5 ms·

It seems much more likely that there is some bogus location data set somewhere that improperly links SIDS and GPS coordinates or filters fail and result some in

by wang_li 11y ago

It seems much more likely that there is some bogus location data set somewhere that improperly links SIDS and GPS coordinates or filters fail and result some index into a GPS table that happens to correspond to this couple's home. If I were these two people, I'd contact the local police department every single time anyone shows up at their house and require that the PD fill out a report of some kind and keep it in a single case/incident/folder. Then put a sign on the door that says: > Before knocking contact the police department at ###-###-#### and ask about incident #XYZ. The get off our property. It's bullshit that police are coming to the door and dragging them outside while trying to determine if a search warrant is in order.

chad_strategic 11y ago
---> It's bullshit that police are coming to the door and dragging them outside while trying to determine if a search warrant is in order. I think this is the biggest issue! Their rights where violated.
- ghshephard 11y ago
  What rights are you referring to? The police seem to have done everything correctly. These were individuals who were being detained pursuant to an investigation of an ongoing crime. The police did not search the inside of the house without a warrant - though, it's unclear why not - if they had strong belief that there was a crime in progress, they had every legal right to do so. I guess the only thing in question is whether "missing child" was precise enough to be upgraded to "crime" in this jurisdiction. I think that, given the evidence, the police did everything correctly; being detained pursuant to an investigation isn't a great inconvenience (though, some accommodation should be made to allow people to use washroom facilities if investigation is extensive - just obviously not in the house under investigation.)
  - asciimo 11y ago
    Software that puts a blinking dot on a map should not be considered probable cause.
    - ghshephard 11y ago
      The findmyfriends feature on my iPhone has been 100% accurate in identifying where my friends are. If I had a child who went missing, and findmyfriends showed that they were in a house, I would absolutely hope that the police would go to the house and rescue my child. I would also hope that the police would have enough sense to prevent any occupants from the house from going into the house and potentially destroying/hiding any evidence, and/or, powering down the iPhone. As it was, I think the police showed restraint by not going into the house until they had a warrant.
      - PhantomGremlin 11y ago
        The findmyfriends feature on my iPhone has been 100% accurate in identifying where my friends are My wife and I use Find My Friends quite often to keep track of our children. I've used it for years, so I'm quite familiar with it. Our experience is quite the opposite of "100% accurate". I provided more detail in this other post: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10950107 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10950107 Edit: just looked up the USA version of "probable cause" here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Probable_cause#United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Probable_cause#United_States In my opinion Find My Friends does not meet the standard of probable cause as defined by that Wikipedia article. I'd characterize its behavior be somewhere in between "reasonable suspicion" and "probable cause". I've seen the location be wrong and stay wrong for 1/2 hour or more. And I don't mean it can't find a location, I mean that it is repeatedly reporting the wrong location ("now") for an extended period of time. Oh, and BTW following that Wiki link for "reasonable suspicion" says that it is sufficient for obtaining a warrant. IMO Find My Friends does meet that standard, at least as I understand it by a quick reading of Wiki.
        Houshalter 11y ago
        What percent of the time is the location totally wrong? Greater than 50% of the time? If not then it's totally justified.
        11y ago
veidr 11y ago
> If I were these two people, I'd contact the local police department every single time anyone shows up at their house and require that the PD fill out a report of some kind and keep it in a single case/incident/folder. While I would want to do that, too, that's not how police departments work in Atlanta (or pretty much any urban area of the USA).
ytjohn 11y ago
I too was thinking that a big laminated sign on their door or front porch that says "WE DO NOT HAVE YOUR PHONE", followed with a paper describing that their location is commonly given out when more accurate location is not available. Now that they've had some press, a pamphlet box (like realtors use) containing printouts of some articles would deter most people. It might make some people more suspicious ('maybe this is how they cover it up'), but should send most people on your way. Your idea of having a police report on file and contacting the local police department is even better.

by wang_li 11y ago

chad_strategic 11y ago

---> It's bullshit that police are coming to the door and dragging them outside while trying to determine if a search warrant is in order. I think this is the biggest issue! Their rights where violated.

ghshephard 11y ago
What rights are you referring to? The police seem to have done everything correctly. These were individuals who were being detained pursuant to an investigation of an ongoing crime. The police did not search the inside of the house without a warrant - though, it's unclear why not - if they had strong belief that there was a crime in progress, they had every legal right to do so. I guess the only thing in question is whether "missing child" was precise enough to be upgraded to "crime" in this jurisdiction. I think that, given the evidence, the police did everything correctly; being detained pursuant to an investigation isn't a great inconvenience (though, some accommodation should be made to allow people to use washroom facilities if investigation is extensive - just obviously not in the house under investigation.)
- asciimo 11y ago
  Software that puts a blinking dot on a map should not be considered probable cause.
  - ghshephard 11y ago
    The findmyfriends feature on my iPhone has been 100% accurate in identifying where my friends are. If I had a child who went missing, and findmyfriends showed that they were in a house, I would absolutely hope that the police would go to the house and rescue my child. I would also hope that the police would have enough sense to prevent any occupants from the house from going into the house and potentially destroying/hiding any evidence, and/or, powering down the iPhone. As it was, I think the police showed restraint by not going into the house until they had a warrant.
    - PhantomGremlin 11y ago
      The findmyfriends feature on my iPhone has been 100% accurate in identifying where my friends are My wife and I use Find My Friends quite often to keep track of our children. I've used it for years, so I'm quite familiar with it. Our experience is quite the opposite of "100% accurate". I provided more detail in this other post: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10950107 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10950107 Edit: just looked up the USA version of "probable cause" here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Probable_cause#United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Probable_cause#United_States In my opinion Find My Friends does not meet the standard of probable cause as defined by that Wikipedia article. I'd characterize its behavior be somewhere in between "reasonable suspicion" and "probable cause". I've seen the location be wrong and stay wrong for 1/2 hour or more. And I don't mean it can't find a location, I mean that it is repeatedly reporting the wrong location ("now") for an extended period of time. Oh, and BTW following that Wiki link for "reasonable suspicion" says that it is sufficient for obtaining a warrant. IMO Find My Friends does meet that standard, at least as I understand it by a quick reading of Wiki.
      - Houshalter 11y ago
        What percent of the time is the location totally wrong? Greater than 50% of the time? If not then it's totally justified.
        11y ago

veidr 11y ago

> If I were these two people, I'd contact the local police department every single time anyone shows up at their house and require that the PD fill out a report of some kind and keep it in a single case/incident/folder. While I would want to do that, too, that's not how police departments work in Atlanta (or pretty much any urban area of the USA).

ytjohn 11y ago

I too was thinking that a big laminated sign on their door or front porch that says "WE DO NOT HAVE YOUR PHONE", followed with a paper describing that their location is commonly given out when more accurate location is not available. Now that they've had some press, a pamphlet box (like realtors use) containing printouts of some articles would deter most people. It might make some people more suspicious ('maybe this is how they cover it up'), but should send most people on your way. Your idea of having a police report on file and contacting the local police department is even better.