4 ms·

>I must have misunderstood this somehow, because this is just too idiotic otherwise. You did misunderstood. Belgium incorrectly offered tax aid to companies an

by frigg 11y ago

>I must have misunderstood this somehow, because this is just too idiotic otherwise. You did misunderstood. Belgium incorrectly offered tax aid to companies and now it's required to rectify it, hence said companies must pay what is legally required.

golergka 11y ago
> Belgium incorrectly offered tax aid to companies and now it's required to rectify it, OK, that's reasonable. > hence said companies must pay what is legally required. And here I get a huge WTF. If someone gave me money that he couldn't give me (for example, he stole it), I'm not required to give it back — he is. Why isn't Belgium held responsible for it's actions?
- FeepingCreature 11y ago
  > If someone gave me money that he couldn't give me (for example, he stole it) What's happening here is that the person never had the legal right to give you that money. So you're in factual possession of money that you don't - can't - legally own.
- tremon 11y ago
  I think it's a matter of framing the issue. Tax deals and rebates are already subject to reinterpretation. Even personal income tax can be re-evaluated later (up to seven years in NL, I believe). This is not a fine, it is a tax correction. These happen all the time, especially with complex tax structures that multinational businesses use.
  - golergka 11y ago
    Oh. OK, this explanation finally makes sense to me. Thanks.
  - xbmcuser 11y ago
    Corporations also usually keep aside some profits resulting from tax breaks or incentives in case they are overturned in the future with the change of government or interpretation of laws.
- tomp 11y ago
  > If someone gave me money that he couldn't give me (for example, he stole it), I'm not required to give it back — he is. Actually, this is not how the world works. If you buy stolen goods, you're liable, and they can be taken away from you (in Italy, you can actually get fined for buying stolen goods!)
  - golergka 11y ago
    > you can actually get fined for buying stolen goods! I think you can be fined for _knowingly_ buying stolen goods everywhere. But what about stolen money? That could've gone away in series of thousands of transactions with thousands of counter-agents since it was stolen?
    - mehwoot 11y ago
      In the country I live in, if you are in possession of stolen goods and the owner can prove they were stolen, they are entitled to the goods back. Doesn't matter how many transactions it went through or how hard you tried to determine if they were stolen. It's up to you as the buyer to verify it. I suspect it is the same in most places. If someone gave me money that he couldn't give me (for example, he stole it), I'm not required to give it back — he is. Another example is banks- sometimes it comes up that banks accidentally credit people's accounts with huge sums in error. This money does not belong to those people, and if they withdraw it, the banks can take legal action to get it back.
- Aoyagi 11y ago
  In the Czech Republic, if you buy a stolen car and the police finds out it's was stolen, it will be taken from you. No refunds.
- pjc50 11y ago
  US analogy: imagine that Texas said you didn't have to pay Federal income tax. After a couple of years of wrangling, this gets ruled unconstitutional. Would you expect to have to pay the back taxes? (it doesn't quite map across directly, because EU federalism is less central than US federalism; in particular the EU has no direct tax powers, and we haven't had the Federalism civil war yet)
  - lugus35 11y ago
    You can't make an US analogy as countries of UE have deliberately joined the UE and can quit UE in a click of the fingers has no UE army will invade and rule the freed country.
    - pjc50 11y ago
      I don't think Belgium can exactly quit in a snap of their fingers; besides, I did say it wasn't an exact analogy, and this is what I meant by "we haven't had the federalism civil war yet". Trying to quit the EU is unknown territory, especially for countries that are part of the monetary union (Greece passim)
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
- SeanDav 11y ago
  > "And here I get a huge WTF. If someone gave me money that he couldn't give me (for example, he stole it), I'm not required to give it back — he is." It has to be like that or laundering stolen money/goods becomes trivially easy - just give it to a third party and later on they give it back to you or to an entity that would benefit you.

by frigg 11y ago

golergka 11y ago

> Belgium incorrectly offered tax aid to companies and now it's required to rectify it, OK, that's reasonable. > hence said companies must pay what is legally required. And here I get a huge WTF. If someone gave me money that he couldn't give me (for example, he stole it), I'm not required to give it back — he is. Why isn't Belgium held responsible for it's actions?

FeepingCreature 11y ago
> If someone gave me money that he couldn't give me (for example, he stole it) What's happening here is that the person never had the legal right to give you that money. So you're in factual possession of money that you don't - can't - legally own.
tremon 11y ago
I think it's a matter of framing the issue. Tax deals and rebates are already subject to reinterpretation. Even personal income tax can be re-evaluated later (up to seven years in NL, I believe). This is not a fine, it is a tax correction. These happen all the time, especially with complex tax structures that multinational businesses use.
- golergka 11y ago
  Oh. OK, this explanation finally makes sense to me. Thanks.
- xbmcuser 11y ago
  Corporations also usually keep aside some profits resulting from tax breaks or incentives in case they are overturned in the future with the change of government or interpretation of laws.
tomp 11y ago
> If someone gave me money that he couldn't give me (for example, he stole it), I'm not required to give it back — he is. Actually, this is not how the world works. If you buy stolen goods, you're liable, and they can be taken away from you (in Italy, you can actually get fined for buying stolen goods!)
- golergka 11y ago
  > you can actually get fined for buying stolen goods! I think you can be fined for _knowingly_ buying stolen goods everywhere. But what about stolen money? That could've gone away in series of thousands of transactions with thousands of counter-agents since it was stolen?
  - mehwoot 11y ago
    In the country I live in, if you are in possession of stolen goods and the owner can prove they were stolen, they are entitled to the goods back. Doesn't matter how many transactions it went through or how hard you tried to determine if they were stolen. It's up to you as the buyer to verify it. I suspect it is the same in most places. If someone gave me money that he couldn't give me (for example, he stole it), I'm not required to give it back — he is. Another example is banks- sometimes it comes up that banks accidentally credit people's accounts with huge sums in error. This money does not belong to those people, and if they withdraw it, the banks can take legal action to get it back.
Aoyagi 11y ago
In the Czech Republic, if you buy a stolen car and the police finds out it's was stolen, it will be taken from you. No refunds.
pjc50 11y ago
US analogy: imagine that Texas said you didn't have to pay Federal income tax. After a couple of years of wrangling, this gets ruled unconstitutional. Would you expect to have to pay the back taxes? (it doesn't quite map across directly, because EU federalism is less central than US federalism; in particular the EU has no direct tax powers, and we haven't had the Federalism civil war yet)
- lugus35 11y ago
  You can't make an US analogy as countries of UE have deliberately joined the UE and can quit UE in a click of the fingers has no UE army will invade and rule the freed country.
  - pjc50 11y ago
    I don't think Belgium can exactly quit in a snap of their fingers; besides, I did say it wasn't an exact analogy, and this is what I meant by "we haven't had the federalism civil war yet". Trying to quit the EU is unknown territory, especially for countries that are part of the monetary union (Greece passim)
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
SeanDav 11y ago
> "And here I get a huge WTF. If someone gave me money that he couldn't give me (for example, he stole it), I'm not required to give it back — he is." It has to be like that or laundering stolen money/goods becomes trivially easy - just give it to a third party and later on they give it back to you or to an entity that would benefit you.