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Wow. Most companies are deaf to user outrage. The original decision wasn't fantastic, but I understand the whole "Friends of..." certification route. At least

Wow. Most companies are deaf to user outrage. The original decision wasn't fantastic, but I understand the whole "Friends of..." certification route. At least in the future they'll be able to stick to "if it's not certified by us..." for customer support, which was likely the original impetus (along with a desire to cut off cheap alternatives to their devices). I'm not mad at this at all.

eveningcoffee 11y ago
I'm not mad at this at all. I am. Because it is a way to extort money out of other ZigBee participants.
- themartorana 11y ago
  Sure, that's fair. But from their standpoint it's a bit "damned if you do, damned if you don't." This is conjecture, but I imagine supporting cheaper third-party devices is becoming a headache. In the last thread about this, a former ZigBee developer noted how difficult it was to code to the platform. It may not all be evil.
  - eveningcoffee 11y ago
    But from their standpoint it's a bit "damned if you do, damned if you don't." No, it is not. They have two options - have their own standard or support other ZigBee devices. This has not been a problem with another similar standards like KNX. but I imagine supporting cheaper third-party devices is becoming a headache It is not about supporting some cheap third-party devices but other ZigBee devices that Philips claims to support.
- rubidium 11y ago
  It's not extorting. It's making sure your house doesn't burn down because you bought the el cheapo bulb from knockoff brand C.
  - rrrx3 11y ago
    It's making sure that you're not liable for someone's house burning down because they bought the el cheapo bulb from knockoff brand C. This is standard protective legal boilerplate to protect philips in the unlikely event. Also, want to point out that philips is not "extorting money" from other companies - they can choose to enter the "friends of" program to make the general consumer feel better, or choose not to, at their discretion. The class of user that realizes any zigbee bulb will work with a hue hub is already technically proficient, and will more often than not be willing to take on any associated "risks."
  - raverbashing 11y ago
    Pray tell how does a LED Lamp can burn your house down Oh wait it can't (if it can because your wiring is crap and the protection devices are not working you have much bigger problems)
    - TeMPOraL 11y ago
      A LED bulb converts your 230V AC (or 110V in the US) power source into 12V DC (in case of Hue itself). This converter part can, if poorly made, create a fire hazard. And a bulb is usually mounted inside a lamp, many of which are flammable and have the shape that will accumulate heat inside instead of dissipating it.
      - pjc50 11y ago
        .. but that's not a software issue.
        TeMPOraL 11y ago
        I know, but 'raverbashing wasn't talking about one. He asked how a LED lamp could burn your house down.
      - raverbashing 11y ago
        Yes, but that applies to china mobile chargers and a lot of other devices that nobody worries about (and also to CFDs and any led lamp that might be today in your house) And of course it's not a software issue
acjohnson55 11y ago
Good move on their part. At the end of the day, it seems like a win-win. I've never even considered buying a Hue, and didn't know it was even possible to integrate with 3rd-party stuff. Now I do, and I have the perception that Philips is responsive to customer opinion!

eveningcoffee 11y ago

I'm not mad at this at all. I am. Because it is a way to extort money out of other ZigBee participants.

themartorana 11y ago
Sure, that's fair. But from their standpoint it's a bit "damned if you do, damned if you don't." This is conjecture, but I imagine supporting cheaper third-party devices is becoming a headache. In the last thread about this, a former ZigBee developer noted how difficult it was to code to the platform. It may not all be evil.
- eveningcoffee 11y ago
  But from their standpoint it's a bit "damned if you do, damned if you don't." No, it is not. They have two options - have their own standard or support other ZigBee devices. This has not been a problem with another similar standards like KNX. but I imagine supporting cheaper third-party devices is becoming a headache It is not about supporting some cheap third-party devices but other ZigBee devices that Philips claims to support.
rubidium 11y ago
It's not extorting. It's making sure your house doesn't burn down because you bought the el cheapo bulb from knockoff brand C.
- rrrx3 11y ago
  It's making sure that you're not liable for someone's house burning down because they bought the el cheapo bulb from knockoff brand C. This is standard protective legal boilerplate to protect philips in the unlikely event. Also, want to point out that philips is not "extorting money" from other companies - they can choose to enter the "friends of" program to make the general consumer feel better, or choose not to, at their discretion. The class of user that realizes any zigbee bulb will work with a hue hub is already technically proficient, and will more often than not be willing to take on any associated "risks."
- raverbashing 11y ago
  Pray tell how does a LED Lamp can burn your house down Oh wait it can't (if it can because your wiring is crap and the protection devices are not working you have much bigger problems)
  - TeMPOraL 11y ago
    A LED bulb converts your 230V AC (or 110V in the US) power source into 12V DC (in case of Hue itself). This converter part can, if poorly made, create a fire hazard. And a bulb is usually mounted inside a lamp, many of which are flammable and have the shape that will accumulate heat inside instead of dissipating it.
    - pjc50 11y ago
      .. but that's not a software issue.
      - TeMPOraL 11y ago
        I know, but 'raverbashing wasn't talking about one. He asked how a LED lamp could burn your house down.
    - raverbashing 11y ago
      Yes, but that applies to china mobile chargers and a lot of other devices that nobody worries about (and also to CFDs and any led lamp that might be today in your house) And of course it's not a software issue

acjohnson55 11y ago

Good move on their part. At the end of the day, it seems like a win-win. I've never even considered buying a Hue, and didn't know it was even possible to integrate with 3rd-party stuff. Now I do, and I have the perception that Philips is responsive to customer opinion!