11 ms·

How to fend off a jerk

184 points by daveJSF 11y ago

bobsgame 11y ago
This is unfortunately rewarding poor behavior with extra attention- it's teaching people that they get better service when they are rude. In a face-to-face position, this might be a good coping strategy where the confrontation is temporary and unavoidable. On the web, it's best not to engage with rude users at all, since they will continue coming back and learn to expect attention from negative behavior. Try to only engage with polite and positive users.
- DarkTree 11y ago
  Indeed, there should be a dichotomy between real life and the web when using this strategy, but again, I think this strategy is more about increasing your own happiness then it is to diminish theirs.
- eseehausen 11y ago
  Honestly, when somebody who isn't a subordinate, friend, or direct charge acts like a jerk, I don't think it's worth taking this kind of pedagogical role with regard to etiquette (probably not a good idea in the friends case a lot of time as well). If somebody wants to be a jerk, there are enough providers of goods and services that they'll find one that responds favorably to that. Not to mention that they'll probably rationalize turning them away as the provider being a jerk rather than learning something from it. As DarkTree points out, the provider's response to that behavior is more about managing the provider's quality of life than about shaping customers for the greater good.
- ryukafalz 11y ago
  Sometimes it's not possible to just avoid people, even on the web - I worked online customer support for a while and we had to respond to every request. This tactic works well for those types of situations.
- edoloughlin 11y ago
  The principle I think you're hinting at here is one of reinforcing good behaviour and extinguishing bad behaviour, à la Skinner. However, this can only be done over time, with repeated interactions. The mechanism described in the article doesn't seek to alter the behaviour of the customers, each of whom may never be seen again. Rather, it is a defence mechanism for the employee.
noir_lord 11y ago
Have used this approach years ago when I worked retail and it works really well (as an aside working retail for at least a year will give you a sound grasp of customer service and introduce you to the 10/80/10 split, 10% are lovely to deal with, 80% are somewhere in between but fine and 10% are jerks). I also learnt not to take it personally, some times people are having a really bad day for reasons you can't see and a little bit of empathy goes a long way.
- jsprogrammer 11y ago
  If you can't see the reasons for someone's bad day, it is very difficult to empathize with them.
  - eseehausen 11y ago
    That depends on your initial assumptions, which you can shape over time (though you may not want to or find it advantageous to do so).
    - jsprogrammer 11y ago
      Yes, you could engage in a conversation with the individual to better understand their situation. However, in the scenario presented: >some times people are having a really bad day for reasons you can't see and a little bit of empathy goes a long way I don't see how you can have much empathy. Patience, yes. Compassion, yes. Full sharing of feelings, no, purely by the description of the scenario.
      - dsp1234 11y ago
        This is just a case where the person said empathy, but meant sympathy. It's a common mistake to make.
        dktbs 11y ago
        This seems like a good example of this article posted yesterday: https://pchiusano.github.io/2014-10-11/defensive-writing.html https://pchiusano.github.io/2014-10-11/defensive-writing.htm...
theseatoms 11y ago
This is surprisingly easy to pull off, especially if you have good senses of absurdity and perspective. As noir_lord mentions, just don't take it personally.
smarks 11y ago
Very interesting! My question is, does it work in email? At least, it might be worth trying.
- TranquilMarmot 11y ago
  I find trying to be "overly nice" in email can often come off as a little condescending.
  - ntumlin 11y ago
    If someone's being rude to me I don't mind being a little condescending.
- feocco 11y ago
  The problem with acting happy in email is it adds more for the client to read. Most people don't enjoy reading longer emails. Just change/add some little quirks to make it seem like you're happy. Example, instead of Regards, - Say Thanks!
- eseehausen 11y ago
  With email, rather than happiness, amping up the professionalism and courtesy might be an analogue.
- danieltillett 11y ago
  Email is an interesting medium as it is one where if the recipient is in an emotional state then it is completely ineffective. No matter what you write you end up reinforcing the recipients emotional state. There does not seem to be anyway to get a person to calm down and assess the situation rationally via email. I feel the best way to handle a jerk by email is get on the phone and call them if you can.
hockeybias 11y ago
"Kill 'em with kindness!" is what we called it when I was growing up.
mhurron 11y ago
People just ignore me and I'll eventually just wander off.
- mcguire 11y ago
  Sometimes I wander off anyway.
forrestbrazeal 11y ago
This approach only works if the other person realizes they're being rude/obnoxious. If they're not self-aware enough to know that, they're just going to interpret your friendliness as a sign that you enjoy being around them...
- alewi481 11y ago
  This can be a good thing too. I worked at a gas station for a few years, and I had a share of regulars who seemed to have no regard for me as a person by the way they interacted with me. Some things that I would encounter from them included ignoring formalities, getting impatient over mild inconveniences, and generally acting haughty in conversation. I wasn't really in a position to act offended, so I would just follow my routine of acting friendly and saying hello and good-bye to them. Almost every time, after enough repeated interactions like this, it's as though these regulars forgot that they didn't like me. They would see me and light up, or they would eventually thaw out and start putting more consideration into the way they interacted with me. Whatever their inclinations for acting unpleasant may have been, I rarely, if ever, had anyone not come around and act more personable after enough friendly encounters with me.
feocco 11y ago
I would have gone insane years ago if I didn't pick this up. If you remain happy & friendly while being able to explain the reason for any question you ask, no reasonable person can bring you down.
maket 11y ago
I worked at a fast food place back in high school, I often used this approach to a pretty effective degree. The only issue that can arise is when your increasing friendliness causes the person you're dealing with to get irrationally angry and do something rash, such as throw a cup of coffee at you. It was pretty painful, but the laughter the situation induced was a nice distraction.
