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Some environments cannot handle all the churn. Things breaking for no reason are delivering no value to the customer or your product.

drinchev 11y ago
Yep, but environments also change. Microservices are so popular nowadays and I see so many libraries written by Yahoo, Microsoft, Airbnb, etc., which are NodeJS oriented. And no. Things break all the time and still give value to customers. Things break for A reason and still give value to customers. Yep it would be cool and more non-breaking if 20-years of Java experience was injected into NodeJS, but I bet in 20-years NodeJS will be even better than the popular alternatives these days.
- xemdetia 11y ago
  I think the point trying to be raised is that node seems to be built on a mindset of endless churn where some of us need to be able to write software that we aren't going to be able to CI and develop on for a year and expect it to work the same time next year without further development. Also like some have mentioned a high severity CVE that comes out turns into 'how fast can I move to fix it and then go back to something else.' Sometimes the value to customers is just a system that works without downtime or failures, and the next increase in value is not even related to something that was built on this bleeding-edge packaging model. The only types of development projects that seem to benefit from it are the kind of project that can dedicate a full-time or mostly-full-time developer to it forever (forever being the lifetime of the product/service). If dependency issues crop up every few months for a perodically updated project that could almost be a death knell, if you have to pivot or do major work on the backend all of a sudden you could come back to just a broken set of shambles. So the only thing it fits is a really strange gap between hobbyist/side project and stable production which ends up being just plain risky for a technology choice.
  - drinchev 11y ago
    Upvoted your comment. I mostly agree. IMHO Node isn't built on this mindset ( endless churn ). I think it's just rapidly evolving. It's just enthusiasm by the community. As far as my experience goes, I just put more effort in finding the right module rather than finding >any< module that will do the work. Afterwards I can usually npm-shrinkwrap, upload to DigitalOcean and leave forever.
Touche 11y ago
No one's suggesting using Node.js in the space shuttle. These are mostly disposable web apps we're talking about.

drinchev 11y ago

Yep, but environments also change. Microservices are so popular nowadays and I see so many libraries written by Yahoo, Microsoft, Airbnb, etc., which are NodeJS oriented. And no. Things break all the time and still give value to customers. Things break for A reason and still give value to customers. Yep it would be cool and more non-breaking if 20-years of Java experience was injected into NodeJS, but I bet in 20-years NodeJS will be even better than the popular alternatives these days.

xemdetia 11y ago
I think the point trying to be raised is that node seems to be built on a mindset of endless churn where some of us need to be able to write software that we aren't going to be able to CI and develop on for a year and expect it to work the same time next year without further development. Also like some have mentioned a high severity CVE that comes out turns into 'how fast can I move to fix it and then go back to something else.' Sometimes the value to customers is just a system that works without downtime or failures, and the next increase in value is not even related to something that was built on this bleeding-edge packaging model. The only types of development projects that seem to benefit from it are the kind of project that can dedicate a full-time or mostly-full-time developer to it forever (forever being the lifetime of the product/service). If dependency issues crop up every few months for a perodically updated project that could almost be a death knell, if you have to pivot or do major work on the backend all of a sudden you could come back to just a broken set of shambles. So the only thing it fits is a really strange gap between hobbyist/side project and stable production which ends up being just plain risky for a technology choice.
- drinchev 11y ago
  Upvoted your comment. I mostly agree. IMHO Node isn't built on this mindset ( endless churn ). I think it's just rapidly evolving. It's just enthusiasm by the community. As far as my experience goes, I just put more effort in finding the right module rather than finding >any< module that will do the work. Afterwards I can usually npm-shrinkwrap, upload to DigitalOcean and leave forever.

Touche 11y ago

No one's suggesting using Node.js in the space shuttle. These are mostly disposable web apps we're talking about.