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> REST vs SOAP, the new Facebook API, whether Ruby on Rails is scalable, what do you think of Sun's new Java-based scripting language, Google's widgets API, Ama

by rumcajz 11y ago

> REST vs SOAP, the new Facebook API, whether Ruby on Rails is scalable, what do you think of Sun's new Java-based scripting language, Google's widgets API, Amazon S3, etc. Really? Why would anyone learn any of that unless they actually need it to make their work done?

overgard 11y ago
Because learning that kind of thing increases the possibility space of what you can do. Insights usually come from a diversity of knowledge, if you only learn what you need to know you'll be exceptionally average.
- DavidWoof 11y ago
  I agree in theory, but the problem is that everybody has their own personal "10 most interesting things right this moment" list, and they often don't match up even (or especially) among excellent programmers. So the fact that somebody isn't spending time with your favorite new toy doesn't mean they're not constantly learning, especially when the top 10 list is as ridiculously subjective as the one in the article.
  - KaneMorgan 11y ago
    I read it as they should be interested in something, not they should be interested in what you're interested in.
  - AnimalMuppet 11y ago
    That's not his point. He doesn't care that your list is different than his; he cares that you have one.
autotune 11y ago
Messing around with an API in your off time is important because it means you can change contexts and get up to speed more quickly without having to learn everything from scratch on the job, and of course context is everything. I'm probably not going to be super into a social network's API but for things that are server-related? Damn right I want to know how build 30 servers with just a POST request, a for loop, and some json data. You can then apply that knowledge to something a bit more boring you might get hired for if needed, like a startup that needs someone who can answer questions about how to properly use their API to make a number of POST requests to send hundreds of orders of glitter to various companies who have not sent a response to said persons job application... in theory of course.
- ohyes 11y ago
  No it doesn't. It means you have a lot of free time and can be used as cannon fodder for the startup. You will work 80-100 hour weeks producing exceptional work for compensation that is below the area average. Let's get real, employers /want/ young naive fresh out of college kids who've never been burned and don't know any better than to give their early to mid twenties to a VC/startup for peanuts. Messing around with a rest API is just a sign that you are potential prey, a fresh kill for the hamburger machine.
  - tamana 11y ago
    You said it yourself, these candidates produce exceptional work. The fact that they may be underpaid is a problem with their (group) ability to negotiate pay, not a failure in hiring manager's talent recognition.
  - autotune 11y ago
    > You will work 80-100 hour weeks producing exceptional work for compensation that is below the area average. This is what glassdoor reviews are for, and is entirely dependent on the company. Besides that it's a two way street, you bolster up the resume and if it turns out it's not what you expected than you now have the skills to find an environment that is what you're looking for. Alternatively you could of course spend your early-mid 20s being homeless and join the gutter punks in trying to sell weed to those VCs around The Haight instead, but that's not as fulfilling or lucrative IMHO.
  - AYBABTME 11y ago
    Or it means that among the hobbies you have that consume your free time, there is 'tech' as a line item. There's nothing wrong about doing research in tech in one's free time if that what they enjoy doing. It's really annoying to read replies like yours that systematically suggest all people who spend time researching and side-projecting stuff about tech are doing so because they have lot of free time or are cannon fodder. If you prefer to spend your free time gardening or brewing beer, that's fine. It's equally fine if I enjoy spending my own time learning about more tech stuff.
mattmanser 11y ago
To be fair this was 2007, they were interesting things at the time that you might plausibly muck around with for a side project.
AYBABTME 11y ago
Because they're curious about it? The same as they might be curious about the geology of Mars and the history of the world since the Renaissance. Maybe just for the kick of it, or because they have a side project in mind.
wyclif 11y ago
Keep in mind this was written in 2007. I don't think all of that stuff is irrelevant by any means, though. Nine years later, the list might look somewhat different, but his point is that it's an indicator of intellectual curiosity, not things that are directly practical for the job the employer is offering.

by rumcajz 11y ago

overgard 11y ago

Because learning that kind of thing increases the possibility space of what you can do. Insights usually come from a diversity of knowledge, if you only learn what you need to know you'll be exceptionally average.

DavidWoof 11y ago
I agree in theory, but the problem is that everybody has their own personal "10 most interesting things right this moment" list, and they often don't match up even (or especially) among excellent programmers. So the fact that somebody isn't spending time with your favorite new toy doesn't mean they're not constantly learning, especially when the top 10 list is as ridiculously subjective as the one in the article.
- KaneMorgan 11y ago
  I read it as they should be interested in something, not they should be interested in what you're interested in.
- AnimalMuppet 11y ago
  That's not his point. He doesn't care that your list is different than his; he cares that you have one.

autotune 11y ago

Messing around with an API in your off time is important because it means you can change contexts and get up to speed more quickly without having to learn everything from scratch on the job, and of course context is everything. I'm probably not going to be super into a social network's API but for things that are server-related? Damn right I want to know how build 30 servers with just a POST request, a for loop, and some json data. You can then apply that knowledge to something a bit more boring you might get hired for if needed, like a startup that needs someone who can answer questions about how to properly use their API to make a number of POST requests to send hundreds of orders of glitter to various companies who have not sent a response to said persons job application... in theory of course.

ohyes 11y ago
No it doesn't. It means you have a lot of free time and can be used as cannon fodder for the startup. You will work 80-100 hour weeks producing exceptional work for compensation that is below the area average. Let's get real, employers /want/ young naive fresh out of college kids who've never been burned and don't know any better than to give their early to mid twenties to a VC/startup for peanuts. Messing around with a rest API is just a sign that you are potential prey, a fresh kill for the hamburger machine.
- tamana 11y ago
  You said it yourself, these candidates produce exceptional work. The fact that they may be underpaid is a problem with their (group) ability to negotiate pay, not a failure in hiring manager's talent recognition.
- autotune 11y ago
  > You will work 80-100 hour weeks producing exceptional work for compensation that is below the area average. This is what glassdoor reviews are for, and is entirely dependent on the company. Besides that it's a two way street, you bolster up the resume and if it turns out it's not what you expected than you now have the skills to find an environment that is what you're looking for. Alternatively you could of course spend your early-mid 20s being homeless and join the gutter punks in trying to sell weed to those VCs around The Haight instead, but that's not as fulfilling or lucrative IMHO.
- AYBABTME 11y ago
  Or it means that among the hobbies you have that consume your free time, there is 'tech' as a line item. There's nothing wrong about doing research in tech in one's free time if that what they enjoy doing. It's really annoying to read replies like yours that systematically suggest all people who spend time researching and side-projecting stuff about tech are doing so because they have lot of free time or are cannon fodder. If you prefer to spend your free time gardening or brewing beer, that's fine. It's equally fine if I enjoy spending my own time learning about more tech stuff.

mattmanser 11y ago

To be fair this was 2007, they were interesting things at the time that you might plausibly muck around with for a side project.

AYBABTME 11y ago

Because they're curious about it? The same as they might be curious about the geology of Mars and the history of the world since the Renaissance. Maybe just for the kick of it, or because they have a side project in mind.

wyclif 11y ago

Keep in mind this was written in 2007. I don't think all of that stuff is irrelevant by any means, though. Nine years later, the list might look somewhat different, but his point is that it's an indicator of intellectual curiosity, not things that are directly practical for the job the employer is offering.