- markc 11y ago
  I'd imagine that increasing friendliness in such a situation could easily be interpreted as mocking or patronizing (no matter how sincere you are) and in that case the hostile reaction isn't to the friendliness it's to the mis-perception of it.
  - zem 11y ago
    in most cases it is patronising; that's the entire point of how you psychologically "win" the encounter by being friendly to someone who is being a jerk to you.
    - marvin 11y ago
      ...which is why using social manipulation techniques like these area great for working with strangers or people you will never see again, but mostly a bad idea in more permanent relationships. E.g. with colleagues, repeat customers that you want to see again etc.
jamesbowman 11y ago
Yes, upon being insulted the best response is to avoid being insulted. The idea goes back a long way. http://boingboing.net/2010/10/29/twenty-first-century-3.html http://boingboing.net/2010/10/29/twenty-first-century-3.html
pawn 11y ago
I'll probably get flamed for this, but this story reminds me of good ol' Proverbs 25:21,22! If your enemy is hungry, give him food to eat; if he is thirsty, give him water to drink. 22 In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head, and the Lord will reward you.
- JustSomeNobody 11y ago
  Don't worry about the flames: Matthew 5:10-12 "Blessed are those who have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. "Blessed are you when people insult you and persecute you, and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of Me. "Rejoice and be glad, for your reward in heaven is great; for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
  - maqr 11y ago
    As long as we're ignoring the coming inferno... The TL;DR for this post is really this: https://i.imgur.com/3vN06Zz.png https://i.imgur.com/3vN06Zz.png
- bcook 11y ago
  I'd rather just give him water & food while otherwise ignoring his attitude, simply because it is a logical way to defuse the situatuon. I see no need for heaping coals on his head or the promise of someone rewarding me. Regardless of my misinterpretation, I enjoy the passage. :)
  - mdip 11y ago
    What you've stated in your first sentence is a perfect interpretation IMHO. Providing kindness in response to evil diffuses the problem. Some translations adjust that verse contextually to read "Heaping hot coals of shame". The resultant behavior of said evil person, however, can go either way, making "Heaping hot coals" an apt description of a very common (in my life, majority) outcome to that behavior. As in the story, the customer becomes exasperated as the author continues to respond with kindness. Some people like to treat others like crap (especially others who have a job that involves "serving them, the customer") because it allows them to assert power over the other person. I'm not talking about the occasional bad day "taking it out on someone else" and enjoying it, but the kind of person who has to do this all the time to feel good. Those people positively lose their shit when you respond with kindness. In that scenario, you've accidentally put them in a spot of having to admit that you might just be "the better person", so they escalate in hopes that you'll crack. I find the bible most interesting for that latter bit, though. I was brought up in a church that regularly told us what to do but gave only "Because God says so" as the reason. I grew up and left the church entirely as a result. Later in life I was frustrated when I discovered that the advice is usually followed up with "and here's the earthly outcome you can expect if you do this" along with "the Lord will reward you (because He said so)".
drivers99 11y ago
David Burns (in the book "Feeling Good") wrote about the "disarming technique" which is "find some truth in what the other person is saying, even if it seems totally unreasonable or unfair".
joshstrange 11y ago
Now a days I could see that being a nice service while I used my phone but what did people do while their car was being filled up back then? I'd rather be doing something rather than sitting in my car doing nothing...
- rthomas6 11y ago
  I have a pet theory that people had longer attention spans back then and didn't need constant entertainment to distract them from the present moment. Also they listened to the radio and enjoyed not being out in the cold.
- tetraodonpuffer 11y ago
  get out and chat with the attendant usually, at least that's what I used to do when I was living in Europe in a country where self-service was available only after hours. It's not very common to do long trips requiring refueling at the end, so most of the time you go to the same gas station for years and as time goes on you end up making friends with the people there, also considering often gas stations are a lot smaller than here and either just have the owner pumping or max 1-2 rotating additional people. If it's an unfamiliar gas station it really depends, in some cases the attendant will just put the pump in your car and click it so it keeps pumping and go to a different car to get paid in which case you stay inside, but if it's a slow time pre-cellphone days you just got out and chatted for the few minutes it took to refuel
xyzzy4 11y ago
Well the most important thing to remember is the Golden Rule. You should treat others as you would wish to be treated in their situation.
- Joeboy 11y ago
  How do you want to be treated when you're being a dick to service workers for no reason?
  - xyzzy4 11y ago
    Probably with respect?
    - Joeboy 11y ago
      Should I treat gratuitously unpleasant people with more respect than other people?
      - xyzzy4 11y ago
        No, the same amount, but also try to spend less time interacting with them if possible.
        jasonkostempski 11y ago
        I wouldn't want other people trying to spend less time with me.
        xyzzy4 11y ago
        Well the way the universe works is people can't spend time with everyone else concurrently.
        TeMPOraL 11y ago
        I like the version from [0] more - "Do unto others 20% better than you would expect them to do unto you, to correct for subjective error." [0] - http://blog.jaibot.com/ http://blog.jaibot.com/
Joeboy 11y ago
I don't think the defence is really the happiness, it's the appearance of immunity to their behaviour. Which only helps if they're not actually in a position to puncture your defensive bubble. Are you supposed to keep acting happy when the jerk starts being physically violent or stealing your stuff? Edit: Please imagine me smiling broadly despite the downvotes.
- fastball 11y ago
  Well, obviously there is a difference between "trying to piss you off" and "doing shit that is actually illegal".
  - Joeboy 11y ago
