6 ms·

I get the spreadsheet. I get that there should not be two answers. What I'd ask you is where is your moral compass? Where do you think the taxes should be?

gozur88 11y ago
Taxes and morality have nothing to do with each other. Individuals and corporations have a legal duty to pay duly constituted taxes. Nothing more.
- supercanuck 11y ago
  > Taxes and morality have nothing to do with each other Bullshit, the concept of fairness is a universal moral.
  - gozur88 11y ago
    The concept of fairness is so subjective it's meaningless in the context of morality. Decrying something as being "unfair" is childish.
    - supercanuck 11y ago
      Right.. nothing subjective about tax: The report found that Irish officials essentially “reverse-engineered” Apple’s tax bill by first discussing with company representatives the size of the profit they wanted from the Irish branch. Apple’s own tax adviser acknowledged there was “no scientific basis” for the figures, the report said. http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/01/business/international/european-commission-report-warns-ireland-over-tax-treatment-of-apple.html http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/01/business/international/eur...
      - gozur88 11y ago
        Of course there's something subjective about tax. That was my whole point. I'm going to assume you meant "objective" so your post makes sense. There's nothing objective the concept of fairness, particularly when it comes to taxes. Taxes are almost completely arbitrary, depending more on what the government in question thinks it can actually collect than anything else. It's pretty easy to make the case corporations shouldn't be taxed at all. A corporation is nothing more than a group of people that have pooled their resources to make money, after all, and they're already taxed as individuals when profits are disbursed. How is that fair?
- solidsnack9000 11y ago
  It is hard to avoid a notion of morality when we are asking, how should things be? Before there are rules, there are choices.
- 1stop 11y ago
  If taxes and morality have nothing to do with each other, then the answer is simple: Everybody should avoid paying taxes. But if we borrow a lesson from moral philosophy just to help us with that thought – Descartes universality principle might help us: If everybody (corps, and individuals) avoided tax, would our system still work? Would it be a system that encourages growth (a requirement for capitalist enterprise)? Would our governments revenue system completely dissolve? Thus our governments completely dissolve? Is "Taxes aren't a moral issue" equivalent to "I want pure free market anarchy"? Great business idea: Create a corporation that represents employees, with offices in every country. It then signs your employment contract, pays you in a 0 income tax territory and does all the same funny money games Apple et al do.
  - gozur88 11y ago
    >If taxes and morality have nothing to do with each other, then the answer is simple: Everybody should avoid paying taxes. Everybody should avoid taxes as long as they stay withing the law, particularly corporations that have a fiduciary duty to do so. It's moral, usually, to follow the law. But companies like Apple are following the law. Apple already pays billions in tax, far more than it uses in services. Even by that argument Apple isn't doing anything immoral by avoiding more tax.

gozur88 11y ago

Taxes and morality have nothing to do with each other. Individuals and corporations have a legal duty to pay duly constituted taxes. Nothing more.

supercanuck 11y ago
> Taxes and morality have nothing to do with each other Bullshit, the concept of fairness is a universal moral.
- gozur88 11y ago
  The concept of fairness is so subjective it's meaningless in the context of morality. Decrying something as being "unfair" is childish.
  - supercanuck 11y ago
    Right.. nothing subjective about tax: The report found that Irish officials essentially “reverse-engineered” Apple’s tax bill by first discussing with company representatives the size of the profit they wanted from the Irish branch. Apple’s own tax adviser acknowledged there was “no scientific basis” for the figures, the report said. http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/01/business/international/european-commission-report-warns-ireland-over-tax-treatment-of-apple.html http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/01/business/international/eur...
    - gozur88 11y ago
      Of course there's something subjective about tax. That was my whole point. I'm going to assume you meant "objective" so your post makes sense. There's nothing objective the concept of fairness, particularly when it comes to taxes. Taxes are almost completely arbitrary, depending more on what the government in question thinks it can actually collect than anything else. It's pretty easy to make the case corporations shouldn't be taxed at all. A corporation is nothing more than a group of people that have pooled their resources to make money, after all, and they're already taxed as individuals when profits are disbursed. How is that fair?
solidsnack9000 11y ago
It is hard to avoid a notion of morality when we are asking, how should things be? Before there are rules, there are choices.
1stop 11y ago
If taxes and morality have nothing to do with each other, then the answer is simple: Everybody should avoid paying taxes. But if we borrow a lesson from moral philosophy just to help us with that thought – Descartes universality principle might help us: If everybody (corps, and individuals) avoided tax, would our system still work? Would it be a system that encourages growth (a requirement for capitalist enterprise)? Would our governments revenue system completely dissolve? Thus our governments completely dissolve? Is "Taxes aren't a moral issue" equivalent to "I want pure free market anarchy"? Great business idea: Create a corporation that represents employees, with offices in every country. It then signs your employment contract, pays you in a 0 income tax territory and does all the same funny money games Apple et al do.
- gozur88 11y ago
  >If taxes and morality have nothing to do with each other, then the answer is simple: Everybody should avoid paying taxes. Everybody should avoid taxes as long as they stay withing the law, particularly corporations that have a fiduciary duty to do so. It's moral, usually, to follow the law. But companies like Apple are following the law. Apple already pays billions in tax, far more than it uses in services. Even by that argument Apple isn't doing anything immoral by avoiding more tax.