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Coming from a former communist country, I don't understand why smart, capable people want to give away their money to a corrupt, incompetent state to manage it

by evgen 11y ago

Coming from a former communist country, I don't understand why smart, capable people want to give away their money to a corrupt, incompetent state to manage it for them. Because the state is neither corrupt nor incompetent; this is the big fear of the cyber-selfish libertarians you will find on HN. Tell you what, why don't you start your rant with a list of these rich politicians who will grow even richer. Just a single name please. No, this is not how communism starts. If you knew anything about the history of your own country (doesn't even matter which country this is) this would be readily apparent. Rich people becoming even richer and using the aparatus of the state to enshrine the power of their family or tribe is usually the outcome of a coup or war. Communism usually starts with a lot of rich people who did not make the last flight out having a short lean against a dusty wall somewhere after their family has spent several generations giving everyone in the country a reason to want to see their spleen paraded around the capital on a stick.

Jdam 11y ago
> Because the state is neither corrupt nor _incompetent_ This needs to be proven. Oh wait, it is proven like every day. Just open a random newspaper on a random date. /european
- vezzy-fnord 11y ago
  How someone can make such an unbelievably moronic and utopian statement is beyond my comprehension. A shame so few have yet to internalize the lessons of Buchanan and Tullock, though to presuppose the existence of a perfect government, I'm afraid is much more desperate than that.
apsec112 11y ago
"Tell you what, why don't you start your rant" Please don't make personal attacks on Hacker News.
throwaway_51661 11y ago
> Tell you what, why don't you start your rant with a list of these rich politicians who will grow even richer. Just a single name please. Hillary Clinton. https://www.rt.com/usa/327689-clinton-conflicts-state-department-us/ https://www.rt.com/usa/327689-clinton-conflicts-state-depart... And BTW grandparent is 100% correct. This is EXACTLY how communism starts. First they come for the people who are rich and successful ... Throwaway account because it could hurt my career to declare my political views on a public forum in the US if I'm not a liberal.
- evgen 11y ago
  A Russia Today link? Seriously that is the best you can do? Back to the bog troll...
  - throwaway_51661 11y ago
    Here's a Wall Street Journal article describing the same thing: http://www.wsj.com/articles/speaking-fees-meet-politics-for-clintons-1451504098 http://www.wsj.com/articles/speaking-fees-meet-politics-for-...
- icebraining 11y ago
  You know, $8M for 200 speeches isn't that much. People like Seth Godin and Malcolm Gladwell make ~$100k per speech, and they're not even former POTUSes.
  - throwaway_51661 11y ago
    The amount is not the point. The point is, companies/lobby groups who directly benefitted from Hillary's decisions as a secretary of the state, paid Bill a lot of money to give speeches.
    - tim333 11y ago
      The amount is kind of a point. There are estimates of Putin being worth $200bn http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2015/02/15/putins-net-worth-is-200-billion-says-russias-once-largest-foreigner-investor/ http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2015/02/15/putins-net-wort... Now that's what I call enriching the politicians. The Clinton's money is more like a regular CEO salary.
vixen99 11y ago
No, what politicians do is to build up debts (easy - it's other people's money) that no business would or could ever countenance. Thus you have a State with a $20 trillion debt and rising. One day it won't rise any more and the suffering will be immense.
bobby_9x 11y ago
The state is neither corrupt nor incompetant? Really?? If this is the case, why so much interest in black lives matter?? There seems to be this spread of misinformation (especially on HN) that evil business owners aren't paying their "fair share" when in reality, they pay the majority of taxes in the US. High taxes and regulations will only make it harder for the non-rich to accumiliate wealth and the zuckerbergs of the world will just move to another country. Do you like only having the choice of either working for a big corporation or the government? I sure don't. nordic countries are a good example of what not to do, because this is exactly what has happened there.

by evgen 11y ago

Jdam 11y ago

> Because the state is neither corrupt nor _incompetent_ This needs to be proven. Oh wait, it is proven like every day. Just open a random newspaper on a random date. /european

vezzy-fnord 11y ago
How someone can make such an unbelievably moronic and utopian statement is beyond my comprehension. A shame so few have yet to internalize the lessons of Buchanan and Tullock, though to presuppose the existence of a perfect government, I'm afraid is much more desperate than that.

apsec112 11y ago

"Tell you what, why don't you start your rant" Please don't make personal attacks on Hacker News.

throwaway_51661 11y ago

> Tell you what, why don't you start your rant with a list of these rich politicians who will grow even richer. Just a single name please. Hillary Clinton. https://www.rt.com/usa/327689-clinton-conflicts-state-department-us/ https://www.rt.com/usa/327689-clinton-conflicts-state-depart... And BTW grandparent is 100% correct. This is EXACTLY how communism starts. First they come for the people who are rich and successful ... Throwaway account because it could hurt my career to declare my political views on a public forum in the US if I'm not a liberal.

evgen 11y ago
A Russia Today link? Seriously that is the best you can do? Back to the bog troll...
- throwaway_51661 11y ago
  Here's a Wall Street Journal article describing the same thing: http://www.wsj.com/articles/speaking-fees-meet-politics-for-clintons-1451504098 http://www.wsj.com/articles/speaking-fees-meet-politics-for-...
icebraining 11y ago
You know, $8M for 200 speeches isn't that much. People like Seth Godin and Malcolm Gladwell make ~$100k per speech, and they're not even former POTUSes.
- throwaway_51661 11y ago
  The amount is not the point. The point is, companies/lobby groups who directly benefitted from Hillary's decisions as a secretary of the state, paid Bill a lot of money to give speeches.
  - tim333 11y ago
    The amount is kind of a point. There are estimates of Putin being worth $200bn http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2015/02/15/putins-net-worth-is-200-billion-says-russias-once-largest-foreigner-investor/ http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2015/02/15/putins-net-wort... Now that's what I call enriching the politicians. The Clinton's money is more like a regular CEO salary.

vixen99 11y ago

No, what politicians do is to build up debts (easy - it's other people's money) that no business would or could ever countenance. Thus you have a State with a $20 trillion debt and rising. One day it won't rise any more and the suffering will be immense.

bobby_9x 11y ago

The state is neither corrupt nor incompetant? Really?? If this is the case, why so much interest in black lives matter?? There seems to be this spread of misinformation (especially on HN) that evil business owners aren't paying their "fair share" when in reality, they pay the majority of taxes in the US. High taxes and regulations will only make it harder for the non-rich to accumiliate wealth and the zuckerbergs of the world will just move to another country. Do you like only having the choice of either working for a big corporation or the government? I sure don't. nordic countries are a good example of what not to do, because this is exactly what has happened there.