    There's only a difference in practice if you have a chance of getting whatever law they're breaking enforced. Also there are bad things people can do that are legal. The technique may work well with people whose only ambition is to be slightly irritating and who aren't particularly committed to that goal.
FiddlerClamp 11y ago
"A soft answer turneth away wrath." - not sure who said it, but I agree. On the other side of the fence, I find that a sympathetic word to a cranky/grumpy cashier or salesperson can really help cheer them up. For example, "Wow, looks like you're having a super-busy day. How's it going?"
- merpnderp 11y ago
  I try to do this every time they look harried. Because you know they're angry that the manager hasn't opened up more lines, or worried the people waiting are mad, or some sort of anxiety. So being friendly and acknowledging their predicament costs you nothing, but can make their day a bit easier.
rdtsc 11y ago
There is even a more general technique -- do the unexpected, to break the expected social protocol. In situations like this, if there is an aggressor (say the customer in this case) they expect a certain outcome. They envision how the interaction will go. "I'll be demanding. Employee will get upset, maybe a bit snippy. I'll yell at them and show them who's boss. Maybe even complain to the manager." But in turn they see a smile, complements ("Oh, what a beautiful Porsche you have!") and willingness to help. They are angry inside but it is hard to manifest it without appearing completely crazy. I've heard of other stuff like this: * In a dangerous part of town and see a bunch of shady people eye you up -- act crazy, mutter to yourself and maybe flail your arms. Friend liked to do this in a bad part of Chicago. * Someone wants to pick an argument and is just contrarian no matter what you say. At first argue a bit, then immediately switch sides and argue against your old position (basically on their side). Also to make it fun, be kind of aggressive and angry at your old position just like they were. * An aggressive panhandler is verbally harassing you asking for money. "No thanks, I'm good. Talk to you on Wednesday". Say it, as matter of fact as possible. Their mind will stop for a bit trying to process that, and it gives you enough time to walk away far enough.
- klenwell 11y ago
  Interesting advice. I don't really work in a dangerous part of town. But there's a group of shiftless young men who constantly pop up here and there. I refer to them as the Meth Head Bicycle Club (MHBC) as they tend to bike around and assemble in small groups at the local McDonald's or Rite-Aid (where AFAICT they take turns shoplifting petty items). The other day I was walking to a nearby restaurant in the area that takes me along a somewhat marginal low-traffic area that borders an older industrial zone. As I'm walking down the road I see a member of what looks like the MHBC biking towards me. As he got closer, I noticed he was audibly muttering random swear words. I didn't feel threatened by it but was obviously on my guard. He biked past without incident and I just concluded he was crazy. But something didn't seem right about that conclusion. Why the bike (which was one of those urban lowrider types and seemed to be in pretty good shape)? Your first bullet point now makes me wonder if this wasn't actually a quite uncrazy deliberate behavior. That would make more sense.
- sdegutis 11y ago
LordKano 11y ago
I use a version of this when dealing with police. Instead of trying to act happy or friendly, I remain as level as possible. Think "Mr. Spock with a smile". I have found that even "huff and puff" types calm down after a minute or so of this.
- seattle_spring 11y ago
  How often are you dealing with police?
  - paki123 11y ago
    How often are YOU dealing with police?
  - Quanticles 11y ago
    Maybe he's a paramedic
    - jf 11y ago
      and/or a minority
      - LordKano 11y ago
        And we have a winner.
  - LordKano 11y ago
    A couple of times a year.
brianberns 11y ago
I use this approach and call it "killing with kindness".
nickjj 11y ago
This works really well for software support too. I have some technology related courses out and I sometimes get people who ask questions in extremely passive-aggressive ways or just have a terrible attitude. I just bombard them with optimism and treat them in the best way I can. Most of the time they will do a full 180 and become very reasonable, sometimes even apologize.
georgehaake 11y ago
Well I read that wrong at first glance.
LulzSect 11y ago
Playing dumb can be effective disarming others who might otherwise percieve you as a threat. Shady character asking you for time, cigarette, etc. "Nah bruh, shit I need one too, you got one? My bad fam." This has gotten me out of questionable situations during the wrong hours out in Brooklyn/Manhattan inner city areas.
squozzer 11y ago
And when you find yourself hanging on a cross or inhaling a liter or two of water in Gitmo, just remember this - https://youtu.be/WlBiLNN1NhQ https://youtu.be/WlBiLNN1NhQ
GCA10 11y ago
There's a beautiful illustration of this principle from the NFL, of all places. When quarterback Andrew Luck gets sacked, he enthusiastically compliments his tackler for a great play. It completely messes up the opponent's psyche, at least according to this darkly funny Wall Street Journal story: http://www.wsj.com/articles/andrew-luck-the-nfls-most-perplexing-trash-talker-1418663249 http://www.wsj.com/articles/andrew-luck-the-nfls-most-perple...
coreymaass 11y ago
I've often used a similar technique driving, but it has backfired. When someone gets angry, flips me off, etc. I will usually wave exuberantly, with a huge smile. Unfortunately making an angry driver angrier gets scary quick.
- Teckla 11y ago
  I've often used a similar technique driving, but it has backfired. When someone gets angry, flips me off, etc. I will usually wave exuberantly, with a huge smile. Unfortunately making an angry driver angrier gets scary quick. Once in a while, I catch myself making some kind of mistake on the road that angers another driver. I really wish there was some kind of international, "Sorry, my bad!" gesture. If there is one, I'm unaware of what it is.
mdip 11y ago
