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There is a nasty nest of people who seem to relish in the pain and suffering that they cause. It is not an intellectually stimulating activity - it doesn't fur

by edent 11y ago

There is a nasty nest of people who seem to relish in the pain and suffering that they cause. It is not an intellectually stimulating activity - it doesn't further any particular ideological cause, and I find it extremely troubling. Last night a friend of mine was set upon by a group of (self-declared) Libertarians for having the temerity to tweet about being disabled. I can't quite get into the mindset of the people who harass others online. Is it juvenile lashing out? The uncontrolled rage of the impotent? Or people who get a sadistic thrill from detached torture?

netcan 11y ago
I'm not sure how to classify it adequately. It may be that classification is inevitably oversimplifying. But, I do think that it's a close relative of conservatism that's found in almost every culture and can often get very extreme. Strict codes of conduct, dress, speech and such are a consequence of people instinctively creating and policing conformity. That can be thinking and voicing a dissident opinion about religion or politics, dressing outlandishly, speaking improperly or any other element of culture that's cohesive. It isn't a coincidence that in 18th century Japan and 18th century Morocco, people wore different hats. That conformity in hats happened as people themselves conformed to local hat culture and pressured those around them to conform. I think you're right to call it juvenile. Juveniles seem especially vigilant about conforming and policing conformity. A 14 year old is more likely to berate a nonconforming classmate than a 40 year old. Being online and anonymous tears down some of the barriers to both taking offence and offering it. But, I think that the instinct to find a core identity and violently defending it is, unfortunately, innate.
tomhoward 11y ago
I understand this question is examined in Jon Ronson's recent book So You've Been Publicly Shamed[1] I haven't read it but I've heard him discussing it on The Nerdist[2] and The Joe Rogan Experience[3] podcasts, both of which were very entertaining and insightful. Though I never stooped to the level of harassing and shaming people, I did go through an angry white male libertarian stage, and having been through that I think the underlying motive for the asshole behaviour is something to do with entitlement and resentment. I.e., "I deserve better than this (more money/status/respect/sex etc), if the world's not gonna give me what I deserve, then at least I can make other people as miserable as I am". [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/So_You%27ve_Been_Publicly_Shamed https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/So_You%27ve_Been_Publicly_Sham... [2] http://nerdist.com/nerdist-podcast-jon-ronson/ http://nerdist.com/nerdist-podcast-jon-ronson/ [3] http://podbay.fm/show/360084272/e/1436227565?autostart=1 http://podbay.fm/show/360084272/e/1436227565?autostart=1
- edent 11y ago
  Ronson's book is excellent - I can highly recommend it.
- mjklin 11y ago
  Sartre remarked on the pleasure one gets out of this type of behavior: "I was, as it were, doubled. On the one hand, I was 'I'; Jean-Paul Sartre, you know, the person. On the other hand I was the chronicler of hell, the privileged young writer allowed to observe all the torments of the modern personality. I was extremely happy, fake and hoodwinked to my very soul" - From his autobiography Les Mots
jnbiche 11y ago
That's awful. Attacking someone for being disabled is pretty low. Was this on Twitter?
- edent 11y ago
  Yes, although I've seen the same thing in other social networks and on the streets.

by edent 11y ago

netcan 11y ago

I'm not sure how to classify it adequately. It may be that classification is inevitably oversimplifying. But, I do think that it's a close relative of conservatism that's found in almost every culture and can often get very extreme. Strict codes of conduct, dress, speech and such are a consequence of people instinctively creating and policing conformity. That can be thinking and voicing a dissident opinion about religion or politics, dressing outlandishly, speaking improperly or any other element of culture that's cohesive. It isn't a coincidence that in 18th century Japan and 18th century Morocco, people wore different hats. That conformity in hats happened as people themselves conformed to local hat culture and pressured those around them to conform. I think you're right to call it juvenile. Juveniles seem especially vigilant about conforming and policing conformity. A 14 year old is more likely to berate a nonconforming classmate than a 40 year old. Being online and anonymous tears down some of the barriers to both taking offence and offering it. But, I think that the instinct to find a core identity and violently defending it is, unfortunately, innate.

tomhoward 11y ago

I understand this question is examined in Jon Ronson's recent book So You've Been Publicly Shamed[1] I haven't read it but I've heard him discussing it on The Nerdist[2] and The Joe Rogan Experience[3] podcasts, both of which were very entertaining and insightful. Though I never stooped to the level of harassing and shaming people, I did go through an angry white male libertarian stage, and having been through that I think the underlying motive for the asshole behaviour is something to do with entitlement and resentment. I.e., "I deserve better than this (more money/status/respect/sex etc), if the world's not gonna give me what I deserve, then at least I can make other people as miserable as I am". [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/So_You%27ve_Been_Publicly_Shamed https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/So_You%27ve_Been_Publicly_Sham... [2] http://nerdist.com/nerdist-podcast-jon-ronson/ http://nerdist.com/nerdist-podcast-jon-ronson/ [3] http://podbay.fm/show/360084272/e/1436227565?autostart=1 http://podbay.fm/show/360084272/e/1436227565?autostart=1

edent 11y ago
Ronson's book is excellent - I can highly recommend it.
mjklin 11y ago
Sartre remarked on the pleasure one gets out of this type of behavior: "I was, as it were, doubled. On the one hand, I was 'I'; Jean-Paul Sartre, you know, the person. On the other hand I was the chronicler of hell, the privileged young writer allowed to observe all the torments of the modern personality. I was extremely happy, fake and hoodwinked to my very soul" - From his autobiography Les Mots

jnbiche 11y ago

That's awful. Attacking someone for being disabled is pretty low. Was this on Twitter?

edent 11y ago
Yes, although I've seen the same thing in other social networks and on the streets.