2 ms·

Ouch... Guess that answers it definitively then. Shame that if someone wants to learn, they have to resort to copyright infringement...

the-dude 11y ago
Odd conclusion.
- Karunamon 11y ago
  How so? There are no legal resources for acquiring Z/OS as a student without paying absurd (for a student) prices. You could take a class for cheaper, but formal classes are poor substitute for interacting with the system on your own terms. (Ask any programmer)
  - the-dude 11y ago
    You seem to reason that anything that is not available on your terms is fair game for piracy. IBM can do whatever they like with their IP.
    - jerf 11y ago
      I believe the point is that if you want to play with it, your only choice is piracy, not that you must pirate it. Since, in practice, nobody's going to pirate it either, that means there's no way to learn about it on your own. That's shutting down a very big free training mechanism for IBM, though it's probably too late to do anything about that now.
      - the-dude 11y ago
        Oh thanks for pointing that out.
    - pflanze 11y ago
      Karunamon didn't imply it to be fair game, he stated that it's too expensive to afford for learning for most people, which seems to be a simple fact. He also stated that it's a shame, which can mean either that it's a shame that you can't learn, or a shame that you're to infringe, and if taken to mean the latter that makes it seem like you're actually in violent agreement with him.
ksherlock 11y ago
Seems like a good startup opportunity -- z/OS as a service. Buy the $5000 license and then rent it out to users for $10 a month. Maybe the terms don't allow it? Fuck them. Disruption, baby!
- marktangotango 11y ago
  There were places around that rent time. There was also a place offering free accounts, I don't even remember the name now. There's one hell of a learning curve, makes it really hard to do anything other than poke around when you don't know the params to code in a jcl to compile a program. My first gig was mainframe cobol, the company put everyone thru a 3 month training program, that's the only reason I know anything about it.

the-dude 11y ago

Odd conclusion.

Karunamon 11y ago
How so? There are no legal resources for acquiring Z/OS as a student without paying absurd (for a student) prices. You could take a class for cheaper, but formal classes are poor substitute for interacting with the system on your own terms. (Ask any programmer)
- the-dude 11y ago
  You seem to reason that anything that is not available on your terms is fair game for piracy. IBM can do whatever they like with their IP.
  - jerf 11y ago
    I believe the point is that if you want to play with it, your only choice is piracy, not that you must pirate it. Since, in practice, nobody's going to pirate it either, that means there's no way to learn about it on your own. That's shutting down a very big free training mechanism for IBM, though it's probably too late to do anything about that now.
    - the-dude 11y ago
      Oh thanks for pointing that out.
  - pflanze 11y ago
    Karunamon didn't imply it to be fair game, he stated that it's too expensive to afford for learning for most people, which seems to be a simple fact. He also stated that it's a shame, which can mean either that it's a shame that you can't learn, or a shame that you're to infringe, and if taken to mean the latter that makes it seem like you're actually in violent agreement with him.

ksherlock 11y ago

Seems like a good startup opportunity -- z/OS as a service. Buy the $5000 license and then rent it out to users for $10 a month. Maybe the terms don't allow it? Fuck them. Disruption, baby!

marktangotango 11y ago
There were places around that rent time. There was also a place offering free accounts, I don't even remember the name now. There's one hell of a learning curve, makes it really hard to do anything other than poke around when you don't know the params to code in a jcl to compile a program. My first gig was mainframe cobol, the company put everyone thru a 3 month training program, that's the only reason I know anything about it.