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Ok let me clarify my position completely so that there is no dispute, and then I need to get back to work: Formal and informal study participants have noted th

by cnp 11y ago

Ok let me clarify my position completely so that there is no dispute, and then I need to get back to work: Formal and informal study participants have noted that when you ingest N,N-Dimethyltryptamine certain strange contact-like phenomena tend to occur within the biological-psychological interface known as Consciousness, and that these experiences -- which have an internal consistency -- seem to be inexplicably independent of culture, background or time. These contact experiences were so shocking that the lead investigator, Rick Strassman, discontinued his study. Meanwhile, nearly 20 years later, there are still legal barriers in place for the further study of these results due to the War on Drugs. My position is: the phenomena -- based upon my own personal experience -- is deeply strange, and in when put within the context of Fermi's Paradox, the Drake equation, etc, it might be time to approach the subject of consciousness from a different angle. Its so simple, its merely to investigate.

pavel_lishin 11y ago
I agree with you that these things are interesting, and these studies will probably reveal some really interesting stuff about human consciousness, and our brain's chemical make-up. But it's a really huge leap to hope really hard that it'll also reveal the secret to contacting aliens.
Udo 11y ago
> when you ingest N,N-Dimethyltryptamine certain strange contact-like phenomena tend to occur That's not in question. > occur within the biological-psychological interface known as Consciousness This sentence includes a little submarine-like assumption, namely that our brains are merely the interface to a larger paranormal consciousness, as opposed to being the hardware that actually generates "consciousness". At this point, there is no scientific reason to believe this assumption which you smuggled in there has any factual validity. > These contact experiences were so shocking that the lead investigator, Rick Strassman, discontinued his study. Scientific efforts don't get discontinued because they are "shocking". While an individual researcher might move on, for whatever reason, it's not correct to imply that certain outcomes are so disconcerting the scientific community would shy away from them. Otherwise, large swaths of physics and biology would have been abandoned a long time ago. > My position is: the phenomena [...] is deeply strange, and [...] it might be time to approach the subject of consciousness from a different angle. Yes, I think that position was understood from your first comment.
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Wingman4l7 11y ago
> these experiences -- which have an internal consistency -- seem to be inexplicably independent of culture, background or time You've repeated this point in your other comments. Why would these experiences not simply be a result of the interactions between this chemical and typical human physiology? Alcohol has predictable effects when consumed -- I'm sure ancient Egyptians had equally impaired motor control as 21st century Australians. Why would DMT be any different?

by cnp 11y ago

pavel_lishin 11y ago

I agree with you that these things are interesting, and these studies will probably reveal some really interesting stuff about human consciousness, and our brain's chemical make-up. But it's a really huge leap to hope really hard that it'll also reveal the secret to contacting aliens.

Udo 11y ago

> when you ingest N,N-Dimethyltryptamine certain strange contact-like phenomena tend to occur That's not in question. > occur within the biological-psychological interface known as Consciousness This sentence includes a little submarine-like assumption, namely that our brains are merely the interface to a larger paranormal consciousness, as opposed to being the hardware that actually generates "consciousness". At this point, there is no scientific reason to believe this assumption which you smuggled in there has any factual validity. > These contact experiences were so shocking that the lead investigator, Rick Strassman, discontinued his study. Scientific efforts don't get discontinued because they are "shocking". While an individual researcher might move on, for whatever reason, it's not correct to imply that certain outcomes are so disconcerting the scientific community would shy away from them. Otherwise, large swaths of physics and biology would have been abandoned a long time ago. > My position is: the phenomena [...] is deeply strange, and [...] it might be time to approach the subject of consciousness from a different angle. Yes, I think that position was understood from your first comment.

deleted 11y ago
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Wingman4l7 11y ago

> these experiences -- which have an internal consistency -- seem to be inexplicably independent of culture, background or time You've repeated this point in your other comments. Why would these experiences not simply be a result of the interactions between this chemical and typical human physiology? Alcohol has predictable effects when consumed -- I'm sure ancient Egyptians had equally impaired motor control as 21st century Australians. Why would DMT be any different?