Great read and I've seen this work directly in my life for the 20 years after I heard this advice for the first time. There's no avoiding it. Someone is going to treat you terribly for reasons you don't deserve and most of the time and you can't "patch" the other guy/gal. I was the youngest member of the team by 6 years at the company I started my career[1]. I was treated like a kid (often called a whiz-kid, but not in a flattering way). I worked with sysadmins, several of which had terrible attitudes and all of which were at least 5 years my senior. Three were outright bullies and made me hate a job I would otherwise love. A coworker told me "treat them with undeserved kindness" and quoted a bible verse about it being like "heaping hot coals over them". I wasn't a Christian so the bible didn't have the authority that it held for him, but after a long talk, I understood the usefulness and decided to run with it. It came down to "whether or not the abuse is deserved, you can't make the other guy do something different, you can only control yourself". I became the guy who was kind to "the 3 jerks". I'd find things to do for them -- volunteering to swap tapes, noticing how coffee was taken and bringing an extra back when I refilled[2], twisting received backhanded compliments into compliments (with inappropriate thanks), and apologizing about things they complained to me (and about me others) seeking advice on how to do better[3]. My behavior toward "the jerks" spilled over to everyone else. One of the 3 bullies became my defender and friend (I got the impression he was a jerk to fit in at the time but such is not the case today). I really liked the description of what happens to you when you decide to put this attitude in action. The more you do it the more comical grumpy, angry people become. The phrase "it must suck to be you" sarcastically rang through my head occasionally. The two remaining bullies, however, behaved how I've found most bully-types behave when I'd ceased to be a reliable target. "Heap hot coals" was a perfect description. They became bigger jerks and their behavior spread out to everyone. I was picked for projects over them because I was seen as kind/friendly while they were stereotyped as BOFH. Coworkers saw the undeserved abuse given me by "the jerks". On the same day I received a promotion, they were laid off (and I was told directly that it was due to their terrible attitude and the way myself and my advice giving coworker were treated). I became a much happier person in general. Thinking about it now, it's strange to think that happened because I chose to accept abuse and be kind, but it was. [1] I was 19 doing sysadmin/infrastructure support for a telecom - most of my coworkers were over 25, many over 35. [2] I remember grabbing myself a cup of coffee and filling up another cup for my coworker, prepared the way he always took it, and having him say "sucking up to me, now, are ya?" and then complaining that it had too much sugar. My boss was in the cube next to his at the time and overheard the conversation. He stopped by to apologize for this employee's abuse and asked me why I was being so nice to him. I don't remember my response. [3] This was the only hard part - swallowing my ego. Experience has taught me that Sysadmins/Devs have strong opinions about things that are as important as the color of the bikeshed. I'd be denigrated for not following rules that were unwritten (and not followed by these individuals) and trivial (i.e. tabs vs spaces where "wall of pink" doesn't apply) and having to ask how I could do it "better" while swallowing the screaming in my mind that said "Seriously?! This is what's so important?!!"
xlayn 11y ago
This will be added to my toolbox after some excersicing... If I'm able to do it correctly would be nice. Buuuuut, I have a question: imagine this is a call, and you go by the rule with extreme optimism to an angry customer on the phone, don't you risk in the case of a recording to sound kind of crazy? it should be incredibly natural and well thought and executed... if not you risk being exposed. With that said... isn't this a way of making your employees being nice no mater what?
Mendenhall 11y ago
I will work customer support at a company sometimes just for fun. I work in completely unrelated field but I love the psychology of customer support, to me its a video game with very well created bots. Over 1000+ online chats I have never been given a negative review and any customer can leave one through the live chat feedback. I have never had anyone complain about my service on phone either. A couple things I find key, do not let anyone's words bother you, ever! You are immune to damage from words. To me its like, do I get mad at a video game because the level is hard ? or do I enjoy it because its a challenge. That is probably the hardest part for most people. To me they are "crabby bots" that you want to defuse and brighten their day. I never let someone's mood effect me, I consider that giving someone control over my emotions. They are forcing you to act a certain way by their actions and that to me is losing control, Which I find to be a weakness for many reasons. Once you are immune to them having any effect on your emotions you cannot be dragged down or taken off point, so you operate from a position of power. Then, Empathy, Empathy, Empathy, and personalize your response almost as if you are friends. They are mad because their package is late ? "I am so sorry for that, I cannot stand when my packages are late." They hate that their package is late ? well you realllly hate it when packages are late. They could not reach tech support, called and couldn't reach anyone so they are mad ? "I really have to apologize for that, it is unacceptable, I completely understand why you feel that way". You adopt their sentiment that they are expressing and relate to it. It lets them know you are in their corner. They bash your companies customer service ? you reply with "I cannot stand poor customer service, so I will make sure we get this right because I know how frustrating it can be. It's a game! You take no damage and get to play with someone's mind!! how fun is that! Another subtle thing, Is don't just use copy paste responses that make you sound like a bot. I actually leave some typos and grammar errors in when I do customer support, and use smiles and lol sometimes (makes you human). Remember its your friend who you are talking to and they are trying to give you money, Help them do it.
ap22213 11y ago
Based on the comments here, I'd better practice up on being rude. Seems like I'll get better results.
beloch 11y ago
Not everyone who acts like a jerk (as described) is seeking confrontation. Some people who act like this are simply a rare combination of finicky and totally self-absorbed. If you act happy and bend over backwards to meet their demands, they'll see you as a rare individual worth coming back to again and again and again. Sometimes you really do have to stop smiling and let such people know they're being unreasonable, because they're totally clueless.
kazinator 11y ago
> I sighed and grabbed the squeegee to do his entire window again. You wouldn't last long in Japan if you sighed at customer requests. Hai, sumimasen, and wipe it again. A jerk is what that customer is being today; it's not necessarily what he is.
donatj 11y ago
This is my usual route to any sort of confrontation. Act happy while stating my disagreements. Nothing pisses my wife off more.

