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Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js
- sotojuan 11y agoPretty cool. Usually the Node community isn't into Rails-like stuff but I'll give this a shot.
- z1mm32m4n 11y agoIs there any documentation yet? I'd love to try it out.
- bhanu423 11y agoAwesome to see a project from the SailsJS team. SailsJS was the first MVC framework which I worked it and was extremely easy to begin with. Kudos for using ES6.
- mikermcneil 11y agoSorry for the confusion. This isn't a project from us. Travis Webb (@tjwebb) was added as a contributor in mid-2015, but unfortunately it did not work out. The only contributor who was removed from Sails was Travis, in late November. And ever since, he has been doing everything he can to discredit our project, including claiming that the Sails team is working on Trails, or that Sails is "abandoned". Travis is the _only_ former Sails contributor (i.e. someone with actual write access to our repos) working on Trails. If you have a technical problem with Sails, bring that up with me or another member of our core team on GitHub. But please realize that this fork is not about technical issues; it is a personal vendetta against me and the Sails.js project.
- traviswebb 11y ago> Travis is the _only_ former Sails contributor (i.e. someone with actual write access to our repos) Again, we seem to define these terms differently. I think if you told the hundreds of Sails contributors that they aren't actually contributors because you haven't given them write access, they would feel rather insulted by that. > But please realize that this fork is not about technical issues It's true that I think you're a lying scumbag, but I need a software stack that I can build my business on for the next 2-5 years. Sails.js is obsolete, and these issues stemming from your poor technical competence and community management are thoroughly documented on the internet.
- manojlds 11y agoContext -https://github.com/balderdashy/sails/issues/3429 https://github.com/balderdashy/sails/issues/3429
- always_good 11y agoYikes. Gotta wonder if the "Meet the Team" page on http://www.balderdash.io/ http://www.balderdash.io/ is up to date after reading that.
- dabernathy89 11y agoIt's not. Travis' Twitter/Github profiles don't seem to be up to date either. https://twitter.com/mikermcneil/status/674307797832495104 https://twitter.com/mikermcneil/status/674307797832495104
- rphl 11y agoI like the logo.
- traviswebb 11y agoAll -- Keep in mind that Trails.js is pre-release. We're releasing 1.0-alpha on January 8, which isn't too far away. For more info on our development schedule, see our roadmap: https://github.com/trailsjs/trails/blob/master/ROADMAP.md https://github.com/trailsjs/trails/blob/master/ROADMAP.md We'll be giving some talks on Trails the week of Jan 11th; we'll be visiting local Javascript groups in Detroit, Miami, and Los Angeles that week. If you're in the area, come hang out!
- catmanjan 11y agoYou probably already know but http://www.trailsjs.io/ http://www.trailsjs.io/ seems to be parked, why not redirect it to the Github page in the meanwhile?
- traviswebb 11y agoI'm doing that now :) We hadn't anticipated this much press before our Jan 8 release, so we're caught off-balance a bit. Thanks.
- sotojuan 11y agoI'd also recommend https://js.org/ https://js.org/
- pdappollonio 11y agoI'm interested in the Miami one. Any information?
- uniacid 11y agoTravis, likewise.. I'm in Boca Raton so Miami is not far away :)
- traviswebb 11y agoThey haven't announced it yet, but it'll be on the 13th at the Miami node.js meetup: http://www.meetup.com/Miami-node-js-Meetup/ http://www.meetup.com/Miami-node-js-Meetup/
- clay_to_n 11y agoWeird situation with this and Sails right now. Sails.js development has basically stagnated in the past year, and many people in the community believe Balderdash, the company behind it, aren't giving it the attention it deserves (they have a few new projects they're working on). Travis Webb and his team behind Trails were kicked out of Balderdash (not clear if fired from the company or just removed from GitHub group), and Travis blames Mike from Balderdash for doing it as a political move to keep control. Mike has said very little publicly about it, apparently not wanting to stir up more drama. Trails seems to be an attempt at achieving what Sails has achieved (a full-stack modern MVC framework in node) with newer tools (ES6, I think Koa by default instead of Express, etc) and perhaps more modularity. I think it's an ambitious project with good goals, but it will be a while before it will be stable and ready to use. And if it does reach that point, it's still susceptible to what's hurting Sails right now (a larger community than your developers can handle, de-prioritization, politics...). Hopefully this turns out like the node / io.js split and is, in the end, positive for the ecosystem in some way.
- sotojuan 11y ago> Hopefully this turns out like the node / io.js split and is, in the end, positive for the ecosystem in some way. I agree. I commented earlier that the Node community seems to prefer small modules over Rails-like frameworks, but I think a solid web framework would be good for Node adoption by people who prefer them and beginners.
- traviswebb 11y agoHopefully. We've actually seen some (mostly superficial) activity in Sails recently, which is surprising and encouraging. Trails is actually much more modular than Sails. The goal is the same -- to make your life easier -- and the conventions are rails-like (indeed, compatible wiyh Sails) but the technical design is completely different and actually quite a bit more "node-like". Keep in mind that Trails is not a fork, but a Sails-compatible re-write. So there's no upstream code-level reconciliation that can happen, but I'm sure both projects can coexist and compete in the framework market on their merits.
- stephengoodwin 11y agoFYI, the trailsjs.io official site listed on Github is just a Namecheap landing page.
- andrewchambers 11y agoCan someone define "modern" in this context for me?
- DonHopkins 11y agoCargo cult nomenclature is a symptom of cargo cult architecture. They're already starting to run out of 6 letter words to name web frameworks with the format of "_rails". What's next: "Frails"? "Brails"? "Derails"? "Fails"? Or just "Ails"?
