7 ms·

You're not getting my point. YES, ABSOLUTELY, sometimes it boils down to knowledge. But MOST OF THE TIME, it DOESN'T. I'm not moving the goal posts. I said

You're not getting my point. YES, ABSOLUTELY, sometimes it boils down to knowledge. But MOST OF THE TIME, it DOESN'T. I'm not moving the goal posts. I said poor, and then you wanted to talk about people who aren't poor, but think they are, and if you educate them, it turns out they're not poor. > They're much better now Dude, not cool. Do you have a paper towel I can use to clean the milk off my screen? You just made me spit all over. And now you're moving the discussion between having KNOWLEDGE, and having TECHNOLOGY. Those are, in fact, different things. And let's just BACK UP. Let's pick that kid with a Nintendo. Which was, of course, more than 20 years ago. Is he really THAT much better off with an XBox One today? And please remember, the target we're discussing is "poor today versus RICH 20 years ago." RICH. As in, if you want it, you buy it. If you need information, you hire people who research it for you. If you are ill, you go to the best doctors in the world. RICH. In 1995. Rich in 1995 ain't too shabby. In fact, I'd say it's much better than poor in 2015.

deleted 11y ago
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vinceguidry 11y ago
> And now you're moving the discussion between having KNOWLEDGE, and having TECHNOLOGY. Those are, in fact, different things. That is, in a nutshell, the difference between 20 years ago and today. They used to be different. Now they are not. Having the technology eventually exposes you to the knowledge. Knowledge now is completely free if you live in the US, because of free access to technology. Between Wikipedia, Craigslist, various social media outlets, there is no way you can be on the Internet today and not find what you are looking for, if it's important to you, eventually. Very much not the case in the 90s. This has a direct effect on the experience of being poor. > Is he really THAT much better off with an XBox One today? Yes, because society was that much worse 20 years ago. What you were escaping was that much more awful. > Rich in 1995 ain't too shabby. In fact, I'd say it's much better than poor in 2015. I would rather be 30 and poor today, than 30 and rich in the 80s. You may disagree, but I was not very well off not that many years ago, and I was able to leapfrog what would have been decades of hustling to get where I am now, because of advantages that I wouldn't have had 30 years ago. You're right, 30 and rich in the 80s isn't too shabby. But that would mean that I would have 30 fewer years of life in today's world. You're completely discounting the value of time and over-valuing money. 30 years is an unimaginably enormous amount of time. I can get 100x the value of my time out of a year here than I could have with any amount of resources in the 80s. If I chose to be 30 and rich in 1985, that means I would be in my sixties today. Being young in today's world is worth, to me, any amount of money you can name. I'm reminded of the fact that things we find totally boring today were fine luxuries in the Middle Ages. Chairs were the domain of the medieval super-rich at one point in time. The conversation we are having right now likely could not have existed 30 years ago.
- VikingCoder 11y ago
  Here, I'll name a few things a rich person could do twenty years ago that a poor person today could not: Visit the Seven Wonders of the Ancient World. Visit the Seven Wonders of the Modern World. Go to Cannes Film Festival. Go to Pixar movie premiers. Personal chef. Personal masseuse. Back-stage passes to go see amazing rock legends, many of whom have died by now. Influence politics. Invest in corporations, like SOLAR power, WIND power, NUCLEAR power. Fund start-ups. Help stabilize and transform former Soviet Block countries. Fly a Mig. Visit the Galapagos islands. See a living White Rhino, up close. Swim with dolphins. Swim with green sea turtles off Maui. Eat at Mama's Fish House on Maui, one night, and stay overnight in Hana so you can wake up early and visit the seven sacred pools bright and early. Walk the Great Wall of China. Go to the Olympics. Ride a hot air balloon. So, let's come back to what you said.. "100x the value"??? Come on. Name TWO things a poor person can actually do today, that would make them tangibly HAPPY, or tangibly BETTER OFF that a rich person couldn't do 20 years ago. > The conversation we are having right now likely could not have existed 30 years ago. First, you're moving the goal-posts, the discussion is 20 years ago. And second, nonsense. I was active on well over 100 BBS systems.
  - vinceguidry 11y ago
    I don't understand your point. I could care less about any of these things. A few of them I would rather not do, even had I the option. Life contains a series of problems that need to be solved. If you solve them adequately, then you are happy and fulfilled. If you don't solve them at all, then you are unhappy. It's as true for the rich as it is for the poor. How to attain personal fulfillment. How to leave a legacy. How to earn the love of your family, friends, and community. How to retain a sense of control over your destiny. You can do all of these things with or without the wealth that would allow you to go to Cannes. You can fail to do them even if your personal masseuse is also your mistress. You can even do them if you're poor. Having the easy access to information that today's Internet offers means you don't have to limit yourself to your own mind, your own efforts. Fly a Mig? Christ man, talk about missing the point.
    - 11y ago

