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In my opinion, the most frustrating part is that despite our hyperconnectedness, people still believe the propaganda that we're not in a depression or that our
by xlm1717 11y ago
In my opinion, the most frustrating part is that despite our hyperconnectedness, people still believe the propaganda that we're not in a depression or that our leaders got us out of the recession. Future economists will call the decade the "longest depression" not out of 20/20 hindsight, but simply because there will no longer be a need to make things seem rosy.
- jsn117 11y agoThe terms "depression" and "recession" aren't just catch alls, they have actual definitions. And "we" (depending on the country, i'm assuming USA) are not in either.
- paulpauper 11y agodepression/recession has now been redefined to mean 'economy is not how we want it to be'
- AnimalMuppet 11y agoNo. They haven't been redefined. They are used that way by people who are ignorant of the definitions, careless, or trying to mislead.
- venomsnake 11y agoDepends. If you look at the bottom 90% and their economy - we are in depression. Or extremely deep recession. The top 10% are both capturing the lion's share of new growth and siphoning wealth from the rest.
- dcd0101 11y agoNo. It doesn't depend. As he said, those words have actual definitions.
- venomsnake 11y agoYeah but USA is having two economies right now that are masked as one in statistics.
- sanderjd 11y agoPut another way: the proposition is that the current definitions of those words might not be as useful as they once were because assumptions implicit in them have changed.
- rm_-rf_slash 11y agoIf anything the story of communication has been one of ever greater methods to spread disinformation. Russians are swarmed on social media with paid shills for the government, and it makes it almost impossible to discern a genuine opinion or paid propaganda. I doubt there is a single person who is truly immune to misinformation, except perhaps the Beatles' "Fool on the Hill."
- cryoshon 11y agoFortifying myself against propaganda is one of my perpetual personal development projects... the internet is probably the most difficult information media for this task.
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- CaptSpify 11y ago> people still believe the propaganda that we're not in a depression Is there a source for this? Everyone I know believes that we still are in a depression, so it's probably just my social circles. I'd be interested to see the stats behind that.
- rm_-rf_slash 11y agoThe housing costs alone in high growth cities like San Francisco, Portland, Seattle, and so on should be enough to show that for many people, things are just fine. At least, for them. The longer things work out for you financially, the less of a problem you see around you. That's the difference between seeing a homeless person and thinking "how unfortunate that the vulnerable fall through the cracks in such a rich society and have to fend for themselves to survive" and "get a job, you bum!"
- CaptSpify 11y agoThat's what is interesting to me: Most of the people I hear complain about it are in those cities, and they are doing just fine. But someone can be doing OK, and still believe the country is not.
- bmm6o 11y agoWhat is the basis for everyone you know believing this? "Depression" has an objective definition that objectively doesn't currently hold. Do they not believe the reported numbers of the GDP, or are they using their own incorrect definition of the term?
- CaptSpify 11y agoDisclaimer: I am not an economist. Some of their discussions go well above my head, so it's possible I'm mis-understanding\mis-interpreting what they say. This is also why I'm curious as to a source. The one thing I hear a lot is: The statistics we are using to measure this are BS. One example: We don't account for people who are under-employed, which is important to note in long-term depressions such as this one. The other things I typically hear are quite anecdotal: "I have family in Rnowheresville, $some_state, and they have no jobs out there!"
- skylan_q 11y agoWe already have a "long depression" in the history books: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Depression https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Depression unemployment stayed low, very slight deflation persisted, and over the 30 years GDP per capita and GDP of the US grew considerably.
- mywittyname 11y agoThe propaganda is the statement that we are in a depression. We are NOT in a depression, nor a recession and have not been for several years. So, in fact, historians will not at all call this period a depression. More likely, they will look back and wonder why so many people thought things were bad when, by all objective measurements, things were actually quite good. Low inflation, low commodities prices, decent wage growth, cheap housing, strong stock growth, a huge surplus of investment capital.
- JBReefer 11y agoDoes no one remember how negative everyone was at the height of the boom in 2007? We look back on that period as a time of incredible prosperity, but I remember it was basically the same as today: everyone complaining about everything.
- mixmastamyk 11y ago> decent wage growth, cheap housing These are not the case in California, where the opposite is unfortunately true.
- AnimalMuppet 11y agoBut still too high unemployment. That's why people feel like it's still a recession.