5 ms·

MSG in the US may be on labels in a variety of different ways, including "yeast extract". Why does something that is considered to not have any adverse effects

MSG in the US may be on labels in a variety of different ways, including "yeast extract". Why does something that is considered to not have any adverse effects labeled differently other than to confuse the consumer? I myself am a gout sufferer, and MSG is one of my triggers. I didn't realise what was causing me to always have a bout of gout after eating Chinese food, so I would change what I ordered, what I ate to try and figure it out. Ultimately I started cooking my favourite dishes at home, using pre-made sauces bought at the store (they didn't mention MSG after all, and I had no idea that yeast extract was the same thing). The restaurant near me claimed they did not cook with MSG, however the manufacturer for their soy sauce used for stir frying apparently added yeast extract (MSG by another name) and they were not aware of it. These days I end up cooking at home more, which is probably healthier and better for my wallet in the long term.

itp 11y ago
> Why does something that is considered to not have any adverse effects labeled differently other than to confuse the consumer? One good reason might be if there were an unfounded stigma attached to one of the names. Rapeseed has many common names in the English language[0]; what are they trying to hide?! (In large measure, the unfortunate connotation of rapey-ness.) [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rapeseed#Common_names https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rapeseed#Common_names
tptacek 11y ago
Again: there is no debate that MSG is stigmatized in the US. You can't draw conclusions from that! All sorts of things are stigmatized that shouldn't be, and there are other things that aren't stigmatized that probably should be. I'll ask you the same thing I've asked the other two people on this thread who've reported personal experience with MSG sensitivity. Have you tried the things I listed here? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10866718 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10866718 I ask because, again, it would be pretty fascinating to find a sensitivity to MSG that wasn't correlated with a sodium or glutamate sensitivity. MSG instantaneously breaks into sodium and glutamate in liquid (such as in your stomach).
- X-Istence 11y ago
  I don't have any issues with salt at all. I have absolutely nothing against MSG, and have in the past loved eating food with MSG in it. It took me months of trial and error to figure out that MSG was the common ingredient that was causing me my pain. > Another question to ask yourself: do you get headaches when you eat blue cheese, parmesan, mushrooms, or tomatoes? Those are naturally intense sources of glutamic acid. Other than mushrooms (which I also avoid religiously), none of the others listed cause gout for me. Things that cause my gout relentlessly and quickly: asparagus, beans, legumes (peanuts included), mushrooms, MSG, bacon (specifically nitrites in it), pork (yes, I know bacon is pork), whey proteins, and almonds.
  - tptacek 11y ago
    It's not that I don't believe you that there are foods with MSG in them that trigger symptoms. But if you can eat a couple of tomatoes without triggering symptoms, it doesn't sound like it's the glutamate that's doing it. And MSG is just sodium and glutamate; it dissolves instantly in water.
    - X-Istence 11y ago
      I eat at most a half tomato at once in a salad or on a burger. I am not a big fan of tomato based sauces (for pasta/pizza) because they are too acidic for my tastes.
ucha 11y ago
Do you restrict your consumption of MSG rich food like tomatoes, potatoes, walnuts? They contain a few hundreds mg per 100g which is probably more than what you'd get from soy sauce.
- X-Istence 11y ago
  Tomatoes, I haven't had issues with, but I rarely eat them in very large quantities. I do stay away from nuts, almonds, walnuts, peanuts due to getting attacks, and don't consume a lot of potatoes due to the carbs.
  - tptacek 11y ago
    3 tomatoes have about the same amount of glutamate as the average prepared dish with MSG added. 3 tomatoes sounds like a lot, but tomatoes are mostly water, and if you're eating a prepared dish where tomatoes are a strong flavor (like tomato sauce), you're getting a lot of glutamate.
    - X-Istence 11y ago
      Not a big fan of tomato based sauces, they are too acidic for my tastes generally. At most I eat half a tomato sliced for with a salad or on a burger.
dsp1234 11y ago
Why does something that is considered to not have any adverse effects labeled differently other than to confuse the consumer? From the FDA website[0]: "How can I know if there is MSG in my food?" "FDA requires that foods containing added MSG list it in the ingredient panel on the packaging as monosodium glutamate. However, MSG occurs naturally in ingredients such as hydrolyzed vegetable protein, autolyzed yeast, hydrolyzed yeast, yeast extract, soy extracts, and protein isolate, as well as in tomatoes and cheeses. While FDA requires that these products be listed on the ingredient panel, the agency does not require the label to also specify that they naturally contain MSG. However, foods with any ingredient that naturally contains MSG cannot claim “No MSG” or “No added MSG” on their packaging. MSG also cannot be listed as “spices and flavoring.”"
jobu 11y ago
It's really crazy how common MSG is, and as a result it can be very difficult to diagnose an allergy. A friend of mine has a severe reaction to MSG (diarrhea, skin lesions, etc.), and it took years of misery before he figured out the cause. It's found naturally in many foods you wouldn't expect (pears, cucumbers, tomatoes), and other times companies add it to unexpected items (Dole sprays it on bananas).
- tptacek 11y ago
  Wait what Dole sprays glutamic acid on bananas? How would that even work? Is it absorbed through the peel or something? To what end? Can you provide a link?
  - jobu 11y ago
    Not sure what they do actually. It could be a fertilizer, spray, or some other process, but somehow they end up with glutamic acid in the banana. Other brands aren't usually a problem, and often organic Dole is fine as well. Based on the downvotes, people either think I'm full of shit or crazy, but what can say other than he has the same problem with Dole bananas as other high MSG foods.
    - tptacek 11y ago
      All bananas have glutamic acid in them.

