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OK, we shed no tears for patrons of child abuse. The issue is that once we allow a state agency to trample the 4th amendment for an admittedly noble cause, we o

OK, we shed no tears for patrons of child abuse. The issue is that once we allow a state agency to trample the 4th amendment for an admittedly noble cause, we open the door to these techniques being used to dragnet for violators of any laws, just or not. Why wouldn't the judges who signed these warrants sign similar warrants to catch suspected terrorists? What about people who visit sites that allegedlly support terrorism? What about sites that support illegal activity such as Marijuana cultivation and use? Online piracy? Trading in technology that subverts copyright protection? Welcome to the slippery slope...

stephengillie 11y ago
Speaking of slippery slopes, this "hack" probably falls under the broader meaning of the term. They probably put some kind of Flash banner on the page, and caught all the people with improperly-configured systems.
- mjevans 11y ago
  IE, systems that run arbitrary code by default...
  - jacquesm 11y ago
    > IE Indeed :)
- belorn 11y ago
  It was a javascript vulnerability, CVE-2013-1690. After free of a DocumentViewerImpl object, triggered via an specially crafted web page using onreadystatechange events and the window.stop() API, you could execute arbitrary code. http://resources.infosecinstitute.com/fbi-tor-exploit/ http://resources.infosecinstitute.com/fbi-tor-exploit/
  - Buge 11y ago
    That was the 2013 instance. The FBI did it again in 2015 and that's what this article is about. The article specifically says it's probably different than the 2013 instance.
- Buge 11y ago
  Tor doesn't run flash by default. Also it sounds like Playpen gave information about how to stay safe from the FBI, so I don't know why people would change the Tor settings to enable flash.
jonnybgood 11y ago
> The issue is that once we allow a state agency to trample the 4th amendment for an admittedly noble cause Can you expand on how they broke the 4th? There's nothing that indicates they broke the 4th from what I can see.
- nitrogen 11y ago
  Hacking is sometimes compared to criminal trespass, so when the government does it it's fair to compare it to storming and searching a physical place, which is covered by the 4th.
  - joopxiv 11y ago
    Storming and searching a physical place happens all the time, with a warrant, which they had.
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
    - rbanffy 11y ago
      They had a very non-specific warrant, something not unlike automatically authorizing anyone who enters a given building to be tagged, followed, and have their homes searched covertly. Search warrants are not supposed to be that easy.
      - dhimes 11y ago
        From the article: Magistrate Judge Theresa C. Buchanan in the Eastern District of Virginia, who signed the warrant used for the NIT, did not respond to questions on whether she understood that the warrant would grant the power to hack anyone who signed up to Playpen, or whether she consulted technical experts before signing it, and her office said not to expect a reply. So we can't even be sure that a judge knows what she's doing when she's asked to sign a warrant like this. They don't have to prove competence.
- 11y ago

stephengillie 11y ago

Speaking of slippery slopes, this "hack" probably falls under the broader meaning of the term. They probably put some kind of Flash banner on the page, and caught all the people with improperly-configured systems.

mjevans 11y ago
IE, systems that run arbitrary code by default...
- jacquesm 11y ago
  > IE Indeed :)
belorn 11y ago
It was a javascript vulnerability, CVE-2013-1690. After free of a DocumentViewerImpl object, triggered via an specially crafted web page using onreadystatechange events and the window.stop() API, you could execute arbitrary code. http://resources.infosecinstitute.com/fbi-tor-exploit/ http://resources.infosecinstitute.com/fbi-tor-exploit/
- Buge 11y ago
  That was the 2013 instance. The FBI did it again in 2015 and that's what this article is about. The article specifically says it's probably different than the 2013 instance.
Buge 11y ago
Tor doesn't run flash by default. Also it sounds like Playpen gave information about how to stay safe from the FBI, so I don't know why people would change the Tor settings to enable flash.

jonnybgood 11y ago

> The issue is that once we allow a state agency to trample the 4th amendment for an admittedly noble cause Can you expand on how they broke the 4th? There's nothing that indicates they broke the 4th from what I can see.

nitrogen 11y ago
Hacking is sometimes compared to criminal trespass, so when the government does it it's fair to compare it to storming and searching a physical place, which is covered by the 4th.
- joopxiv 11y ago
  Storming and searching a physical place happens all the time, with a warrant, which they had.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - rbanffy 11y ago
    They had a very non-specific warrant, something not unlike automatically authorizing anyone who enters a given building to be tagged, followed, and have their homes searched covertly. Search warrants are not supposed to be that easy.
    - dhimes 11y ago
      From the article: Magistrate Judge Theresa C. Buchanan in the Eastern District of Virginia, who signed the warrant used for the NIT, did not respond to questions on whether she understood that the warrant would grant the power to hack anyone who signed up to Playpen, or whether she consulted technical experts before signing it, and her office said not to expect a reply. So we can't even be sure that a judge knows what she's doing when she's asked to sign a warrant like this. They don't have to prove competence.
11y ago