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Countries without a "sovereign" or other government, like Somalia, still use money. Some people have been known to use laundry detergent as a currency since it

Countries without a "sovereign" or other government, like Somalia, still use money. Some people have been known to use laundry detergent as a currency since it lasts for a long time, is relatively expensive, and is inherently useful.

dools 11y ago
Currency in Somalia was a complete failure until there was a federal government and a central bank again: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Somali_shilling#Modern_history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Somali_shilling#Modern_history there is no currency without government, only commodities.
- reality_czech 11y ago
  Shrug. And which central government issues laundry detergent? Your argument is circular-- if it's issued by a government, you call it a currency. If it's not, you don't, regardless of how people use it. By the way, the position that you're taking that taxation creates money is called monetarism. It peaked in the 1970s and has been discredited in mainstream economics ever since. The reality is that people create government, and people create money, not the other way around. Just to be clear, I'm not some big bitcoin propnent. Bitcoin is an interesting experiment but I'm keeping my US dollars.
  - dools 11y ago
    No, the position that I'm taking that taxation drives demand for currency is a core tenet of Modern Monetary Theory which is starkly in opposition to Monetarism on almost all issues[1][2]. Monetarism is the basis of the neoliberal agenda which enjoys near perfect adoption all over the world. It is the mainstream. Austrian economics is mainstream amongst "conservatives" and MMT is on the fringe of everything because it sounds too conservative to be progressive and too progressive to be conservative (and yet contains the most complete description of how currency works out of any of them!) [1] http://www.amazon.com/Modern-Money-Theory-Macroeconomics-Sovereign/dp/0230368891 http://www.amazon.com/Modern-Money-Theory-Macroeconomics-Sov... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0zEbo8PIPSc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0zEbo8PIPSc

dools 11y ago

Currency in Somalia was a complete failure until there was a federal government and a central bank again: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Somali_shilling#Modern_history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Somali_shilling#Modern_history there is no currency without government, only commodities.

reality_czech 11y ago
Shrug. And which central government issues laundry detergent? Your argument is circular-- if it's issued by a government, you call it a currency. If it's not, you don't, regardless of how people use it. By the way, the position that you're taking that taxation creates money is called monetarism. It peaked in the 1970s and has been discredited in mainstream economics ever since. The reality is that people create government, and people create money, not the other way around. Just to be clear, I'm not some big bitcoin propnent. Bitcoin is an interesting experiment but I'm keeping my US dollars.
- dools 11y ago
  No, the position that I'm taking that taxation drives demand for currency is a core tenet of Modern Monetary Theory which is starkly in opposition to Monetarism on almost all issues[1][2]. Monetarism is the basis of the neoliberal agenda which enjoys near perfect adoption all over the world. It is the mainstream. Austrian economics is mainstream amongst "conservatives" and MMT is on the fringe of everything because it sounds too conservative to be progressive and too progressive to be conservative (and yet contains the most complete description of how currency works out of any of them!) [1] http://www.amazon.com/Modern-Money-Theory-Macroeconomics-Sovereign/dp/0230368891 http://www.amazon.com/Modern-Money-Theory-Macroeconomics-Sov... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0zEbo8PIPSc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0zEbo8PIPSc