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So, that 2008 white Macbook my girlfriend bought only got new OS updates for 3 years, which was a pretty big bummer. I agree that the support time was too shor

So, that 2008 white Macbook my girlfriend bought only got new OS updates for 3 years, which was a pretty big bummer. I agree that the support time was too short, but this is not the complete picture. OS X Lion was the last version that runs on the 2008 MacBook and received security updates until October 2014, so the model was supported for 6 years. In the end, her LCD started to short out anyway -- a common issue with Macbooks of that era -- so we got her a basic Toshiba laptop for about 1/2 the price of a Mac. It's still humming along nicely and I just dropped an SSD in it to give it a huge speed bump. You are doing it wrong ;). The resale value of MacBooks is very high. My wife usually gets my current MacBook after 1.5 years and we sell her old MacBook. We usually get 600-700 Euro. 400 Euro for using a MacBook for three years in total is not bad... The resale value for Windows laptops is typically bad. There is a company across the street where they sell 3-4 year old ThinkPads for 300 Euro.

JohnTHaller 11y ago
Security updates and the ability to run the latest OS are very different things, especially in Mac-land. Unlike Windows software which generally runs on a very wide range of versions, most Mac apps assume users are only running more recent releases. For example, Firefox runs Windows versions up to 14 years ago (Windows XP, which isn't even supported by Microsoft any more) but only on Mac OS X within the last 6 years (OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard). Couple that with the fact that it is very difficult to determine when Apple drops support for a given version of OS X because they have no published schedule and don't officially announce when they drop support of a specific version. In short, the equivalent 2008 Windows laptop is still getting security updates for the OS it came with, works with nearly all major Windows software, and can be updated to the latest version of Windows without much fuss. The 2008 Macbook is running an unsupported version of OS X, can't be upgraded to the current version of OS X, and can't run quite a lot of Mac software. Windows vs Mac resale value plays a lot into the way Windows folks use their laptops. The reason is that they generally use a given laptop until they no longer need it. My girlfriend's laptop will be 5 years old this year and was purchased for about the same amount of money it cost you to use your Macbook for 3 years. I spent another ~US$100 to upgrade to an SSD recently which will give it quite a bit more life. And it can be upgraded to Windows 10 for free if we want to at some point. Granted, it's only used for web browsing, office suite stuff, watching videos, recording and editing voice-over work etc, so it doesn't need to be the latest and greatest. So, it's really more a different use case. Your typical pattern of buy and sell is kind of fascinating to me as a Windows user, but makes complete sense given the comparable markets and models. The wider array of Windows laptop choices in different budgets accounts for the lower resale value of higher end Windows laptops. Most users are fine spending $400 or less on a Windows laptop for the basic browsing, email, photos, videos, etc needs. High end Windows laptop users want a new machine, not a used one. So, there's not much interest in $500 used Windows laptops... they don't serve either market segment well. In Mac-land, there is no $400-500 Mac laptop option, so anyone with only that budget has to look at used models. Thus, the demand keeps the cost for a used Macbook high compared to Windows laptops. In the end, I think we're both doing it right for our needs :)
- Bud 11y ago
  Misleading. You're pointing to XP as a 14-year-old product. But who runs unpatched XP from 14 years ago? Nobody. It would be idiotic and even less secure than running somewhat-patched XP. This isn't even a real difference, just one created by the fact that Microsoft never bothered changing the name of XP when it was patched beyond all recognition.
  - JohnTHaller 11y ago
    As it was automatically upgraded with no charge to the end user from one service pack to another it is a single product in the context of this discussion. For comparison, at the time, Apple charged for each subsequent point release of OS X despite them often being roughly equivalent to a Windows service pack. Upgrading Mac OS X versions before Mavericks still requires payment today.

JohnTHaller 11y ago

Security updates and the ability to run the latest OS are very different things, especially in Mac-land. Unlike Windows software which generally runs on a very wide range of versions, most Mac apps assume users are only running more recent releases. For example, Firefox runs Windows versions up to 14 years ago (Windows XP, which isn't even supported by Microsoft any more) but only on Mac OS X within the last 6 years (OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard). Couple that with the fact that it is very difficult to determine when Apple drops support for a given version of OS X because they have no published schedule and don't officially announce when they drop support of a specific version. In short, the equivalent 2008 Windows laptop is still getting security updates for the OS it came with, works with nearly all major Windows software, and can be updated to the latest version of Windows without much fuss. The 2008 Macbook is running an unsupported version of OS X, can't be upgraded to the current version of OS X, and can't run quite a lot of Mac software. Windows vs Mac resale value plays a lot into the way Windows folks use their laptops. The reason is that they generally use a given laptop until they no longer need it. My girlfriend's laptop will be 5 years old this year and was purchased for about the same amount of money it cost you to use your Macbook for 3 years. I spent another ~US$100 to upgrade to an SSD recently which will give it quite a bit more life. And it can be upgraded to Windows 10 for free if we want to at some point. Granted, it's only used for web browsing, office suite stuff, watching videos, recording and editing voice-over work etc, so it doesn't need to be the latest and greatest. So, it's really more a different use case. Your typical pattern of buy and sell is kind of fascinating to me as a Windows user, but makes complete sense given the comparable markets and models. The wider array of Windows laptop choices in different budgets accounts for the lower resale value of higher end Windows laptops. Most users are fine spending $400 or less on a Windows laptop for the basic browsing, email, photos, videos, etc needs. High end Windows laptop users want a new machine, not a used one. So, there's not much interest in $500 used Windows laptops... they don't serve either market segment well. In Mac-land, there is no $400-500 Mac laptop option, so anyone with only that budget has to look at used models. Thus, the demand keeps the cost for a used Macbook high compared to Windows laptops. In the end, I think we're both doing it right for our needs :)

Bud 11y ago
Misleading. You're pointing to XP as a 14-year-old product. But who runs unpatched XP from 14 years ago? Nobody. It would be idiotic and even less secure than running somewhat-patched XP. This isn't even a real difference, just one created by the fact that Microsoft never bothered changing the name of XP when it was patched beyond all recognition.
- JohnTHaller 11y ago
  As it was automatically upgraded with no charge to the end user from one service pack to another it is a single product in the context of this discussion. For comparison, at the time, Apple charged for each subsequent point release of OS X despite them often being roughly equivalent to a Windows service pack. Upgrading Mac OS X versions before Mavericks still requires payment today.