184 points by daveJSF 11y ago

This is unfortunately rewarding poor behavior with extra attention- it's teaching people that they get better service when they are rude. In a face-to-face position, this might be a good coping strategy where the confrontation is temporary and unavoidable. On the web, it's best not to engage with rude users at all, since they will continue coming back and learn to expect attention from negative behavior. Try to only engage with polite and positive users.

DarkTree 11y ago
Indeed, there should be a dichotomy between real life and the web when using this strategy, but again, I think this strategy is more about increasing your own happiness then it is to diminish theirs.
eseehausen 11y ago
Honestly, when somebody who isn't a subordinate, friend, or direct charge acts like a jerk, I don't think it's worth taking this kind of pedagogical role with regard to etiquette (probably not a good idea in the friends case a lot of time as well). If somebody wants to be a jerk, there are enough providers of goods and services that they'll find one that responds favorably to that. Not to mention that they'll probably rationalize turning them away as the provider being a jerk rather than learning something from it. As DarkTree points out, the provider's response to that behavior is more about managing the provider's quality of life than about shaping customers for the greater good.
ryukafalz 11y ago
Sometimes it's not possible to just avoid people, even on the web - I worked online customer support for a while and we had to respond to every request. This tactic works well for those types of situations.
edoloughlin 11y ago
The principle I think you're hinting at here is one of reinforcing good behaviour and extinguishing bad behaviour, à la Skinner. However, this can only be done over time, with repeated interactions. The mechanism described in the article doesn't seek to alter the behaviour of the customers, each of whom may never be seen again. Rather, it is a defence mechanism for the employee.

noir_lord 11y ago

Have used this approach years ago when I worked retail and it works really well (as an aside working retail for at least a year will give you a sound grasp of customer service and introduce you to the 10/80/10 split, 10% are lovely to deal with, 80% are somewhere in between but fine and 10% are jerks). I also learnt not to take it personally, some times people are having a really bad day for reasons you can't see and a little bit of empathy goes a long way.

jsprogrammer 11y ago
If you can't see the reasons for someone's bad day, it is very difficult to empathize with them.
- eseehausen 11y ago
  That depends on your initial assumptions, which you can shape over time (though you may not want to or find it advantageous to do so).
  - jsprogrammer 11y ago
    Yes, you could engage in a conversation with the individual to better understand their situation. However, in the scenario presented: >some times people are having a really bad day for reasons you can't see and a little bit of empathy goes a long way I don't see how you can have much empathy. Patience, yes. Compassion, yes. Full sharing of feelings, no, purely by the description of the scenario.
    - dsp1234 11y ago
      This is just a case where the person said empathy, but meant sympathy. It's a common mistake to make.
      - dktbs 11y ago
        This seems like a good example of this article posted yesterday: https://pchiusano.github.io/2014-10-11/defensive-writing.html https://pchiusano.github.io/2014-10-11/defensive-writing.htm...

theseatoms 11y ago

This is surprisingly easy to pull off, especially if you have good senses of absurdity and perspective. As noir_lord mentions, just don't take it personally.

smarks 11y ago

Very interesting! My question is, does it work in email? At least, it might be worth trying.

TranquilMarmot 11y ago
I find trying to be "overly nice" in email can often come off as a little condescending.
- ntumlin 11y ago
  If someone's being rude to me I don't mind being a little condescending.
feocco 11y ago
The problem with acting happy in email is it adds more for the client to read. Most people don't enjoy reading longer emails. Just change/add some little quirks to make it seem like you're happy. Example, instead of Regards, - Say Thanks!
eseehausen 11y ago
With email, rather than happiness, amping up the professionalism and courtesy might be an analogue.
danieltillett 11y ago
Email is an interesting medium as it is one where if the recipient is in an emotional state then it is completely ineffective. No matter what you write you end up reinforcing the recipients emotional state. There does not seem to be anyway to get a person to calm down and assess the situation rationally via email. I feel the best way to handle a jerk by email is get on the phone and call them if you can.

hockeybias 11y ago

"Kill 'em with kindness!" is what we called it when I was growing up.

mhurron 11y ago

People just ignore me and I'll eventually just wander off.

mcguire 11y ago
Sometimes I wander off anyway.

forrestbrazeal 11y ago

This approach only works if the other person realizes they're being rude/obnoxious. If they're not self-aware enough to know that, they're just going to interpret your friendliness as a sign that you enjoy being around them...

alewi481 11y ago
This can be a good thing too. I worked at a gas station for a few years, and I had a share of regulars who seemed to have no regard for me as a person by the way they interacted with me. Some things that I would encounter from them included ignoring formalities, getting impatient over mild inconveniences, and generally acting haughty in conversation. I wasn't really in a position to act offended, so I would just follow my routine of acting friendly and saying hello and good-bye to them. Almost every time, after enough repeated interactions like this, it's as though these regulars forgot that they didn't like me. They would see me and light up, or they would eventually thaw out and start putting more consideration into the way they interacted with me. Whatever their inclinations for acting unpleasant may have been, I rarely, if ever, had anyone not come around and act more personable after enough friendly encounters with me.

feocco 11y ago

I would have gone insane years ago if I didn't pick this up. If you remain happy & friendly while being able to explain the reason for any question you ask, no reasonable person can bring you down.

maket 11y ago

I worked at a fast food place back in high school, I often used this approach to a pretty effective degree. The only issue that can arise is when your increasing friendliness causes the person you're dealing with to get irrationally angry and do something rash, such as throw a cup of coffee at you. It was pretty painful, but the laughter the situation induced was a nice distraction.

