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It's crazy that in 2016, people are still seeking the holy grail of statically typed, memory safe, no VM programming languages that retains most of the advantag

by aikah 11y ago

It's crazy that in 2016, people are still seeking the holy grail of statically typed, memory safe, no VM programming languages that retains most of the advantages of dynamically typed languages. My point is it should be there already! Well , I guess language design is just hard... Yet the demand exists, and it's huge no question. Out of all of these, i still think D is the most interesting one (I like C#, I want generics ...). I don't agree with some choices Nim made but it still look interesting. Go is way too rigid for my programming style. Yet Go set some expectations when it comes to developer experience, so it was a step in the right direction.

otabdeveloper 11y ago
> statically typed, memory safe, no VM programming languages that retains most of the advantages of dynamically typed languages Those requirements contradict themselves in numerous ways. As always, engineering tradeoffs are paramount. As for "statically typed, memory safe, no VM" -- C++ fits all those perfectly. (Provided you put in the effort of learning C++. There's another tradeoff you'd need to keep in mind.)
- steveklabnik 11y ago
  > Those requirements contradict themselves in numerous ways I'd be interested in hearing more about how.
- Gankro 11y ago
  There isn't any definition of memory safe, nor any published version of C++, for which this is a true claim.
- pjc50 11y ago
  C++ is not memory-safe and cannot be coerced into being so. You can write nice C++ in the C++14 style, but you can't turn off or ban the unsafe features. Until I can make my program fail to compile if there is a bare pointer in it (and how would that work with the standard library and system API?), it's not a memory-safe language.
amyjess 11y ago
Yes, of all the new-style AOT languages, Nim and D are by far and above my favorites. Go and Rust just never appealed to me. Actually, I never liked Go for the same reasons as you...
xaduha 11y ago
> It's crazy that in 2016, people are still seeking the holy grail of statically typed, memory safe, no VM programming languages that retains most of the advantages of dynamically typed languages. I have my eye on Red and its system programming dialect Red/System http://www.red-lang.org http://www.red-lang.org http://static.red-lang.org/red-system-specs.html http://static.red-lang.org/red-system-specs.html

by aikah 11y ago

otabdeveloper 11y ago

> statically typed, memory safe, no VM programming languages that retains most of the advantages of dynamically typed languages Those requirements contradict themselves in numerous ways. As always, engineering tradeoffs are paramount. As for "statically typed, memory safe, no VM" -- C++ fits all those perfectly. (Provided you put in the effort of learning C++. There's another tradeoff you'd need to keep in mind.)

steveklabnik 11y ago
> Those requirements contradict themselves in numerous ways I'd be interested in hearing more about how.
Gankro 11y ago
There isn't any definition of memory safe, nor any published version of C++, for which this is a true claim.
pjc50 11y ago
C++ is not memory-safe and cannot be coerced into being so. You can write nice C++ in the C++14 style, but you can't turn off or ban the unsafe features. Until I can make my program fail to compile if there is a bare pointer in it (and how would that work with the standard library and system API?), it's not a memory-safe language.

amyjess 11y ago

Yes, of all the new-style AOT languages, Nim and D are by far and above my favorites. Go and Rust just never appealed to me. Actually, I never liked Go for the same reasons as you...

xaduha 11y ago

> It's crazy that in 2016, people are still seeking the holy grail of statically typed, memory safe, no VM programming languages that retains most of the advantages of dynamically typed languages. I have my eye on Red and its system programming dialect Red/System http://www.red-lang.org http://www.red-lang.org http://static.red-lang.org/red-system-specs.html http://static.red-lang.org/red-system-specs.html