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Really this just shows how corrupt and broken the entire entertainment ticketing stack is. TicketMaster, StubHub, etc., all prey on fans, and the fans ALLOW it

by brk 11y ago

Really this just shows how corrupt and broken the entire entertainment ticketing stack is. TicketMaster, StubHub, etc., all prey on fans, and the fans ALLOW it by paying ridiculous fucking prices to attend events. We're long past the days of needing an entity like Ticketmaster to be in the middle of ticket transactions. And we're long past the days of needing to worry about ticket scalping if we actually have an efficient ticketing system.

smt88 11y ago
> fans ALLOW it by paying ridiculous fucking prices to attend events No, fans have no choice. Entertainers allow it by using Ticketmaster. > We're long past the days of needing an entity like Ticketmaster to be in the middle of ticket transactions The greatest fear an event planner has is that they'll plan the event and no one will show up. Ticketmaster aggressively markets the events they're selling tickets for, which is why event planners continue to use them. Sure, you could use a homegrown solution or a smaller company, but Ticketmaster unethically adds all purchasers to a bunch of mailing lists and makes it really difficult to unsubscribe, and then they can claim "X million mailing list subscribers" to the event marketers.
- talmand 11y ago
  So, to avoid having to do marketing themselves, or to hire a firm, the event planner goes with a possibly corrupt system that by all appearances the fans of the event despise? I'm more of the mind that these things are so entrenched that neither fans or event planners have a choice.
  - slg 11y ago
    The role Ticketmaster plays in the live event business is much bigger than simple middlemen. They provide the previously mentioned marketing, promotion, and discovery. They provide box office management. They provide customer service. They manage the secondary market. They provide business intelligence. They represent artists. They even own their own venues for a complete vertical monopoly. They are the Amazon Web Services of the live event business. Sure, you will probably have a better experience if you use Backblaze for your storage, but AWS provides so many other services you might need that it makes sense to consolidate your business with them. That is why Ticketmaster is so entrenched. It isn't corruption. There is just a huge barrier to entry when your biggest competitor has such a complete product offering.
    - talmand 11y ago
      I wouldn't say the business tactics that businesses like Ticketmaster use to get so entrenched in their markets is necessarily corruption. But, once entrenched they often start conducting corrupt, or at least unethical, practices.
- wdr1 11y ago
  > No, fans have no choice. Entertainers allow it by using Ticketmaster. Disclaimer: Ex-Ticketmaster employee. This doesn't quite hit it. Entertainers encourage it as they get paid to do so. Ticketmaster is basically paid to be a bad guy. If you hate Ticketmaster, then all is working to plan. Because what you're not doing is hating the actual decision maker on those fees -- the artist, the promoter, & the venue. Ticketmaster splits those fees. Ticketmaster wants to get paid of course, but the deal can be structure those fees any which way. Want a low (or no) fees with Ticketmaster? If that's what the artist, promoter & venue want, that's what will happen. Want a low ticket price for advertising & high fees to increase your profit? Ticketmaster can do that too. At the end of the day, the artist & promoter own the tickets, not Ticketmaster.
- brk 11y ago
  My understanding is that Ticketmaster has exclusive contracts with the vast majority of primary venues in the US. Nobody, artist or venue, is really choosing Tickemaster any more than a Comcast customer chooses Comcast as the only game in town.
stuart78 11y ago
Confronted this when looking at Hamilton tickets recently. The thing that is crazy for venues and artists is how much of the value they are losing to scalpers via StubHub. If venues forced non-transferability (or some better limitation) and staggered releasing, they would be better able to appropriately price tickets without feeding the StubHubs of the world.

by brk 11y ago

smt88 11y ago

> fans ALLOW it by paying ridiculous fucking prices to attend events No, fans have no choice. Entertainers allow it by using Ticketmaster. > We're long past the days of needing an entity like Ticketmaster to be in the middle of ticket transactions The greatest fear an event planner has is that they'll plan the event and no one will show up. Ticketmaster aggressively markets the events they're selling tickets for, which is why event planners continue to use them. Sure, you could use a homegrown solution or a smaller company, but Ticketmaster unethically adds all purchasers to a bunch of mailing lists and makes it really difficult to unsubscribe, and then they can claim "X million mailing list subscribers" to the event marketers.

talmand 11y ago
So, to avoid having to do marketing themselves, or to hire a firm, the event planner goes with a possibly corrupt system that by all appearances the fans of the event despise? I'm more of the mind that these things are so entrenched that neither fans or event planners have a choice.
- slg 11y ago
  The role Ticketmaster plays in the live event business is much bigger than simple middlemen. They provide the previously mentioned marketing, promotion, and discovery. They provide box office management. They provide customer service. They manage the secondary market. They provide business intelligence. They represent artists. They even own their own venues for a complete vertical monopoly. They are the Amazon Web Services of the live event business. Sure, you will probably have a better experience if you use Backblaze for your storage, but AWS provides so many other services you might need that it makes sense to consolidate your business with them. That is why Ticketmaster is so entrenched. It isn't corruption. There is just a huge barrier to entry when your biggest competitor has such a complete product offering.
  - talmand 11y ago
    I wouldn't say the business tactics that businesses like Ticketmaster use to get so entrenched in their markets is necessarily corruption. But, once entrenched they often start conducting corrupt, or at least unethical, practices.
wdr1 11y ago
> No, fans have no choice. Entertainers allow it by using Ticketmaster. Disclaimer: Ex-Ticketmaster employee. This doesn't quite hit it. Entertainers encourage it as they get paid to do so. Ticketmaster is basically paid to be a bad guy. If you hate Ticketmaster, then all is working to plan. Because what you're not doing is hating the actual decision maker on those fees -- the artist, the promoter, & the venue. Ticketmaster splits those fees. Ticketmaster wants to get paid of course, but the deal can be structure those fees any which way. Want a low (or no) fees with Ticketmaster? If that's what the artist, promoter & venue want, that's what will happen. Want a low ticket price for advertising & high fees to increase your profit? Ticketmaster can do that too. At the end of the day, the artist & promoter own the tickets, not Ticketmaster.
brk 11y ago
My understanding is that Ticketmaster has exclusive contracts with the vast majority of primary venues in the US. Nobody, artist or venue, is really choosing Tickemaster any more than a Comcast customer chooses Comcast as the only game in town.

stuart78 11y ago

Confronted this when looking at Hamilton tickets recently. The thing that is crazy for venues and artists is how much of the value they are losing to scalpers via StubHub. If venues forced non-transferability (or some better limitation) and staggered releasing, they would be better able to appropriately price tickets without feeding the StubHubs of the world.