markc 11y ago
I'd imagine that increasing friendliness in such a situation could easily be interpreted as mocking or patronizing (no matter how sincere you are) and in that case the hostile reaction isn't to the friendliness it's to the mis-perception of it.
- zem 11y ago
  in most cases it is patronising; that's the entire point of how you psychologically "win" the encounter by being friendly to someone who is being a jerk to you.
  - marvin 11y ago
    ...which is why using social manipulation techniques like these area great for working with strangers or people you will never see again, but mostly a bad idea in more permanent relationships. E.g. with colleagues, repeat customers that you want to see again etc.

jamesbowman 11y ago

Yes, upon being insulted the best response is to avoid being insulted. The idea goes back a long way. http://boingboing.net/2010/10/29/twenty-first-century-3.html http://boingboing.net/2010/10/29/twenty-first-century-3.html

pawn 11y ago

I'll probably get flamed for this, but this story reminds me of good ol' Proverbs 25:21,22! If your enemy is hungry, give him food to eat; if he is thirsty, give him water to drink. 22 In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head, and the Lord will reward you.

JustSomeNobody 11y ago
Don't worry about the flames: Matthew 5:10-12 "Blessed are those who have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. "Blessed are you when people insult you and persecute you, and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of Me. "Rejoice and be glad, for your reward in heaven is great; for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
- maqr 11y ago
  As long as we're ignoring the coming inferno... The TL;DR for this post is really this: https://i.imgur.com/3vN06Zz.png https://i.imgur.com/3vN06Zz.png
bcook 11y ago
I'd rather just give him water & food while otherwise ignoring his attitude, simply because it is a logical way to defuse the situatuon. I see no need for heaping coals on his head or the promise of someone rewarding me. Regardless of my misinterpretation, I enjoy the passage. :)
- mdip 11y ago
  What you've stated in your first sentence is a perfect interpretation IMHO. Providing kindness in response to evil diffuses the problem. Some translations adjust that verse contextually to read "Heaping hot coals of shame". The resultant behavior of said evil person, however, can go either way, making "Heaping hot coals" an apt description of a very common (in my life, majority) outcome to that behavior. As in the story, the customer becomes exasperated as the author continues to respond with kindness. Some people like to treat others like crap (especially others who have a job that involves "serving them, the customer") because it allows them to assert power over the other person. I'm not talking about the occasional bad day "taking it out on someone else" and enjoying it, but the kind of person who has to do this all the time to feel good. Those people positively lose their shit when you respond with kindness. In that scenario, you've accidentally put them in a spot of having to admit that you might just be "the better person", so they escalate in hopes that you'll crack. I find the bible most interesting for that latter bit, though. I was brought up in a church that regularly told us what to do but gave only "Because God says so" as the reason. I grew up and left the church entirely as a result. Later in life I was frustrated when I discovered that the advice is usually followed up with "and here's the earthly outcome you can expect if you do this" along with "the Lord will reward you (because He said so)".

drivers99 11y ago

David Burns (in the book "Feeling Good") wrote about the "disarming technique" which is "find some truth in what the other person is saying, even if it seems totally unreasonable or unfair".

joshstrange 11y ago

Now a days I could see that being a nice service while I used my phone but what did people do while their car was being filled up back then? I'd rather be doing something rather than sitting in my car doing nothing...

rthomas6 11y ago
I have a pet theory that people had longer attention spans back then and didn't need constant entertainment to distract them from the present moment. Also they listened to the radio and enjoyed not being out in the cold.
tetraodonpuffer 11y ago
get out and chat with the attendant usually, at least that's what I used to do when I was living in Europe in a country where self-service was available only after hours. It's not very common to do long trips requiring refueling at the end, so most of the time you go to the same gas station for years and as time goes on you end up making friends with the people there, also considering often gas stations are a lot smaller than here and either just have the owner pumping or max 1-2 rotating additional people. If it's an unfamiliar gas station it really depends, in some cases the attendant will just put the pump in your car and click it so it keeps pumping and go to a different car to get paid in which case you stay inside, but if it's a slow time pre-cellphone days you just got out and chatted for the few minutes it took to refuel

xyzzy4 11y ago

Well the most important thing to remember is the Golden Rule. You should treat others as you would wish to be treated in their situation.

Joeboy 11y ago
How do you want to be treated when you're being a dick to service workers for no reason?
- xyzzy4 11y ago
  Probably with respect?
  - Joeboy 11y ago
    Should I treat gratuitously unpleasant people with more respect than other people?
    - xyzzy4 11y ago
      No, the same amount, but also try to spend less time interacting with them if possible.
      - jasonkostempski 11y ago
        I wouldn't want other people trying to spend less time with me.
        xyzzy4 11y ago
        Well the way the universe works is people can't spend time with everyone else concurrently.
      - TeMPOraL 11y ago
        I like the version from [0] more - "Do unto others 20% better than you would expect them to do unto you, to correct for subjective error." [0] - http://blog.jaibot.com/ http://blog.jaibot.com/

Joeboy 11y ago

I don't think the defence is really the happiness, it's the appearance of immunity to their behaviour. Which only helps if they're not actually in a position to puncture your defensive bubble. Are you supposed to keep acting happy when the jerk starts being physically violent or stealing your stuff? Edit: Please imagine me smiling broadly despite the downvotes.

fastball 11y ago
Well, obviously there is a difference between "trying to piss you off" and "doing shit that is actually illegal".
- Joeboy 11y ago
  There's only a difference in practice if you have a chance of getting whatever law they're breaking enforced. Also there are bad things people can do that are legal. The technique may work well with people whose only ambition is to be slightly irritating and who aren't particularly committed to that goal.

