5 ms·

Another point to that, is that the default assumption, even for a Tesla is that you can charge it at home during the night. For people living in a flat with car

by gutnor 11y ago

Another point to that, is that the default assumption, even for a Tesla is that you can charge it at home during the night. For people living in a flat with car on the street, that means going to a charging station on a regular basis for a full charge. That is beyond anxiety, it means planning your life around your car range, instead of the other way around. And with the current availability of charging stations, it also determine the place you are allowed to go, that's a very big drawback for people that use their car mainly on the weekend for leisure.

monk_e_boy 11y ago
I think this is where self driving, electric, Uber cars will rescue us. The car will be owned by someone who has plenty of charging stations and it'll simply appear at my door 5 minutes before I need to leave for work.
- samstave 11y ago
  Welcome to Jonny cab!
- majewsky 11y ago
  The problem I see with this kind of carsharing is that it does not scale particularly well to rush hours. I must note though that I'm living in Germany where Uber is not really a thing yet (mostly because of regulatory problems), so if anyone can share insight on how Uber scales to the rush hour, that'd be great.
  - alex_anglin 11y ago
    The long and the short of it is that they raise their prices during rush hour.
  - monk_e_boy 11y ago
    At the moment each adult owns one car. (all the adults I know have at least one car each) I'd say at rush hour 2/3 of those cars are being used. I'd imagine Uber would just buy thousands of cars. Why not? What's to stop them? I'd just scrap my car and have an Uber car parked somewhere close to my house. I don't care, just so long as I can get to work. I imagine that utilities will soon provide automatic Uber car docks and cars will cluster around them at night. There must be a lot of Tesco car parks that are 99% empty at the moment (at night) rent this space to Uber and in the day, the car park would empty as those Uber cars would be driving around. Also, I don't mind car sharing so long as I don't have to wait. Uber could easily plan trips that pick up and drop off without having to wait like you do for more traditional public transport such as trains and buses...
    - majewsky 11y ago
      Fascinating. And fun fact: I'm 26 and I don't have a driver's license. So do many of my peers. I totally rely on public transit (save for the few occasions where I need to move furniture etc.). Public transit service is exceptionally good and reliable in most of Germany's big towns.
therein 11y ago
Unless you live in an area with lots of Superchargers or if your works place has electric car charging stations. I feel like that's the reason why so many people that I work with get Teslas.
- OopsCriticality 11y ago
  I thought Tesla sent out letters to people using Superchargers for daily charging, clarifying that they were intended for long-distance travel.
- jonknee 11y ago
  It's probably more likely that you work with a lot of high-income males who are interested in the technology of Tesla and the prestige of owning one.
  - ams6110 11y ago
    I live in an area where electric vehicles (and particularly Teslas) are very uncommon. The couple of people I know of who own Teslas fit your description exactly. They are status symbols and playthings, like any other expensive high-line car (and I'm not saying that's a bad thing, just the reality).
yuhong 11y ago
Yea, but for those that can charge at home, it is better than having to pay a gas station.
- dsr_ 11y ago
  Right up until the day that you unexpectedly have to drive somewhere that is (a) at the limit of your range, (b) not accessible otherwise and (c) doesn't have convenient chargers. This is interestingly close to the Kozmo/PeaPod/whatever on-demand grocery delivery problem: as long as you only have to service high population densities, you can make a profit. As soon as you try to handle suburbs, the costs of providing service increase at a rate larger than the square of the radius you are trying to serve - and nobody wants to pay that, and the urban core won't subsidize the suburban outliers until you've already dominated the market.
nacs 11y ago
How many people living in a flat with no garage own a > $70-100K car? It seems to me like people who're buying a car in that price range would either own a house or at least have access to a garage.
- buro9 11y ago
  That sounds like a very US view. It's fairly common in London to not have a garage, and even if you do then there is unlikely to be any power there. Most likely is on-street parking, and that's assuming you're not in a flat.
  - rstupek 11y ago
    So it sounds like an all electric vehicle may simply not be for them.
    - gutnor 11y ago
      People living in densely populated area should be the prime target for zero emission cars. And that is a problem cities can solve. There is no problem to hook a few power plug on the street ( eg: BMW had a strategy for cheap, small charging station specifically target to create a large number of slow power point. ) Beside the cost, European cities are keener on getting rid of cars entirely, so they are reducing the number of parking spaces as years goes by, so you may be right after all, the zero emission solution for people living where I live is to not have a car at all ( which is, to be fair, not at all unrealistic. There is a strong possibility that the technologies to solve my few "not conveniently covered by public transport" will come from some sort of rental/uber before electric car is actually practical where I live )
- samstave 11y ago
  Bullshit, just go around any single place in san Francisco. Even just thinking of my brother in law and his wife both make $150k+ live in a condo in sf and even with their garage, they would not be able to install power at their parking spots.