- chvid 11y agoI would call this a traditional MVC web framework written in JavaScript.
- p0larboy 11y agoModern Javascript, perhaps? As in ES6
- harunurhan 11y agoI think because it runs on Node 4, written in ES6, uses Koa by default instead of Express
- DonHopkins 11y agoMVC is old and obsolete cargo cult technology. The phrase "Modern MVC Web Framework" is lipstick on a geriatric pig, like "Modern Waterfall Software Development Paradigm". Unless by modern they mean modern as in modernism, that began in the 1870s as a self-consciousness and irony concerning literary and social traditions. [1] In the same sense that the art style and technology in Fallout 4 is "modern". [2] MVC frameworks might be better described as "Modern Googie GUI Architecture". [3] "Things seem to hang on in computing just because they work a little bit." -Alan Kay on MVC [4] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modernism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modernism [2] http://img.duniaku.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Fallout-4-1.jpg http://img.duniaku.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Fallout-4-... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Googie_architecture https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Googie_architecture [4] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7755759 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7755759
- anodari 11y agoA few days I saw http://nodeontrain.xyz/ http://nodeontrain.xyz/, it looks similar.
- mikemaccana 11y agoSo what's actually included? A comment here mentioned koa, and there's some kind of ORM, but the README has no information.
- harunurhan 11y agoI like how you differentiate from Sails such as ES6, and also the fact that you are much more community oriented. Although I am not a JS fan for backend, I will give it a try next time instead of using Sails.
- kevindeasis 11y agoAt first I was like, "oh another node framework" Then I saw a point where they were using hapijs in their module: https://github.com/hapijs/hapi https://github.com/hapijs/hapi That is giving me a small motivation to try some of my future weekend projects with Trails.
- sirodoht 11y agoWhy such decision-changing positive energy towards hapi? I am not saying you shouldn't, honestly asking why. I have checked it, and I was not convinced of its superiority over express, considering the express community, modules, SO threads, etc. At least for a small-medium server.
- kevindeasis 11y agoI just found it easier to work with. Some might find express easier, but that is just my opinion. There are also companies using hapi in production. Walmart used it and worked on black friday. Modules is not a big problem since there are lots of node modules out there. One could even say, why use express when meteor has a bigger community? They have modules, etc.
- romanovcode 11y ago>Trails is built and maintained by former members of the Sails.js core team Just no. I was working with Sails.js for about a year now on production systems - it's horrible. Without a doubt I can say that it's the worst framework I've ever worked with. Especially their so called "orm" - we actually had to switch it off and work with pure mysql queries instead because it can't even do migrations (it deletes everything from db, stores in ram and re-insert). Seriously, don't believe the hype, I bet this will be just as bad as Sails.
- roblabla 11y agoWhile I haven't played with Sails.JS, I've heard many people complain about how bad it was. However, just because the people building this new framework used to work on the Sails.JS Framework, you're going to dismiss it as being "automatically bad" ? I didn't look at Trails.JS so I don't know how it looks, but this kind of attitude seems extremely toxic and detrimental to the Open Source space. It makes me sad this is the top comment. If anything, this gives them the chance to start anew, equipped with the knowledge of past mistakes, to avoid making them again.
- dhruvbhatia 11y agoIn his defence, he is taking a stance equipped with the knowledge of his own personal past mistakes, to avoid making them again.
- paulddraper 11y agoAnd his past mistake was using Sails. If the implementation of the Sails as a Rails-like JS framework was as bad as he says, be shouldn't use it for his next project. A bunch of members of the community apparently had similar thoughts. As long as the idea of Rails-like JS framework isn't fundamentally flawed, they seem to be doing the logical next step: make something better.
- im_down_w_otp 11y agoCan I dismiss it because it's like the 50th "modern MVC framework" to be made for Node.js? Are all the other ones so hopelessly broken that it required making an entirely new one?
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- edwinnathaniel 11y agoMy new/current job is 100% JavaScript and I have been thinking to choose NodeJS and either React/EmberJS/AngularJS for my newbside project (a typical CRUD app) that I will have to maintain for a very long time. I almost chose Sails because Express is too low level/too simple. Lately I've been reconsidering my options ever since there were a few HN posts related to my choice of stack that seem to conflict with my requirements: side project (meaning little effort) and long term maintenance (meaning stability, documentation should still exist for perhaps prior versions, relevant articles, examples from the Internet). Real time isn't a requirement, REST API isn't a requirements (yet), so I guess that minimize the need of NodeJS. I also haven't found a good case/example of code sharing between client and server side neither I heard people reaping tons of benefit from the principle since most front end framework forces the user to subscribe to their model/paradigm that may not work well with the back end code. I quickly realized that perhaps Rails or the good old Java (with SpringMVC) seem to satisfy the requirement.
- sebular 11y agoI would check out the loopback framework: http://loopback.io/ http://loopback.io/ It's built on top of express.js and offers some of the more "Railsy" features that express lacks. Also supports this idea of shared models between the client and server (going for that whole code reuse thing you're talking about). The company was also bought by IBM so I'm feeling pretty confident that it's going to keep getting regular updates and long-term support. They offer a bunch of enterprise-type features for the paid version, but the free one will be enough for your needs.
- supernintendo 11y agoAs a full time JavaScript developer, I would never choose Node.js for the back end if I had the choice. Elixir or Ruby all the way.
- dpacmittal 11y agoWhy?
- hmans 11y agolol no