itp 11y ago

> Why does something that is considered to not have any adverse effects labeled differently other than to confuse the consumer? One good reason might be if there were an unfounded stigma attached to one of the names. Rapeseed has many common names in the English language[0]; what are they trying to hide?! (In large measure, the unfortunate connotation of rapey-ness.) [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rapeseed#Common_names https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rapeseed#Common_names

tptacek 11y ago

Again: there is no debate that MSG is stigmatized in the US. You can't draw conclusions from that! All sorts of things are stigmatized that shouldn't be, and there are other things that aren't stigmatized that probably should be. I'll ask you the same thing I've asked the other two people on this thread who've reported personal experience with MSG sensitivity. Have you tried the things I listed here? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10866718 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10866718 I ask because, again, it would be pretty fascinating to find a sensitivity to MSG that wasn't correlated with a sodium or glutamate sensitivity. MSG instantaneously breaks into sodium and glutamate in liquid (such as in your stomach).

X-Istence 11y ago
I don't have any issues with salt at all. I have absolutely nothing against MSG, and have in the past loved eating food with MSG in it. It took me months of trial and error to figure out that MSG was the common ingredient that was causing me my pain. > Another question to ask yourself: do you get headaches when you eat blue cheese, parmesan, mushrooms, or tomatoes? Those are naturally intense sources of glutamic acid. Other than mushrooms (which I also avoid religiously), none of the others listed cause gout for me. Things that cause my gout relentlessly and quickly: asparagus, beans, legumes (peanuts included), mushrooms, MSG, bacon (specifically nitrites in it), pork (yes, I know bacon is pork), whey proteins, and almonds.
- tptacek 11y ago
  It's not that I don't believe you that there are foods with MSG in them that trigger symptoms. But if you can eat a couple of tomatoes without triggering symptoms, it doesn't sound like it's the glutamate that's doing it. And MSG is just sodium and glutamate; it dissolves instantly in water.
  - X-Istence 11y ago
    I eat at most a half tomato at once in a salad or on a burger. I am not a big fan of tomato based sauces (for pasta/pizza) because they are too acidic for my tastes.

ucha 11y ago

Do you restrict your consumption of MSG rich food like tomatoes, potatoes, walnuts? They contain a few hundreds mg per 100g which is probably more than what you'd get from soy sauce.

X-Istence 11y ago
Tomatoes, I haven't had issues with, but I rarely eat them in very large quantities. I do stay away from nuts, almonds, walnuts, peanuts due to getting attacks, and don't consume a lot of potatoes due to the carbs.
- tptacek 11y ago
  3 tomatoes have about the same amount of glutamate as the average prepared dish with MSG added. 3 tomatoes sounds like a lot, but tomatoes are mostly water, and if you're eating a prepared dish where tomatoes are a strong flavor (like tomato sauce), you're getting a lot of glutamate.
  - X-Istence 11y ago
    Not a big fan of tomato based sauces, they are too acidic for my tastes generally. At most I eat half a tomato sliced for with a salad or on a burger.

dsp1234 11y ago

Why does something that is considered to not have any adverse effects labeled differently other than to confuse the consumer? From the FDA website[0]: "How can I know if there is MSG in my food?" "FDA requires that foods containing added MSG list it in the ingredient panel on the packaging as monosodium glutamate. However, MSG occurs naturally in ingredients such as hydrolyzed vegetable protein, autolyzed yeast, hydrolyzed yeast, yeast extract, soy extracts, and protein isolate, as well as in tomatoes and cheeses. While FDA requires that these products be listed on the ingredient panel, the agency does not require the label to also specify that they naturally contain MSG. However, foods with any ingredient that naturally contains MSG cannot claim “No MSG” or “No added MSG” on their packaging. MSG also cannot be listed as “spices and flavoring.”"

jobu 11y ago

It's really crazy how common MSG is, and as a result it can be very difficult to diagnose an allergy. A friend of mine has a severe reaction to MSG (diarrhea, skin lesions, etc.), and it took years of misery before he figured out the cause. It's found naturally in many foods you wouldn't expect (pears, cucumbers, tomatoes), and other times companies add it to unexpected items (Dole sprays it on bananas).

tptacek 11y ago
Wait what Dole sprays glutamic acid on bananas? How would that even work? Is it absorbed through the peel or something? To what end? Can you provide a link?
- jobu 11y ago
  Not sure what they do actually. It could be a fertilizer, spray, or some other process, but somehow they end up with glutamic acid in the banana. Other brands aren't usually a problem, and often organic Dole is fine as well. Based on the downvotes, people either think I'm full of shit or crazy, but what can say other than he has the same problem with Dole bananas as other high MSG foods.
  - tptacek 11y ago
    All bananas have glutamic acid in them.