by gutnor 11y ago

monk_e_boy 11y ago

I think this is where self driving, electric, Uber cars will rescue us. The car will be owned by someone who has plenty of charging stations and it'll simply appear at my door 5 minutes before I need to leave for work.

samstave 11y ago
Welcome to Jonny cab!
majewsky 11y ago
The problem I see with this kind of carsharing is that it does not scale particularly well to rush hours. I must note though that I'm living in Germany where Uber is not really a thing yet (mostly because of regulatory problems), so if anyone can share insight on how Uber scales to the rush hour, that'd be great.
- alex_anglin 11y ago
  The long and the short of it is that they raise their prices during rush hour.
- monk_e_boy 11y ago
  At the moment each adult owns one car. (all the adults I know have at least one car each) I'd say at rush hour 2/3 of those cars are being used. I'd imagine Uber would just buy thousands of cars. Why not? What's to stop them? I'd just scrap my car and have an Uber car parked somewhere close to my house. I don't care, just so long as I can get to work. I imagine that utilities will soon provide automatic Uber car docks and cars will cluster around them at night. There must be a lot of Tesco car parks that are 99% empty at the moment (at night) rent this space to Uber and in the day, the car park would empty as those Uber cars would be driving around. Also, I don't mind car sharing so long as I don't have to wait. Uber could easily plan trips that pick up and drop off without having to wait like you do for more traditional public transport such as trains and buses...
  - majewsky 11y ago
    Fascinating. And fun fact: I'm 26 and I don't have a driver's license. So do many of my peers. I totally rely on public transit (save for the few occasions where I need to move furniture etc.). Public transit service is exceptionally good and reliable in most of Germany's big towns.

therein 11y ago

Unless you live in an area with lots of Superchargers or if your works place has electric car charging stations. I feel like that's the reason why so many people that I work with get Teslas.

OopsCriticality 11y ago
I thought Tesla sent out letters to people using Superchargers for daily charging, clarifying that they were intended for long-distance travel.
jonknee 11y ago
It's probably more likely that you work with a lot of high-income males who are interested in the technology of Tesla and the prestige of owning one.
- ams6110 11y ago
  I live in an area where electric vehicles (and particularly Teslas) are very uncommon. The couple of people I know of who own Teslas fit your description exactly. They are status symbols and playthings, like any other expensive high-line car (and I'm not saying that's a bad thing, just the reality).

yuhong 11y ago

Yea, but for those that can charge at home, it is better than having to pay a gas station.

dsr_ 11y ago
Right up until the day that you unexpectedly have to drive somewhere that is (a) at the limit of your range, (b) not accessible otherwise and (c) doesn't have convenient chargers. This is interestingly close to the Kozmo/PeaPod/whatever on-demand grocery delivery problem: as long as you only have to service high population densities, you can make a profit. As soon as you try to handle suburbs, the costs of providing service increase at a rate larger than the square of the radius you are trying to serve - and nobody wants to pay that, and the urban core won't subsidize the suburban outliers until you've already dominated the market.

nacs 11y ago

How many people living in a flat with no garage own a > $70-100K car? It seems to me like people who're buying a car in that price range would either own a house or at least have access to a garage.

buro9 11y ago
That sounds like a very US view. It's fairly common in London to not have a garage, and even if you do then there is unlikely to be any power there. Most likely is on-street parking, and that's assuming you're not in a flat.
- rstupek 11y ago
  So it sounds like an all electric vehicle may simply not be for them.
  - gutnor 11y ago
    People living in densely populated area should be the prime target for zero emission cars. And that is a problem cities can solve. There is no problem to hook a few power plug on the street ( eg: BMW had a strategy for cheap, small charging station specifically target to create a large number of slow power point. ) Beside the cost, European cities are keener on getting rid of cars entirely, so they are reducing the number of parking spaces as years goes by, so you may be right after all, the zero emission solution for people living where I live is to not have a car at all ( which is, to be fair, not at all unrealistic. There is a strong possibility that the technologies to solve my few "not conveniently covered by public transport" will come from some sort of rental/uber before electric car is actually practical where I live )
samstave 11y ago
Bullshit, just go around any single place in san Francisco. Even just thinking of my brother in law and his wife both make $150k+ live in a condo in sf and even with their garage, they would not be able to install power at their parking spots.