the Senior Research Fellow from DuPont (back from when the fabled Experimental Station was still a thing) who is teaching one really good graduate level course at Penn as adjunct, when this guy walks up to the Chair, saying that his office space shouldn't be cut or he won't be back, the Chair will listen No, the chair won't. This "Senior Research Fellow" is teaching a grad class. The grad class doesn't make the university any money. It doesn't even pay for the classroom it's taught in. If this "guy" is teaching 2 300 person sections, or writes and wins multi million dollar grants, or has the connections with DuPont that give the department money directly, then, yes, they are making the university money. That's all the department cares about. That's all your management ever cares about, "what have you done for me lately."

dalke 11y ago
The department also cares about its accreditation. The professors want grad students who can handle advanced chemistry. Someone has to teach them. > The grad class doesn't make the university any money. Odd, I could have sworn that my grad school listed a cost for credit hours. While there was a tuition waiver, that money came from somewhere, and I'm pretty sure that includes grant overhead. I'm sure too the funding agencies might wonder about all the overhead needed for a grad school with no one teaching graduate-level courses.
- munin 11y ago
  > I'm sure too the funding agencies might wonder about all the overhead needed for a grad school with no one teaching graduate-level courses. Maybe. Maybe not. Probably not. Either way, which would bill more: one 18 person class, or 2 300 person classes?
  - dalke 11y ago
    Like I said, it doesn't matter which one bills more. The school almost certainly won't get grad students if it doesn't offer any graduate level courses. A graduate program with poorly trained students is not going to get the bigger grant funding, if only because the research is likely to be less advanced. It's even more profitable to have a class without a teacher, where people simply get a degree in exchange for money and bypass all the intermediate work. These are called diploma mills.

by munin 11y ago

dalke 11y ago

The department also cares about its accreditation. The professors want grad students who can handle advanced chemistry. Someone has to teach them. > The grad class doesn't make the university any money. Odd, I could have sworn that my grad school listed a cost for credit hours. While there was a tuition waiver, that money came from somewhere, and I'm pretty sure that includes grant overhead. I'm sure too the funding agencies might wonder about all the overhead needed for a grad school with no one teaching graduate-level courses.

munin 11y ago
> I'm sure too the funding agencies might wonder about all the overhead needed for a grad school with no one teaching graduate-level courses. Maybe. Maybe not. Probably not. Either way, which would bill more: one 18 person class, or 2 300 person classes?
- dalke 11y ago
  Like I said, it doesn't matter which one bills more. The school almost certainly won't get grad students if it doesn't offer any graduate level courses. A graduate program with poorly trained students is not going to get the bigger grant funding, if only because the research is likely to be less advanced. It's even more profitable to have a class without a teacher, where people simply get a degree in exchange for money and bypass all the intermediate work. These are called diploma mills.