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If you sell a device that monitors heart rates, and that device doesn't properly monitor heart rates... then you need to fix it or stop making it. I don't see w

If you sell a device that monitors heart rates, and that device doesn't properly monitor heart rates... then you need to fix it or stop making it. I don't see why that is unfair? If I buy a desk lamp and it doesn't work reliably then you sold me a lemon and I want my money back. It doesn't matter why I need light on my desk.

sparky_z 11y ago
For a measurement device, "accurate" and "reliable" aren't binary conditions, they're continuums. Not every sensor in the world has to be medical grade. There are plenty of applications where a less accurate sensor at a much lower price point is the right choice. Remember, I'm talking about situations where the company actually says "not for medical/diagnostic use". They're not trying to get away with selling lemons. To use your analogy: If I sell you a small LED (say for use as a power indicator on a computer) and you try to use it as a desk lamp, you shouldn't be able to sue me on the grounds that "you should have known I was going to use it as a desk lamp and made it fit for that purpose". That's what seems unfair to me.
- TeMPOraL 11y ago
  That's technically fair, but everyone knows it's not what's going there. A small LED equivalent of a heart rate monitor is your optical mouse hacked into being a crude pulse oximeter. By the way, you know your mouse is also a 1-D camera / scanner, and can be used to somewhat digitize something? They totally advertise it as a working heart rate monitor. If they have a problem with accuracy, they should not be making it. Otherwise it's like making a tape measure that has marked distances within +/- 20% of the real value (i.e. 1cm becomes anything from 0.8cm to 1.2cm), and marking it with a small caption that it's not for construction use. Oh, and having the product website say "it measures distance" and elaborate on the benefits of measurements for building stuff. -- I'm conflicted about it. On the one hand, I feel like people should be free to build whatever trinkets their like (as long as they are safe). OTOH, I feel like they should totally not be free to sell crap tools.
  - flubert 11y ago
    >your mouse is also a 1-D camera / scanner, and can be used to somewhat digitize something? On a totally unrelated note, the image sensors in optical mice are actually low-resolution (16x16) 2D arrays. https://pickandplace.wordpress.com/2012/05/16/2d-positioning-hacking-an-optical-mouse/ https://pickandplace.wordpress.com/2012/05/16/2d-positioning...

sparky_z 11y ago

For a measurement device, "accurate" and "reliable" aren't binary conditions, they're continuums. Not every sensor in the world has to be medical grade. There are plenty of applications where a less accurate sensor at a much lower price point is the right choice. Remember, I'm talking about situations where the company actually says "not for medical/diagnostic use". They're not trying to get away with selling lemons. To use your analogy: If I sell you a small LED (say for use as a power indicator on a computer) and you try to use it as a desk lamp, you shouldn't be able to sue me on the grounds that "you should have known I was going to use it as a desk lamp and made it fit for that purpose". That's what seems unfair to me.

TeMPOraL 11y ago
That's technically fair, but everyone knows it's not what's going there. A small LED equivalent of a heart rate monitor is your optical mouse hacked into being a crude pulse oximeter. By the way, you know your mouse is also a 1-D camera / scanner, and can be used to somewhat digitize something? They totally advertise it as a working heart rate monitor. If they have a problem with accuracy, they should not be making it. Otherwise it's like making a tape measure that has marked distances within +/- 20% of the real value (i.e. 1cm becomes anything from 0.8cm to 1.2cm), and marking it with a small caption that it's not for construction use. Oh, and having the product website say "it measures distance" and elaborate on the benefits of measurements for building stuff. -- I'm conflicted about it. On the one hand, I feel like people should be free to build whatever trinkets their like (as long as they are safe). OTOH, I feel like they should totally not be free to sell crap tools.
- flubert 11y ago
  >your mouse is also a 1-D camera / scanner, and can be used to somewhat digitize something? On a totally unrelated note, the image sensors in optical mice are actually low-resolution (16x16) 2D arrays. https://pickandplace.wordpress.com/2012/05/16/2d-positioning-hacking-an-optical-mouse/ https://pickandplace.wordpress.com/2012/05/16/2d-positioning...