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I'm trying to achieve currently what it seems you have already achieved. The problem is I cut everything out, but then there will be a moment at work where you'

I'm trying to achieve currently what it seems you have already achieved. The problem is I cut everything out, but then there will be a moment at work where you're waiting for something (in my job for example, waiting for RHEL to install), and you decide to glance at Facebook. Then you do it a couple of times. Then you get home and decide as it's raining you won't go cycling. It all builds back up and I'm back to square one. It feels like trying to kick smoking. I have a list of stuff I want to do (fix up my motorbikes, finish my 'day van', get back in to DH mountain biking) and a list of stuff I do (video games, drink, NetFlix, Reddit), and I always seep back to the latter one. Might give it another go soon, life is short after all.

jfaucett 11y ago
I think the biggest thing is to start very small. Seriously, very very small. I had for years done more or less what you describe. So I finally just decided to start super baby simple and have one tiny little goal and accomplish it. For me it was hard to eliminate looking up my news sites when I had a free minute or two. Eventually, I just deleted my bookmarks and edited my /etc/hosts and that did the trick for me. But I didn't try to cut out those distractions and start a workout routine at the same time. Also I didn't try to start anything else until the last goal had become kind of routine (like brushing your teeth in the morning). There are still many things on my list to see and do and there's still stress in my life, but I feel with this method of one micro step at a time you slowly chip away in unnoticeable steps until now for me a little over a year later you've made a big noticeable dent. oh yea, I finally quit smoking too :) EDIT: most of my goals also had to do with eliminating stress. For instance, my "learning the language" was to just turn on the radio and listen to interesting talk shows in swedish and occasionally look up words, all which was very relaxing for me. My exercise is swimming which is super enjoyable for me and something I always look forward to (even when I didn't have the time to do it). I don't know what it would be like if you do not actually look forward to or enjoy your goals...
- greggman 11y ago
  Does that fact that you're here on HN suggest that it's not quite working? I ask because HN is my biggest time sync. It's the thing I grab whenever there is a moment of free time and even when their isn't. I type it into my browser without even thinking about it. I banned it once with /etc/hosts and that lasted about 3 months or maybe it was 6. I'd still read on my phone but that wouldn't happen except out and about or at bathroom breaks. Then at some point I turned it back on. When it got bad again I blocked it in /etc/hosts. But, it's available in a VM. I'd hoped that would be enough to discourage me but it's not. Instead my habit now is to launch the VM. It is slightly better than unblocked because I still type it into my main browser and the block keeps me off until I eventually use the VM I'd guess I spent 2-4 hours a day on it. I woke up a 8:30 today. Other than a shower I've been on HN. It's 10:10
  - mbrock 11y ago
    Virtue ethics could be a useful framework for thinking about it. Alasdair MacIntyre in After Virtue talks about the concept of a tradition as forming a narrative backbone for a person's life and actions. Conversation is also crucial, and traditions can be seen as extended conversations. I suggest that Hacker News is a place where such a tradition is constructed and maintained. It gives rise to an "imagined community" [2] of this profession of startup development (which is tied into the tradition of open source hacking in interesting ways, sometimes conflicting). In that sense browsing HN is not merely a bad habit. Maybe the negative tendency is to become a more passive participant, or just gossiping all day. Ideally the site would feed into a larger pattern of creative action, instead of only providing some click buzz relaxation. So we could think about how to use the conversation to give wind to our sails, so to speak—or just how to be more active in the actual tradition, not just the discussion surrounding it. That's a big discussion and I've already spent an hour writing this comment, after deleting a long and boring explanation of the MacIntyre book's thesis... So I'll just say that Cal Newport's new book Deep Work was pretty inspiring for me, and it's a quick read. I think you could formulate a dialectic where deep work and community conversation feed into each other. It's like how books are the deep artifacts that conversations can orient themselves around, and the books themselves are like concentrated results of sometimes decades-long conversations. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/After_Virtue https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/After_Virtue [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imagined_community https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imagined_community [3]: http://calnewport.com/books/deep-work/ http://calnewport.com/books/deep-work/
alexandercrohde 11y ago
I think every human can identify with this. I think it's time for us to start questioning if we really "Want" to do these things so much (exercise) why we don't do them. Do we just want to have done them (it'd sure be nice if I had a nice bod, I should workout. I should learn 12 languages and 3 instruments too!)? Or do we think we want them? Or is there some perverse reason why our body keeps us from doing what we truly want to do in that moment?