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

vinceguidry 11y ago

> And now you're moving the discussion between having KNOWLEDGE, and having TECHNOLOGY. Those are, in fact, different things. That is, in a nutshell, the difference between 20 years ago and today. They used to be different. Now they are not. Having the technology eventually exposes you to the knowledge. Knowledge now is completely free if you live in the US, because of free access to technology. Between Wikipedia, Craigslist, various social media outlets, there is no way you can be on the Internet today and not find what you are looking for, if it's important to you, eventually. Very much not the case in the 90s. This has a direct effect on the experience of being poor. > Is he really THAT much better off with an XBox One today? Yes, because society was that much worse 20 years ago. What you were escaping was that much more awful. > Rich in 1995 ain't too shabby. In fact, I'd say it's much better than poor in 2015. I would rather be 30 and poor today, than 30 and rich in the 80s. You may disagree, but I was not very well off not that many years ago, and I was able to leapfrog what would have been decades of hustling to get where I am now, because of advantages that I wouldn't have had 30 years ago. You're right, 30 and rich in the 80s isn't too shabby. But that would mean that I would have 30 fewer years of life in today's world. You're completely discounting the value of time and over-valuing money. 30 years is an unimaginably enormous amount of time. I can get 100x the value of my time out of a year here than I could have with any amount of resources in the 80s. If I chose to be 30 and rich in 1985, that means I would be in my sixties today. Being young in today's world is worth, to me, any amount of money you can name. I'm reminded of the fact that things we find totally boring today were fine luxuries in the Middle Ages. Chairs were the domain of the medieval super-rich at one point in time. The conversation we are having right now likely could not have existed 30 years ago.

VikingCoder 11y ago
Here, I'll name a few things a rich person could do twenty years ago that a poor person today could not: Visit the Seven Wonders of the Ancient World. Visit the Seven Wonders of the Modern World. Go to Cannes Film Festival. Go to Pixar movie premiers. Personal chef. Personal masseuse. Back-stage passes to go see amazing rock legends, many of whom have died by now. Influence politics. Invest in corporations, like SOLAR power, WIND power, NUCLEAR power. Fund start-ups. Help stabilize and transform former Soviet Block countries. Fly a Mig. Visit the Galapagos islands. See a living White Rhino, up close. Swim with dolphins. Swim with green sea turtles off Maui. Eat at Mama's Fish House on Maui, one night, and stay overnight in Hana so you can wake up early and visit the seven sacred pools bright and early. Walk the Great Wall of China. Go to the Olympics. Ride a hot air balloon. So, let's come back to what you said.. "100x the value"??? Come on. Name TWO things a poor person can actually do today, that would make them tangibly HAPPY, or tangibly BETTER OFF that a rich person couldn't do 20 years ago. > The conversation we are having right now likely could not have existed 30 years ago. First, you're moving the goal-posts, the discussion is 20 years ago. And second, nonsense. I was active on well over 100 BBS systems.
- vinceguidry 11y ago
  I don't understand your point. I could care less about any of these things. A few of them I would rather not do, even had I the option. Life contains a series of problems that need to be solved. If you solve them adequately, then you are happy and fulfilled. If you don't solve them at all, then you are unhappy. It's as true for the rich as it is for the poor. How to attain personal fulfillment. How to leave a legacy. How to earn the love of your family, friends, and community. How to retain a sense of control over your destiny. You can do all of these things with or without the wealth that would allow you to go to Cannes. You can fail to do them even if your personal masseuse is also your mistress. You can even do them if you're poor. Having the easy access to information that today's Internet offers means you don't have to limit yourself to your own mind, your own efforts. Fly a Mig? Christ man, talk about missing the point.
  - 11y ago