FiddlerClamp 11y ago

"A soft answer turneth away wrath." - not sure who said it, but I agree. On the other side of the fence, I find that a sympathetic word to a cranky/grumpy cashier or salesperson can really help cheer them up. For example, "Wow, looks like you're having a super-busy day. How's it going?"

merpnderp 11y ago
I try to do this every time they look harried. Because you know they're angry that the manager hasn't opened up more lines, or worried the people waiting are mad, or some sort of anxiety. So being friendly and acknowledging their predicament costs you nothing, but can make their day a bit easier.

rdtsc 11y ago

There is even a more general technique -- do the unexpected, to break the expected social protocol. In situations like this, if there is an aggressor (say the customer in this case) they expect a certain outcome. They envision how the interaction will go. "I'll be demanding. Employee will get upset, maybe a bit snippy. I'll yell at them and show them who's boss. Maybe even complain to the manager." But in turn they see a smile, complements ("Oh, what a beautiful Porsche you have!") and willingness to help. They are angry inside but it is hard to manifest it without appearing completely crazy. I've heard of other stuff like this: * In a dangerous part of town and see a bunch of shady people eye you up -- act crazy, mutter to yourself and maybe flail your arms. Friend liked to do this in a bad part of Chicago. * Someone wants to pick an argument and is just contrarian no matter what you say. At first argue a bit, then immediately switch sides and argue against your old position (basically on their side). Also to make it fun, be kind of aggressive and angry at your old position just like they were. * An aggressive panhandler is verbally harassing you asking for money. "No thanks, I'm good. Talk to you on Wednesday". Say it, as matter of fact as possible. Their mind will stop for a bit trying to process that, and it gives you enough time to walk away far enough.

klenwell 11y ago
Interesting advice. I don't really work in a dangerous part of town. But there's a group of shiftless young men who constantly pop up here and there. I refer to them as the Meth Head Bicycle Club (MHBC) as they tend to bike around and assemble in small groups at the local McDonald's or Rite-Aid (where AFAICT they take turns shoplifting petty items). The other day I was walking to a nearby restaurant in the area that takes me along a somewhat marginal low-traffic area that borders an older industrial zone. As I'm walking down the road I see a member of what looks like the MHBC biking towards me. As he got closer, I noticed he was audibly muttering random swear words. I didn't feel threatened by it but was obviously on my guard. He biked past without incident and I just concluded he was crazy. But something didn't seem right about that conclusion. Why the bike (which was one of those urban lowrider types and seemed to be in pretty good shape)? Your first bullet point now makes me wonder if this wasn't actually a quite uncrazy deliberate behavior. That would make more sense.
sdegutis 11y ago

LordKano 11y ago

I use a version of this when dealing with police. Instead of trying to act happy or friendly, I remain as level as possible. Think "Mr. Spock with a smile". I have found that even "huff and puff" types calm down after a minute or so of this.

seattle_spring 11y ago
How often are you dealing with police?
- paki123 11y ago
  How often are YOU dealing with police?
- Quanticles 11y ago
  Maybe he's a paramedic
  - jf 11y ago
    and/or a minority
    - LordKano 11y ago
      And we have a winner.
- LordKano 11y ago
  A couple of times a year.

brianberns 11y ago

I use this approach and call it "killing with kindness".

nickjj 11y ago

This works really well for software support too. I have some technology related courses out and I sometimes get people who ask questions in extremely passive-aggressive ways or just have a terrible attitude. I just bombard them with optimism and treat them in the best way I can. Most of the time they will do a full 180 and become very reasonable, sometimes even apologize.

georgehaake 11y ago

Well I read that wrong at first glance.

LulzSect 11y ago

Playing dumb can be effective disarming others who might otherwise percieve you as a threat. Shady character asking you for time, cigarette, etc. "Nah bruh, shit I need one too, you got one? My bad fam." This has gotten me out of questionable situations during the wrong hours out in Brooklyn/Manhattan inner city areas.

squozzer 11y ago

And when you find yourself hanging on a cross or inhaling a liter or two of water in Gitmo, just remember this - https://youtu.be/WlBiLNN1NhQ https://youtu.be/WlBiLNN1NhQ

GCA10 11y ago

There's a beautiful illustration of this principle from the NFL, of all places. When quarterback Andrew Luck gets sacked, he enthusiastically compliments his tackler for a great play. It completely messes up the opponent's psyche, at least according to this darkly funny Wall Street Journal story: http://www.wsj.com/articles/andrew-luck-the-nfls-most-perplexing-trash-talker-1418663249 http://www.wsj.com/articles/andrew-luck-the-nfls-most-perple...

coreymaass 11y ago

I've often used a similar technique driving, but it has backfired. When someone gets angry, flips me off, etc. I will usually wave exuberantly, with a huge smile. Unfortunately making an angry driver angrier gets scary quick.

