5 ms·

Time and time again we see such short term thinking does not pay off. It wouldn't be evil on Oracle's part to do that, it would be just plain stupid. The resurg

Time and time again we see such short term thinking does not pay off. It wouldn't be evil on Oracle's part to do that, it would be just plain stupid. The resurgence of Microsoft shows that being open and transparent is the actual winning strategy. Goodwill among developers is not a quantifiable thing but it makes a huge difference.

ebbv 11y ago
> The resurgence of Microsoft shows that being open and transparent is the actual winning strategy. Or at least being a little bit open and transparent enough to build good will, anyway. There's a lot of non-open, non-transparent, non-friendly things about Windows 10.
- yareally 11y ago
  I believe the OP was referring to the openness and transparency in .net, c#, typescript and visual studio code.
  - ebbv 11y ago
    He probably was but the way he phrased it he made it sound like Microsoft is widely open and trustworthy, when it's not. Some teams are able to be open and transparent, but the company as a whole is not.
HillRat 11y ago
Yeah, but this is Oracle we're talking about. They do evil and stupid before breakfast and short-term thinking for the rest of the day.
- threeseed 11y ago
  Let's be grown ups here. Oracle isn't evil by any normal definition of the word. And you sure as hell don't get to $10 billion a year in profits by being stupid.
  - praveenster 11y ago
    All the responses to this thread on Quora (many of whom are ex Oracle employees) seem to suggest that they are disliked: https://www.quora.com/Whats-so-bad-about-Oracle https://www.quora.com/Whats-so-bad-about-Oracle
    - sigzero 11y ago
      Disliked isn't evil. People should stop throwing around that word so easily though.
      - mistermumble 11y ago
        What they did to Peoplesoft was evil.
    - ethbro 11y ago
      ... And now I have a new baseline as to what a pissed off software engineer looks like.
    - DonHopkins 11y ago
      "You actually don't need to be open minded about Oracle. You are wasting the openness of your mind. Go be open minded about lots of other things. I mean, let's face it: it's work to be open minded, right? I mean, you've got to constantly discard data and be like "ok, I need to be open minded about this". No, with Oracle, just be close-minded. It's a lot easier. Because the thing about Oracle, and this is just amazing to me, is, you know: what makes life worth living is the fact that stereotypes aren't true, in general. It's the complexity of life. And as you know people, as you learn about things, you realize that these generalizations we have, virtually to a generalization, are false. Well except for this one, as it turns out. What you think of Oracle is even truer than you think it is. There has been no entity in human history with less complexity or nuance to it than Oracle." -Bryan M. Cantrill https://youtu.be/-zRN7XLCRhc?t=33m1s https://youtu.be/-zRN7XLCRhc?t=33m1s And later on he warns: "Do not fall into the trap of anthropomorphizing Larry Ellison!" -Bryan M. Cantrill
  - deleted 11y ago
- DonHopkins 11y ago
  The story I heard was that Larry Ellison was driving his sports car down 101, when a cop tried to pull him over for speeding, so he called ahead to Oracle security and had them stop the perusing cops at the security gate when they tried to follow him into the Oracle compound. Too bad the ATF and Attorney General Janet Reno didn't take charge of the situation.
  - SwellJoe 11y ago
    I find that story challenging to believe. Fleeing an officer would be probable cause for an officer to enter the property to make an arrest. I can't count the number of times I saw it on Cops (when I worked at a TV station that aired the show)...someone fleeing from a minor traffic violation goes into their home, police follow and make a dramatic arrest. It's not like playing "tag"; there is no "base" that protects you from being tagged by police in pursuit.
    - marvy 11y ago
      You could try escaping to an area where they don't have jurisdiction. "Run a red light? Drive to Canada!"
      - techdragon 11y ago
        If I ever make a driving game... This will be in it. I just love the absurdity of running a red light somewhere like California, Texas or Florida, then just going "F*&( it, TO CANADA!!!!!" <sound of engine revving up as driver floors it>
      - deleted 11y ago
        [deleted]
      - aaronkrolik 11y ago
        Funny you say that! This was a problem with drug smuggling. Now they have the shiprider program [0]. Basically a Canadian patrol boat has 1 american officer on it to make arrests if it crosses a border, and vice versa. [0] http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/ibet-eipf/shiprider-eng.htm http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/ibet-eipf/shiprider-eng.htm
frozenport 11y ago
>>The resurgence of Microsoft No, this shows you can be a dick and promise to stop and everything will be forgiven.
- dkarapetyan 11y ago
  It's not just a promise. They have open sourced basically all the core parts of their developer infrastructure. What twitter did was be a dick and then promise to do better whereas Microsoft is actually doing it.
  - protomyth 11y ago
    Given Windows 10 and its phone home approach, they are still acting like a bad player.
- aceperry 11y ago
  I don't recall Microsoft saying that they would promise to stop. What they've done instead was to act in more honorable ways. The jury is still out when it comes to forgiveness, but they've made a pretty good start at it.

