5 ms·

Intrinsic Motivation Doesn't Exist, Researcher Says (2005)

12 points by jimsojim 11y ago

brudgers 11y ago
Paper[Related?]: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Steven_Reiss2/publication/232454071_Multifaceted_Nature_of_Intrinsic_Motivation_The_Theory_of_16_Basic_Desires/links/549adc080cf2b80371371525.pdf https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Steven_Reiss2/publicati... Date: 2004 HN Wayback: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1423198 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1423198
erikb 11y ago
It is also a question I ask myself. I haven't found a single motivation in myself that is not in some degree externally triggered. Even the fear of losing respect of your equals (coworkers, friends, family), although maybe just a fantasy in your head, can still be argued to be external.
- Htsthbjig 11y ago
  "Even the fear of losing respect of your equals (coworkers, friends, family), although maybe just a fantasy in your head, can still be argued to be external." How could that be? It is not maybe, it is a fantasy in your head. This fantasy could be very similar to reality, so I prefer the word "simulation", as this is what it is: you simulate the future in your head with the knowledge you got in the past. In the past you got trained like a Paulov dog about what society expected from you, for example being raised as a catholic could mean sex with other people = bad, liking money= bad,being humble=good, sharing=good, competing with others=bad. If you don't get out of your original society your prediction could be very accurate, specially if you accept it without resistance. In the past I faced all my environment(friends, family and lovers), but instead of accepting it I fought it, and interesting enough they were the ones who in the end accepted it. “Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.”H.Ford
Htsthbjig 11y ago
“But there is no real evidence that intrinsic motivation even exists.” Yes, there is. I have a Labrador dog, every time she watches a puddle, she wants to get in. Most Labrador dogs do the same with every source of water. I have not told my dog to like water. Dogs also respond naturally to bunnies in the field. We are not that different from dogs. I need to know how things work internally, I disassembled every electronic machine in my house when I was a kid because I HAD TO KNOW how those things worked, and nobody told me to do it, on the contrary I was punished by my parents as some of those did not come back to live(until I learned to do it well). No matter the punishment I will do it anyway because there was something inside me that pushed me. I got so good that I will disassemble something and nobody will notice. I have met people that needed to dance, or paint, or play music or create no matter how badly paid they were.
quietplatypus 11y ago
Is this just the lame philosophical trivia game where if you can name the thing that motivates you, by definition it's not intrinsic? Booooooooooooooooooooooring.
digitalengineer 11y ago
Daniel Pink wrote a great book about this called "Drive: The Surprising Truth About What Motivates Us". Review: http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/218852 http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/218852
phphphph 11y ago
Very misleading title. His points are roughly tl;dr: - Intrinsic vs. extrinsic is not sufficient to fully describe the range of motivation - intrinsic isn't well-defined - Extrinsic can work well, too - It's not proven that intrinsic makes happier

12 points by jimsojim 11y ago

Paper[Related?]: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Steven_Reiss2/publication/232454071_Multifaceted_Nature_of_Intrinsic_Motivation_The_Theory_of_16_Basic_Desires/links/549adc080cf2b80371371525.pdf https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Steven_Reiss2/publicati... Date: 2004 HN Wayback: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1423198 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1423198

erikb 11y ago

It is also a question I ask myself. I haven't found a single motivation in myself that is not in some degree externally triggered. Even the fear of losing respect of your equals (coworkers, friends, family), although maybe just a fantasy in your head, can still be argued to be external.

Htsthbjig 11y ago
"Even the fear of losing respect of your equals (coworkers, friends, family), although maybe just a fantasy in your head, can still be argued to be external." How could that be? It is not maybe, it is a fantasy in your head. This fantasy could be very similar to reality, so I prefer the word "simulation", as this is what it is: you simulate the future in your head with the knowledge you got in the past. In the past you got trained like a Paulov dog about what society expected from you, for example being raised as a catholic could mean sex with other people = bad, liking money= bad,being humble=good, sharing=good, competing with others=bad. If you don't get out of your original society your prediction could be very accurate, specially if you accept it without resistance. In the past I faced all my environment(friends, family and lovers), but instead of accepting it I fought it, and interesting enough they were the ones who in the end accepted it. “Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.”H.Ford

Htsthbjig 11y ago

“But there is no real evidence that intrinsic motivation even exists.” Yes, there is. I have a Labrador dog, every time she watches a puddle, she wants to get in. Most Labrador dogs do the same with every source of water. I have not told my dog to like water. Dogs also respond naturally to bunnies in the field. We are not that different from dogs. I need to know how things work internally, I disassembled every electronic machine in my house when I was a kid because I HAD TO KNOW how those things worked, and nobody told me to do it, on the contrary I was punished by my parents as some of those did not come back to live(until I learned to do it well). No matter the punishment I will do it anyway because there was something inside me that pushed me. I got so good that I will disassemble something and nobody will notice. I have met people that needed to dance, or paint, or play music or create no matter how badly paid they were.

quietplatypus 11y ago

Is this just the lame philosophical trivia game where if you can name the thing that motivates you, by definition it's not intrinsic? Booooooooooooooooooooooring.

digitalengineer 11y ago

Daniel Pink wrote a great book about this called "Drive: The Surprising Truth About What Motivates Us". Review: http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/218852 http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/218852

phphphph 11y ago

Very misleading title. His points are roughly tl;dr: - Intrinsic vs. extrinsic is not sufficient to fully describe the range of motivation - intrinsic isn't well-defined - Extrinsic can work well, too - It's not proven that intrinsic makes happier