Teckla 11y ago
I've often used a similar technique driving, but it has backfired. When someone gets angry, flips me off, etc. I will usually wave exuberantly, with a huge smile. Unfortunately making an angry driver angrier gets scary quick. Once in a while, I catch myself making some kind of mistake on the road that angers another driver. I really wish there was some kind of international, "Sorry, my bad!" gesture. If there is one, I'm unaware of what it is.

mdip 11y ago

Great read and I've seen this work directly in my life for the 20 years after I heard this advice for the first time. There's no avoiding it. Someone is going to treat you terribly for reasons you don't deserve and most of the time and you can't "patch" the other guy/gal. I was the youngest member of the team by 6 years at the company I started my career[1]. I was treated like a kid (often called a whiz-kid, but not in a flattering way). I worked with sysadmins, several of which had terrible attitudes and all of which were at least 5 years my senior. Three were outright bullies and made me hate a job I would otherwise love. A coworker told me "treat them with undeserved kindness" and quoted a bible verse about it being like "heaping hot coals over them". I wasn't a Christian so the bible didn't have the authority that it held for him, but after a long talk, I understood the usefulness and decided to run with it. It came down to "whether or not the abuse is deserved, you can't make the other guy do something different, you can only control yourself". I became the guy who was kind to "the 3 jerks". I'd find things to do for them -- volunteering to swap tapes, noticing how coffee was taken and bringing an extra back when I refilled[2], twisting received backhanded compliments into compliments (with inappropriate thanks), and apologizing about things they complained to me (and about me others) seeking advice on how to do better[3]. My behavior toward "the jerks" spilled over to everyone else. One of the 3 bullies became my defender and friend (I got the impression he was a jerk to fit in at the time but such is not the case today). I really liked the description of what happens to you when you decide to put this attitude in action. The more you do it the more comical grumpy, angry people become. The phrase "it must suck to be you" sarcastically rang through my head occasionally. The two remaining bullies, however, behaved how I've found most bully-types behave when I'd ceased to be a reliable target. "Heap hot coals" was a perfect description. They became bigger jerks and their behavior spread out to everyone. I was picked for projects over them because I was seen as kind/friendly while they were stereotyped as BOFH. Coworkers saw the undeserved abuse given me by "the jerks". On the same day I received a promotion, they were laid off (and I was told directly that it was due to their terrible attitude and the way myself and my advice giving coworker were treated). I became a much happier person in general. Thinking about it now, it's strange to think that happened because I chose to accept abuse and be kind, but it was. [1] I was 19 doing sysadmin/infrastructure support for a telecom - most of my coworkers were over 25, many over 35. [2] I remember grabbing myself a cup of coffee and filling up another cup for my coworker, prepared the way he always took it, and having him say "sucking up to me, now, are ya?" and then complaining that it had too much sugar. My boss was in the cube next to his at the time and overheard the conversation. He stopped by to apologize for this employee's abuse and asked me why I was being so nice to him. I don't remember my response. [3] This was the only hard part - swallowing my ego. Experience has taught me that Sysadmins/Devs have strong opinions about things that are as important as the color of the bikeshed. I'd be denigrated for not following rules that were unwritten (and not followed by these individuals) and trivial (i.e. tabs vs spaces where "wall of pink" doesn't apply) and having to ask how I could do it "better" while swallowing the screaming in my mind that said "Seriously?! This is what's so important?!!"

xlayn 11y ago

This will be added to my toolbox after some excersicing... If I'm able to do it correctly would be nice. Buuuuut, I have a question: imagine this is a call, and you go by the rule with extreme optimism to an angry customer on the phone, don't you risk in the case of a recording to sound kind of crazy? it should be incredibly natural and well thought and executed... if not you risk being exposed. With that said... isn't this a way of making your employees being nice no mater what?

Mendenhall 11y ago

I will work customer support at a company sometimes just for fun. I work in completely unrelated field but I love the psychology of customer support, to me its a video game with very well created bots. Over 1000+ online chats I have never been given a negative review and any customer can leave one through the live chat feedback. I have never had anyone complain about my service on phone either. A couple things I find key, do not let anyone's words bother you, ever! You are immune to damage from words. To me its like, do I get mad at a video game because the level is hard ? or do I enjoy it because its a challenge. That is probably the hardest part for most people. To me they are "crabby bots" that you want to defuse and brighten their day. I never let someone's mood effect me, I consider that giving someone control over my emotions. They are forcing you to act a certain way by their actions and that to me is losing control, Which I find to be a weakness for many reasons. Once you are immune to them having any effect on your emotions you cannot be dragged down or taken off point, so you operate from a position of power. Then, Empathy, Empathy, Empathy, and personalize your response almost as if you are friends. They are mad because their package is late ? "I am so sorry for that, I cannot stand when my packages are late." They hate that their package is late ? well you realllly hate it when packages are late. They could not reach tech support, called and couldn't reach anyone so they are mad ? "I really have to apologize for that, it is unacceptable, I completely understand why you feel that way". You adopt their sentiment that they are expressing and relate to it. It lets them know you are in their corner. They bash your companies customer service ? you reply with "I cannot stand poor customer service, so I will make sure we get this right because I know how frustrating it can be. It's a game! You take no damage and get to play with someone's mind!! how fun is that! Another subtle thing, Is don't just use copy paste responses that make you sound like a bot. I actually leave some typos and grammar errors in when I do customer support, and use smiles and lol sometimes (makes you human). Remember its your friend who you are talking to and they are trying to give you money, Help them do it.

ap22213 11y ago

Based on the comments here, I'd better practice up on being rude. Seems like I'll get better results.

beloch 11y ago

Not everyone who acts like a jerk (as described) is seeking confrontation. Some people who act like this are simply a rare combination of finicky and totally self-absorbed. If you act happy and bend over backwards to meet their demands, they'll see you as a rare individual worth coming back to again and again and again. Sometimes you really do have to stop smiling and let such people know they're being unreasonable, because they're totally clueless.

kazinator 11y ago

> I sighed and grabbed the squeegee to do his entire window again. You wouldn't last long in Japan if you sighed at customer requests. Hai, sumimasen, and wipe it again. A jerk is what that customer is being today; it's not necessarily what he is.

donatj 11y ago

This is my usual route to any sort of confrontation. Act happy while stating my disagreements. Nothing pisses my wife off more.