5 ms·

(a) they're not pictograms and (b) hieroglyphs worked for thousands of years.

CamperBob2 11y ago
(a) Yes, they are (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_character_classification#Pictograms https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_character_classificati...). (b) So why'd the Egyptians stop using them? What makes them right for today's needs?
- thaumasiotes 11y ago
  From your link, "pictograms" are glyphs that depict the objects they represent (for example, 下 directly depicts the abstract concept of "down"). Egyptian hieroglyphs, in their ornate form, clearly depict various items like reeds, birds, arms, and snakes. But those glyphs don't actually refer to the reeds, birds, arms, and snakes they show; rather, the ancient Egyptian writing system is largely alphabetic. Their formal letters were just much prettier than ours.
  - ajanuary 11y ago
    My understanding is that they were both, depending on context.
- gotchange 11y ago
  We stopped using them because we changed the language we speak due to external factors like being conquered and dominated by foreigners who brought their language and writing system with them. It wasn't a voluntary act, trust me and with the rise of the emojis as a medium of communication, I can say that we or the ancient Egyptians had it right all along in using hieroglyphs.
  - CamperBob2 11y ago
    Oh, OK. Those damn foreign imperialists again, always oppressing our hieroglyphics. I'm out. This thread is 200TB of crazy on a 10TB drive.
    - gotchange 11y ago
      I'm afraid that the only one not making any sense on this thread is you. We didn't drop the use of our indigenous writing system in favor of that of the Romans or the Arabs because we thought that theirs are superior than ours, we dropped them because we were conquered and dominated and we had to adopt the cultural norms of the invaders. Also, you're EXTREMELY overestimating the individual agency of the ancient Egyptian in this matter. Most of the citizens of ancient Egypt were illiterate and only a certain class or caste had the privilege to be able to read and write but the rest of the population were completely oblivious to those icons and therefore your argument is just baseless.
      - GFK_of_xmaspast 11y ago
        > only a certain class or caste had the privilege to be able to read and write And in fact that's why they're HIEROglyphics, they were the priestly writings. (compare to demotic, as also seen on the Rosetta stone).
        thaumasiotes 11y ago
        Hieroglyphics and demotic are the same writing system using the same letters. They're like print and cursive.
      - emblem21 11y ago
        Colonial conquest is not the primary methodology of linguistic propagation. Trade is. English is the primary programming language, not because a team of dedicated Anglo-Saxons are pointing rifles as the head of brown people, but because American trade provides the most profit motive between 1974-2008.
        coldtea 11y ago
        >Colonial conquest is not the primary methodology of linguistic propagation. Trade is. A "primary methodology" only applies in "most" cases, not all of them. Lots of languages have perished for outside forces other than trade -- the Hebrew wasn't abandoned because a better trade language came around, but because Israel was conquered and the locals scattered. Other languages were persecuted by decree. Others died because their native speakers were eliminated. And several other ways (e.g. Mussolini tried to smooth out local dialects of italian using the powers of government plus radio and early cinema).

(a) Yes, they are (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_character_classification#Pictograms https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_character_classificati...). (b) So why'd the Egyptians stop using them? What makes them right for today's needs?

thaumasiotes 11y ago
From your link, "pictograms" are glyphs that depict the objects they represent (for example, 下 directly depicts the abstract concept of "down"). Egyptian hieroglyphs, in their ornate form, clearly depict various items like reeds, birds, arms, and snakes. But those glyphs don't actually refer to the reeds, birds, arms, and snakes they show; rather, the ancient Egyptian writing system is largely alphabetic. Their formal letters were just much prettier than ours.
- ajanuary 11y ago
  My understanding is that they were both, depending on context.
gotchange 11y ago
We stopped using them because we changed the language we speak due to external factors like being conquered and dominated by foreigners who brought their language and writing system with them. It wasn't a voluntary act, trust me and with the rise of the emojis as a medium of communication, I can say that we or the ancient Egyptians had it right all along in using hieroglyphs.
- CamperBob2 11y ago
  Oh, OK. Those damn foreign imperialists again, always oppressing our hieroglyphics. I'm out. This thread is 200TB of crazy on a 10TB drive.
  - gotchange 11y ago
    I'm afraid that the only one not making any sense on this thread is you. We didn't drop the use of our indigenous writing system in favor of that of the Romans or the Arabs because we thought that theirs are superior than ours, we dropped them because we were conquered and dominated and we had to adopt the cultural norms of the invaders. Also, you're EXTREMELY overestimating the individual agency of the ancient Egyptian in this matter. Most of the citizens of ancient Egypt were illiterate and only a certain class or caste had the privilege to be able to read and write but the rest of the population were completely oblivious to those icons and therefore your argument is just baseless.
    - GFK_of_xmaspast 11y ago
      > only a certain class or caste had the privilege to be able to read and write And in fact that's why they're HIEROglyphics, they were the priestly writings. (compare to demotic, as also seen on the Rosetta stone).
      - thaumasiotes 11y ago
        Hieroglyphics and demotic are the same writing system using the same letters. They're like print and cursive.
    - emblem21 11y ago
      Colonial conquest is not the primary methodology of linguistic propagation. Trade is. English is the primary programming language, not because a team of dedicated Anglo-Saxons are pointing rifles as the head of brown people, but because American trade provides the most profit motive between 1974-2008.
      - coldtea 11y ago
        >Colonial conquest is not the primary methodology of linguistic propagation. Trade is. A "primary methodology" only applies in "most" cases, not all of them. Lots of languages have perished for outside forces other than trade -- the Hebrew wasn't abandoned because a better trade language came around, but because Israel was conquered and the locals scattered. Other languages were persecuted by decree. Others died because their native speakers were eliminated. And several other ways (e.g. Mussolini tried to smooth out local dialects of italian using the powers of government plus radio and early cinema).