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This goes to bit of tangent: "In my opinion, we are, unfortunately, a people who define ourselves not by who we are but by who we are not." That's the only re

by vlehto 11y ago

This goes to bit of tangent: "In my opinion, we are, unfortunately, a people who define ourselves not by who we are but by who we are not." That's the only recipe of identity that I'm aware of. Personal identity seems to be just bunch of descriptions you assume. For you to be "good at math" someone has to be bad at math, or the description is meaningless. National identity is just some approximate lowest common denominator of similar sort. The best we can do is to avoid putting ourselves on good - bad axle and try to find descriptions that are different and neutral.

minhanoi 11y ago
I agree that the expression is confusing. It looks like they are unable to define themselves.
- vlehto 11y ago
  I'd like to respectfully disagree. Statements like that do come from lack of conscious definition of identity. Which for a nation is only possible if there is very strong emotional identity. Then there is no need. About 86% of Vietnamese are ethnic Vietnamese. I come from similar country and recently visited JFK airport. The fuss Americans have with the flag seems like compensating for something nations like mine have naturally. It's probably manifesting the difference between civic state and nation state.
- coldtea 11y ago
  I'd say both you and the parent have misunderstood that. Of course defining yourself by what you're not is essential to the notion of identity. But that's a general platitude too, when "the thing you're not" is something like "bad at math". What TFA meant was that the Vietnamese define their themselves more from having resisted those enemies and fought those struggles, so, in another way to put it, as a fighting, determined and stubborn nation -- as opposed to other, non conflict oriented national characteristics (e.g. americans are self defined as "individualists", italians as passionate, german as hard working and logical etc, which are not things that stem from conflict as is the case with the Vietnamese).

by vlehto 11y ago

minhanoi 11y ago

I agree that the expression is confusing. It looks like they are unable to define themselves.

vlehto 11y ago
I'd like to respectfully disagree. Statements like that do come from lack of conscious definition of identity. Which for a nation is only possible if there is very strong emotional identity. Then there is no need. About 86% of Vietnamese are ethnic Vietnamese. I come from similar country and recently visited JFK airport. The fuss Americans have with the flag seems like compensating for something nations like mine have naturally. It's probably manifesting the difference between civic state and nation state.
coldtea 11y ago
I'd say both you and the parent have misunderstood that. Of course defining yourself by what you're not is essential to the notion of identity. But that's a general platitude too, when "the thing you're not" is something like "bad at math". What TFA meant was that the Vietnamese define their themselves more from having resisted those enemies and fought those struggles, so, in another way to put it, as a fighting, determined and stubborn nation -- as opposed to other, non conflict oriented national characteristics (e.g. americans are self defined as "individualists", italians as passionate, german as hard working and logical etc, which are not things that stem from conflict as is the case with the Vietnamese).