4 ms·

I think he means, while they approved the bill, warts and all, that doesn't mean everybody likes all the warts. (Although it is congress, so we have to assume t

by natch 11y ago

I think he means, while they approved the bill, warts and all, that doesn't mean everybody likes all the warts. (Although it is congress, so we have to assume they DO like warts... but let's put that aside). He's asking if they can come back and remove some of the warts, essentially, in a separate action at a later time.

jessriedel 11y ago
But a majority of congress did like the wart. That's why the amendment adding the CISA text to the omnibus bill passed, and that's while it's very unlikely to be repealed later. (Of course it's possible to repeal it later, as is true for all laws; they didn't pass a constitutional amendment.) The public-choice situation as I understand it is that CISA was a bill that concentrated interests (large tech companies) liked but which the public as a whole did not like (insofar as they bothered to know about it). The key to passing such a bill is to minimize publicity and bundle it with a distraction.
- tptacek 11y ago
  Both CISA and PCNA passed with large amounts of publicity and long review periods.
  - jessriedel 11y ago
    OK, I don't necessarily disagree, but why tack CISA onto the omnibus budget bill if not to avoid publicity? There was no compromise justification (i.e. no argument that CISA + budget bill would pass even though neither would pass alone), correct?
    - tptacek 11y ago
      It's the end of the year and they're trying to get shit wrapped up. CISA and PCNA weren't controversial except on message boards. They passed with overwhelming support, positive media coverage, and the overt support of the President.
      - jessriedel 11y ago
        Although I'm happy to admit that there was no major public pushback against CISA because no one in the public cared, I'm not convinced that it had public support or positive media coverage. I typed "CISA" into Google news, and these were first articles and opinion pieces that came up on the mainstream (not tech-related) news sites. (I couldn't find any positive publicity at all.) -- Washington Times: "ISA cyber bill squeezed into omnibus spending plan | Lawmakers have contentious cybersecurity legislation into an omnibus spending plan..." http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/16/cisa-cyber-bill-squeezed-omnibus-spending-plan/ http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/16/cisa-cyber-b... Huffington Post: "Congress Ties Controversial Cybersecurity Bill To Key Spending Package | And critics are not happy about it." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/cisa-omnibus-spending-bill_567176b7e4b0dfd4bcc00143 http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/cisa-omnibus-spending-bi... The Guardian: "Congress just revived the surveillance state in the name of 'cybersecurity'" http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/16/congress-budget-omnibus-cisa-surveillance-cybersecurity http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/16/congres... CNN: "Congress, don't be fooled by cybersurveillance bill" http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/18/opinions/polis-cybersecurity-legislation-congress/ http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/18/opinions/polis-cybersecurity-l... International Business Times: "Controversial Cybersecurity Bill CISA Passes House, Takes One Step Closer To Becoming Law" http://www.ibtimes.com/controversial-cybersecurity-bill-cisa-passes-house-takes-one-step-closer-becoming-law-2232345 http://www.ibtimes.com/controversial-cybersecurity-bill-cisa... Washington Times: "Lawmakers line up to complain about last-minute inclusion of cyber bill CISA in omnibus" http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/17/lawmakers-line-complain-about-last-minute-inclusio/ http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/17/lawmakers-li...
        tptacek 11y ago
        All of these stories are just press hits for people like Amash and Wyden, whose PR strategies involve courting Internet privacy supporters. There's nothing at all wrong with that. Certainly, even when I disagree with them, I'd rather read Wyden and Amash talking points than hearing about why we should kill the families of ISIS members. And I mostly agree with Wyden! But it's just worth remembering that no matter what had happened with CISA and PCNA, there were always going to be these stories. You take press hits when you can get them, and these were lay-up press hits. The House and Senate bills passed with overwhelming support and significant media coverage, and Obama backed the bill. Nobody is hiding.

by natch 11y ago

jessriedel 11y ago

But a majority of congress did like the wart. That's why the amendment adding the CISA text to the omnibus bill passed, and that's while it's very unlikely to be repealed later. (Of course it's possible to repeal it later, as is true for all laws; they didn't pass a constitutional amendment.) The public-choice situation as I understand it is that CISA was a bill that concentrated interests (large tech companies) liked but which the public as a whole did not like (insofar as they bothered to know about it). The key to passing such a bill is to minimize publicity and bundle it with a distraction.

tptacek 11y ago
Both CISA and PCNA passed with large amounts of publicity and long review periods.
- jessriedel 11y ago
  OK, I don't necessarily disagree, but why tack CISA onto the omnibus budget bill if not to avoid publicity? There was no compromise justification (i.e. no argument that CISA + budget bill would pass even though neither would pass alone), correct?
  - tptacek 11y ago
    It's the end of the year and they're trying to get shit wrapped up. CISA and PCNA weren't controversial except on message boards. They passed with overwhelming support, positive media coverage, and the overt support of the President.
    - jessriedel 11y ago
      Although I'm happy to admit that there was no major public pushback against CISA because no one in the public cared, I'm not convinced that it had public support or positive media coverage. I typed "CISA" into Google news, and these were first articles and opinion pieces that came up on the mainstream (not tech-related) news sites. (I couldn't find any positive publicity at all.) -- Washington Times: "ISA cyber bill squeezed into omnibus spending plan | Lawmakers have contentious cybersecurity legislation into an omnibus spending plan..." http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/16/cisa-cyber-bill-squeezed-omnibus-spending-plan/ http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/16/cisa-cyber-b... Huffington Post: "Congress Ties Controversial Cybersecurity Bill To Key Spending Package | And critics are not happy about it." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/cisa-omnibus-spending-bill_567176b7e4b0dfd4bcc00143 http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/cisa-omnibus-spending-bi... The Guardian: "Congress just revived the surveillance state in the name of 'cybersecurity'" http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/16/congress-budget-omnibus-cisa-surveillance-cybersecurity http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/16/congres... CNN: "Congress, don't be fooled by cybersurveillance bill" http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/18/opinions/polis-cybersecurity-legislation-congress/ http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/18/opinions/polis-cybersecurity-l... International Business Times: "Controversial Cybersecurity Bill CISA Passes House, Takes One Step Closer To Becoming Law" http://www.ibtimes.com/controversial-cybersecurity-bill-cisa-passes-house-takes-one-step-closer-becoming-law-2232345 http://www.ibtimes.com/controversial-cybersecurity-bill-cisa... Washington Times: "Lawmakers line up to complain about last-minute inclusion of cyber bill CISA in omnibus" http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/17/lawmakers-line-complain-about-last-minute-inclusio/ http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/17/lawmakers-li...
      - tptacek 11y ago
        All of these stories are just press hits for people like Amash and Wyden, whose PR strategies involve courting Internet privacy supporters. There's nothing at all wrong with that. Certainly, even when I disagree with them, I'd rather read Wyden and Amash talking points than hearing about why we should kill the families of ISIS members. And I mostly agree with Wyden! But it's just worth remembering that no matter what had happened with CISA and PCNA, there were always going to be these stories. You take press hits when you can get them, and these were lay-up press hits. The House and Senate bills passed with overwhelming support and significant media coverage, and Obama backed the bill. Nobody is hiding.