ebbv 11y ago

> The resurgence of Microsoft shows that being open and transparent is the actual winning strategy. Or at least being a little bit open and transparent enough to build good will, anyway. There's a lot of non-open, non-transparent, non-friendly things about Windows 10.

yareally 11y ago
I believe the OP was referring to the openness and transparency in .net, c#, typescript and visual studio code.
- ebbv 11y ago
  He probably was but the way he phrased it he made it sound like Microsoft is widely open and trustworthy, when it's not. Some teams are able to be open and transparent, but the company as a whole is not.

HillRat 11y ago

Yeah, but this is Oracle we're talking about. They do evil and stupid before breakfast and short-term thinking for the rest of the day.

threeseed 11y ago
Let's be grown ups here. Oracle isn't evil by any normal definition of the word. And you sure as hell don't get to $10 billion a year in profits by being stupid.
- praveenster 11y ago
  All the responses to this thread on Quora (many of whom are ex Oracle employees) seem to suggest that they are disliked: https://www.quora.com/Whats-so-bad-about-Oracle https://www.quora.com/Whats-so-bad-about-Oracle
  - sigzero 11y ago
    Disliked isn't evil. People should stop throwing around that word so easily though.
    - mistermumble 11y ago
      What they did to Peoplesoft was evil.
  - ethbro 11y ago
    ... And now I have a new baseline as to what a pissed off software engineer looks like.
  - DonHopkins 11y ago
    "You actually don't need to be open minded about Oracle. You are wasting the openness of your mind. Go be open minded about lots of other things. I mean, let's face it: it's work to be open minded, right? I mean, you've got to constantly discard data and be like "ok, I need to be open minded about this". No, with Oracle, just be close-minded. It's a lot easier. Because the thing about Oracle, and this is just amazing to me, is, you know: what makes life worth living is the fact that stereotypes aren't true, in general. It's the complexity of life. And as you know people, as you learn about things, you realize that these generalizations we have, virtually to a generalization, are false. Well except for this one, as it turns out. What you think of Oracle is even truer than you think it is. There has been no entity in human history with less complexity or nuance to it than Oracle." -Bryan M. Cantrill https://youtu.be/-zRN7XLCRhc?t=33m1s https://youtu.be/-zRN7XLCRhc?t=33m1s And later on he warns: "Do not fall into the trap of anthropomorphizing Larry Ellison!" -Bryan M. Cantrill
- deleted 11y ago
DonHopkins 11y ago
The story I heard was that Larry Ellison was driving his sports car down 101, when a cop tried to pull him over for speeding, so he called ahead to Oracle security and had them stop the perusing cops at the security gate when they tried to follow him into the Oracle compound. Too bad the ATF and Attorney General Janet Reno didn't take charge of the situation.
- SwellJoe 11y ago
  I find that story challenging to believe. Fleeing an officer would be probable cause for an officer to enter the property to make an arrest. I can't count the number of times I saw it on Cops (when I worked at a TV station that aired the show)...someone fleeing from a minor traffic violation goes into their home, police follow and make a dramatic arrest. It's not like playing "tag"; there is no "base" that protects you from being tagged by police in pursuit.
  - marvy 11y ago
    You could try escaping to an area where they don't have jurisdiction. "Run a red light? Drive to Canada!"
    - techdragon 11y ago
      If I ever make a driving game... This will be in it. I just love the absurdity of running a red light somewhere like California, Texas or Florida, then just going "F*&( it, TO CANADA!!!!!" <sound of engine revving up as driver floors it>
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
    - aaronkrolik 11y ago
      Funny you say that! This was a problem with drug smuggling. Now they have the shiprider program [0]. Basically a Canadian patrol boat has 1 american officer on it to make arrests if it crosses a border, and vice versa. [0] http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/ibet-eipf/shiprider-eng.htm http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/ibet-eipf/shiprider-eng.htm

frozenport 11y ago

>>The resurgence of Microsoft No, this shows you can be a dick and promise to stop and everything will be forgiven.

dkarapetyan 11y ago
It's not just a promise. They have open sourced basically all the core parts of their developer infrastructure. What twitter did was be a dick and then promise to do better whereas Microsoft is actually doing it.
- protomyth 11y ago
  Given Windows 10 and its phone home approach, they are still acting like a bad player.
aceperry 11y ago
I don't recall Microsoft saying that they would promise to stop. What they've done instead was to act in more honorable ways. The jury is still out when it comes to forgiveness, but they've made a pretty good start at it.