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"It's pretty ruthless exploitation" If Uber drivers are being "exploited", why don't they quit? Because no one else would give them a better job, presumably. B

"It's pretty ruthless exploitation" If Uber drivers are being "exploited", why don't they quit? Because no one else would give them a better job, presumably. But that seems perverse to blame on Uber. All they're doing is giving drivers a better deal than they would otherwise get. Suppose your father got cancer, and you decided to sell your grand piano to get some money for treatment. All the other buyers offer $1,000 for the piano, and then I come and offer $1,500. $1,500 isn't enough to pay for cancer treatment, of course, but it'd be crazy to say I was "exploiting" you - I'm giving you a better deal than anyone else would. The problem is the cancer, not the piano buyers, and certainly not me.

SilasX 11y ago
It's the Copenhagen Interpretation of Ethics[1]: if you interact with it, you inherit its evil, irrespective of your actual impact on the scenario. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10367855 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10367855
ZenoArrow 11y ago
> "If Uber drivers are being "exploited", why don't they quit?" My impression is that driving a taxi is a useful side income for people, as they can fit it around other commitments. For example, if someone has a job as a waiter at a restaurant, but needs to make some extra money on the side to pay their rent/living expenses, then they could take a job with Uber to supplement their income. However, a job that fills a financial necessity can still be exploitative. For example, when it comes to Uber, there's not much in the way of job security. Furthermore, whilst people could theoretically quit, a theoretical new job doesn't put food on the table.
gizmo 11y ago
A typical reason they don't just quit is that they need a new car to work for Uber in the first place, which they can get using their xchange program[1] that gives them a large monthly obligation[2]. They can get this even when they don't qualify for a regular car lease because they have bad credit/no income. So they have to work many hours just to get to the 0 point after which they start to earn money for themselves. If they quit they're stuck with the lease, which they cannot afford to pay and makes no sense for them to have with any other low paying job. So the lease serves as lock in -- bondage -- of the worker to Uber, even though they're technically not employees. I think being indebted to your employer in this way is barbaric. Disclaimer: I heard this, haven't verified it myself. [1] https://get.uber.com/cl/xchange/ https://get.uber.com/cl/xchange/ [2] Lease cost. Taxes. Fuel. Insurance.
- apsec112 11y ago
  The page you linked says drivers aren't locked into the lease, which would indeed be bad. "Flexible leases from Xchange Leasing, LLC are 36 months with the flexibility to return the vehicle after 30 days with a two week notice and a $250 disposition fee."
bambax 11y ago
Your line of reasoning can be used to justify child labor or indeed, child prostitution -- or really, anything... and it has. The point of society is, or should be, to make sure that its people do not fall in a situation so dire that any deal is a better deal.
- argonaut 11y ago
  No it can't, because there are additional factors in play that you've ignored, such as lack of cognitive ability to make adult decisions, and the general social contract that the state takes care of neglected children (foster care).

SilasX 11y ago

It's the Copenhagen Interpretation of Ethics[1]: if you interact with it, you inherit its evil, irrespective of your actual impact on the scenario. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10367855 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10367855

ZenoArrow 11y ago

> "If Uber drivers are being "exploited", why don't they quit?" My impression is that driving a taxi is a useful side income for people, as they can fit it around other commitments. For example, if someone has a job as a waiter at a restaurant, but needs to make some extra money on the side to pay their rent/living expenses, then they could take a job with Uber to supplement their income. However, a job that fills a financial necessity can still be exploitative. For example, when it comes to Uber, there's not much in the way of job security. Furthermore, whilst people could theoretically quit, a theoretical new job doesn't put food on the table.

gizmo 11y ago

A typical reason they don't just quit is that they need a new car to work for Uber in the first place, which they can get using their xchange program[1] that gives them a large monthly obligation[2]. They can get this even when they don't qualify for a regular car lease because they have bad credit/no income. So they have to work many hours just to get to the 0 point after which they start to earn money for themselves. If they quit they're stuck with the lease, which they cannot afford to pay and makes no sense for them to have with any other low paying job. So the lease serves as lock in -- bondage -- of the worker to Uber, even though they're technically not employees. I think being indebted to your employer in this way is barbaric. Disclaimer: I heard this, haven't verified it myself. [1] https://get.uber.com/cl/xchange/ https://get.uber.com/cl/xchange/ [2] Lease cost. Taxes. Fuel. Insurance.

apsec112 11y ago
The page you linked says drivers aren't locked into the lease, which would indeed be bad. "Flexible leases from Xchange Leasing, LLC are 36 months with the flexibility to return the vehicle after 30 days with a two week notice and a $250 disposition fee."

bambax 11y ago

Your line of reasoning can be used to justify child labor or indeed, child prostitution -- or really, anything... and it has. The point of society is, or should be, to make sure that its people do not fall in a situation so dire that any deal is a better deal.

argonaut 11y ago
No it can't, because there are additional factors in play that you've ignored, such as lack of cognitive ability to make adult decisions, and the general social contract that the state takes care of neglected children (foster care).