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We shouldn't get upset. Karma is a &itch. Look how much fun France and Europe is having with all those hungry masses flowing in. Nor should we surprised Franc

by irixusr 11y ago

We shouldn't get upset. Karma is a &itch. Look how much fun France and Europe is having with all those hungry masses flowing in. Nor should we surprised France allowed her colonies independence (without a bloody fight she was certainly going to loose), on the condition that they used the franc (technically the convertible franc). This would enable France and French companies cheap access to African resources, that is continue what colonialism had been doing <- stealing African resources to subsidize France. Also, it would prop up the franc as France continued to print money to finance her welfare state (not a judgement on the merits of a welfare state, just a fact that the French weren't taxing enough to afford it). We shouldn't be too hard with the French though. The Americans largely do the same (see how quickly the leader of an oil producing country is deposed is he declares to ditch the dollar). The Brits gave their empire to the Americans to piggy back off this.

falsestprophet 11y ago
"The Americans largely do the same (see how quickly the leader of an oil producing country is deposed is he declares to ditch the dollar). The Brits gave their empire to the Americans to piggy back off this." This petrodollar conspiracy is baffling. Countries don't hold dollars primarily to buy oil. The oil and gas industry is only about 4.6% to 6.5% of the global economy. Countries hold reserve currencies to manage the exchange rate of their currency. Petrodollar conspiracists would be well served by learning about foreign exchange reserves. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign-exchange_reserves https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign-exchange_reserves And in any case, only 65% of foreign currency reserves are in the USD. Furthermore, research shows that being the world's primary reserve currency affords the United States negligible advantage: 0.3 to 0.5 percent of US GDP in a normal year. See: http://www.mckinsey.com/insights/economic_studies/an_exorbitant_privilege http://www.mckinsey.com/insights/economic_studies/an_exorbit... Compare that to the costs of "deposing the leader of an oil producing country": $6 trillion for the Iraq war or about 36% of GDP See: http://www.reuters.com/article/us-iraq-war-anniversary-idUSBRE92D0PG20130314 http://www.reuters.com/article/us-iraq-war-anniversary-idUSB...
- irixusr 11y ago
  "is only about 4.6% to 6.5% of the global economy." You think that's a trivial amount? 4 to 7 % of all human activity is oil or gas? That includes agriculture, weapons consumer goods, all construction, all construction materials, all other mining, all electronics, all automotive, all other energy, all entertainment, all education, all communications, all pharmaceuticals, all illegal drugs, all human trafficking, etc. just 4 or 7%? ! As to the Petro dollar conspiracy,i didn't talk about that (not in regards to the dollar anyway), just mentioned the longevity of those who walk away from the buck. But you brought up some numbers... To your point that trillions were spent on Iraq, you're confusing the time line. In 2003 we were told, the war was going to cost a few hundred billion. And that the Iraqis, so grateful to their liberators, would pay for it with their oil. Didn't pan out, it never does, but our actions can only be based on our current beliefs, not our future ones. We thought the war would be short and free (remember Bush's "mission accomplished" photo op in 2003). 0.5% of the American GDP is 90 billion, with an NPV of 36 trillion (calculated using the, admittedly the current 0.25%). Chump change indeed. That's a tremendous amount of wealth. As to the foreign exchange, 65% are U.S. dollars, while the U.S. is less than one fifth of the world economy. Bit of an unbalance, no ?
aruggirello 11y ago
> Look how much fun France and Europe is having with all those hungry masses flowing in. Most of the fun is probably in Italy and Greece, though France has its share since the fireworks are of course in Paris. > France allowed her colonies independence Except that Libya wasn't, and has never been, a French colony. It was Italy's until 1945.
- flak48 11y ago
  If you had actually read the linked document, you would realize that it suggests that the motives of the French in overthrowing Gaddafi was to prevent him introducing a new currency in Francophone African countries, which would have loosened France's grip on them. No one is suggesting Libya was a French colony.
IndianAstronaut 11y ago
Even worse was France's protection of the dictator Omar Bongo in Gabon. He was protected from from being overthrown and democracy restricted as long as he kept his markets open primarily to France.

by irixusr 11y ago

falsestprophet 11y ago

"The Americans largely do the same (see how quickly the leader of an oil producing country is deposed is he declares to ditch the dollar). The Brits gave their empire to the Americans to piggy back off this." This petrodollar conspiracy is baffling. Countries don't hold dollars primarily to buy oil. The oil and gas industry is only about 4.6% to 6.5% of the global economy. Countries hold reserve currencies to manage the exchange rate of their currency. Petrodollar conspiracists would be well served by learning about foreign exchange reserves. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign-exchange_reserves https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign-exchange_reserves And in any case, only 65% of foreign currency reserves are in the USD. Furthermore, research shows that being the world's primary reserve currency affords the United States negligible advantage: 0.3 to 0.5 percent of US GDP in a normal year. See: http://www.mckinsey.com/insights/economic_studies/an_exorbitant_privilege http://www.mckinsey.com/insights/economic_studies/an_exorbit... Compare that to the costs of "deposing the leader of an oil producing country": $6 trillion for the Iraq war or about 36% of GDP See: http://www.reuters.com/article/us-iraq-war-anniversary-idUSBRE92D0PG20130314 http://www.reuters.com/article/us-iraq-war-anniversary-idUSB...

irixusr 11y ago
"is only about 4.6% to 6.5% of the global economy." You think that's a trivial amount? 4 to 7 % of all human activity is oil or gas? That includes agriculture, weapons consumer goods, all construction, all construction materials, all other mining, all electronics, all automotive, all other energy, all entertainment, all education, all communications, all pharmaceuticals, all illegal drugs, all human trafficking, etc. just 4 or 7%? ! As to the Petro dollar conspiracy,i didn't talk about that (not in regards to the dollar anyway), just mentioned the longevity of those who walk away from the buck. But you brought up some numbers... To your point that trillions were spent on Iraq, you're confusing the time line. In 2003 we were told, the war was going to cost a few hundred billion. And that the Iraqis, so grateful to their liberators, would pay for it with their oil. Didn't pan out, it never does, but our actions can only be based on our current beliefs, not our future ones. We thought the war would be short and free (remember Bush's "mission accomplished" photo op in 2003). 0.5% of the American GDP is 90 billion, with an NPV of 36 trillion (calculated using the, admittedly the current 0.25%). Chump change indeed. That's a tremendous amount of wealth. As to the foreign exchange, 65% are U.S. dollars, while the U.S. is less than one fifth of the world economy. Bit of an unbalance, no ?

aruggirello 11y ago

> Look how much fun France and Europe is having with all those hungry masses flowing in. Most of the fun is probably in Italy and Greece, though France has its share since the fireworks are of course in Paris. > France allowed her colonies independence Except that Libya wasn't, and has never been, a French colony. It was Italy's until 1945.

flak48 11y ago
If you had actually read the linked document, you would realize that it suggests that the motives of the French in overthrowing Gaddafi was to prevent him introducing a new currency in Francophone African countries, which would have loosened France's grip on them. No one is suggesting Libya was a French colony.

IndianAstronaut 11y ago

Even worse was France's protection of the dictator Omar Bongo in Gabon. He was protected from from being overthrown and democracy restricted as long as he kept his markets open primarily to France.