jfaucett 11y ago

I think the biggest thing is to start very small. Seriously, very very small. I had for years done more or less what you describe. So I finally just decided to start super baby simple and have one tiny little goal and accomplish it. For me it was hard to eliminate looking up my news sites when I had a free minute or two. Eventually, I just deleted my bookmarks and edited my /etc/hosts and that did the trick for me. But I didn't try to cut out those distractions and start a workout routine at the same time. Also I didn't try to start anything else until the last goal had become kind of routine (like brushing your teeth in the morning). There are still many things on my list to see and do and there's still stress in my life, but I feel with this method of one micro step at a time you slowly chip away in unnoticeable steps until now for me a little over a year later you've made a big noticeable dent. oh yea, I finally quit smoking too :) EDIT: most of my goals also had to do with eliminating stress. For instance, my "learning the language" was to just turn on the radio and listen to interesting talk shows in swedish and occasionally look up words, all which was very relaxing for me. My exercise is swimming which is super enjoyable for me and something I always look forward to (even when I didn't have the time to do it). I don't know what it would be like if you do not actually look forward to or enjoy your goals...

greggman 11y ago
Does that fact that you're here on HN suggest that it's not quite working? I ask because HN is my biggest time sync. It's the thing I grab whenever there is a moment of free time and even when their isn't. I type it into my browser without even thinking about it. I banned it once with /etc/hosts and that lasted about 3 months or maybe it was 6. I'd still read on my phone but that wouldn't happen except out and about or at bathroom breaks. Then at some point I turned it back on. When it got bad again I blocked it in /etc/hosts. But, it's available in a VM. I'd hoped that would be enough to discourage me but it's not. Instead my habit now is to launch the VM. It is slightly better than unblocked because I still type it into my main browser and the block keeps me off until I eventually use the VM I'd guess I spent 2-4 hours a day on it. I woke up a 8:30 today. Other than a shower I've been on HN. It's 10:10
- mbrock 11y ago
  Virtue ethics could be a useful framework for thinking about it. Alasdair MacIntyre in After Virtue talks about the concept of a tradition as forming a narrative backbone for a person's life and actions. Conversation is also crucial, and traditions can be seen as extended conversations. I suggest that Hacker News is a place where such a tradition is constructed and maintained. It gives rise to an "imagined community" [2] of this profession of startup development (which is tied into the tradition of open source hacking in interesting ways, sometimes conflicting). In that sense browsing HN is not merely a bad habit. Maybe the negative tendency is to become a more passive participant, or just gossiping all day. Ideally the site would feed into a larger pattern of creative action, instead of only providing some click buzz relaxation. So we could think about how to use the conversation to give wind to our sails, so to speak—or just how to be more active in the actual tradition, not just the discussion surrounding it. That's a big discussion and I've already spent an hour writing this comment, after deleting a long and boring explanation of the MacIntyre book's thesis... So I'll just say that Cal Newport's new book Deep Work was pretty inspiring for me, and it's a quick read. I think you could formulate a dialectic where deep work and community conversation feed into each other. It's like how books are the deep artifacts that conversations can orient themselves around, and the books themselves are like concentrated results of sometimes decades-long conversations. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/After_Virtue https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/After_Virtue [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imagined_community https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imagined_community [3]: http://calnewport.com/books/deep-work/ http://calnewport.com/books/deep-work/

alexandercrohde 11y ago

I think every human can identify with this. I think it's time for us to start questioning if we really "Want" to do these things so much (exercise) why we don't do them. Do we just want to have done them (it'd sure be nice if I had a nice bod, I should workout. I should learn 12 languages and 3 instruments too!)? Or do we think we want them? Or is there some perverse reason why our body keeps us from doing what we truly want to do in that moment?