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It's a bit sad to see LibreOffice struggling to maintain relevance when the market it tried to address suddenly became [nearly nonexistent] irrelevant. It remi

It's a bit sad to see LibreOffice struggling to maintain relevance when the market it tried to address suddenly became [nearly nonexistent] irrelevant. It reminds me of all those hundreds of early 20th century battleships that suddenly became completely irrelevant when the Dreadnought came by. [Edit: replaced nearly nonexistent with irrelevant to make my point clearer]

jacquesm 11y ago
> It's a bit sad to see LibreOffice struggling to maintain relevance when the market it tried to address suddenly became nearly nonexistent. It works just fine for me and I'm not going anywhere for now so this little part of the 'market' will be around for a while. The ability to own and administer your files is severely under-rated.
- ucaetano 11y ago
  Oh yes, there will always be a very small niche market for almost any piece of technology. Open source projects never die, they just linger forever on the edges of oblivion. > The ability to own and administer your files is severely under-rated. Or severely over-rated depending who you ask :)
  - jacquesm 11y ago
    > Or severely over-rated depending who you ask :) Give it some time.
coldtea 11y ago
>It's a bit sad to see LibreOffice struggling to maintain relevance when the market it tried to address suddenly became nearly nonexistent. If you mean that we've moved from desktop office apps to cloud-based Office apps that's absolutely not true. The numbers I've seen for Google Docs etc are insignificant compared to office workers using MS Office and the rest. People who think Cloud docs have "won" apparently don't share the sames experiences with 99% of office workers in enterprise/businesses/governments etc. In startup-land and small web businesses yes, cloud docs do well, but those are insignificant numbers-wise to the millions upon millions of classic office workers. LibreOffice might be irrelevant, but that's because not many care for a free/open source office suite that's not MS Office, not because we've moved to Cloud documents.
- scholia 11y ago
  This is true. However, the cloud is part of Office 365's ecosystem play. You get the full-strength Office programs installed locally (Windows and Mac), plus the ability to work in the cloud, plus the mobile apps for Windows, iOS and Android. Even if "99% of office workers in enterprise/businesses/governments etc" do their work on the desktop, there's still some appeal to being able to get what you want where you want it. This is where LibreOffice is trailing badly (as is Google Docs).
  - workitout 11y ago
    >> there's still some appeal to being able to get what you want where you want it That implies most companies are willing to trust their business secrets to the cloud. That isn't what I see happening, not in medium sized business or enterprises.
    - scholia 11y ago
      Agreed, up to a point. But a lot of companies are already using hosted email, and a lot have signed up for Office 365 and/or Google Docs.... https://cloud.google.com/customers/ https://cloud.google.com/customers/ https://products.office.com/en-us/business/office-365-customer-stories-office-testimonials https://products.office.com/en-us/business/office-365-custom... Quite a lot use salesforce.com and other services. It isn't the majority, but the cloud business is big and it's growing fast. http://www.computerworld.com/article/2974016/enterprise-applications/office-365-tops-salesforce-as-most-popular-enterprise-service.html http://www.computerworld.com/article/2974016/enterprise-appl...
- ucaetano 11y ago
  Do you believe that will be the same 10 years from now? 15? It takes a lot of time to change an installed base, but that ship has sailed already.
  - JustSomeNobody 11y ago
    In tech, all things old are new again every 10 years or so. You can't ever say "that ship has sailed."
andrepd 11y ago
>the market it tried to address suddenly became nearly nonexistent Can you give something to back the claim?
- ucaetano 11y ago
  I edited my post, my point was that the market for pure offline office productivity suites has become irrelevant, since the competition now is between a pure cloud-based service and a mix of offline and cloud based service :)
  - RottenHuman 11y ago
    And why should LibreOffice not be able to integrate a "cloud service" into their suite? The extension interface of Libre Office even lets me think that this would be technically a triviality to integrate. Maybe with an open standard instead of a propriety and closed eco system, with the freedom to choose whom you trust with your data, or to host it yourself.
    - ucaetano 11y ago
      Oh, they can, no doubt about that. And that's what the post is about, trying to stay relevant in a changing market. But it adds a lot of complexity, since it switches from a product to a service.
downtide 11y ago
Which market are you referring to? I still crave for a really nice word processor, spreadsheet, and easy database app (in the style of Access). I've always found *Office a bit rough around the edges. My partner recently brought home an iPad from work. Word failed to play well with other (MS Word) Office documents, so file exchange and formats are still a complete pain in the neck. I will be using plain text until something better comes along.
- scholia 11y ago
  >I will be using plain text until something better comes along. Didn't RTF coma along a couple of decades ago?
  - downtide 11y ago
    I should rephrase that then. The plain text is very portable. And easier to edit and read than RTF. That's not to say that there aren't good RTF editors out there. Even HTML is more readable.
    - scholia 11y ago
      Depends what you want to do. RTF can handle the presentation needs of most simple documents, and most word processors can edit RTF files, including WordPad and TextEdit. It's also very easy to convert RTF to plain text.....
- ucaetano 11y ago
  I think we can all agree that you're not representative of the market, and to be honest, I'd guess (with no data to back it up) that the majority of readers here aren't as well.
  - downtide 11y ago
    I wouldn't say I was representative of the market. But I would like a good product. How do you define the market?
RottenHuman 11y ago
> replaced nearly nonexistent with irrelevant to make my point clearer I'm afraid your point is still not clear. What's your metric for declaring a market irrelevant? A conventional office suite is still the solution which is overwhelmingly dominating the market. Maybe look outside your own bubble and bias. A lot of business will never give away there confidential documents in the hands of third party cloud hosts. (which is the sane approach). So what's your criteria for calling that niche, irrelevant or even non-existent?
- ucaetano 11y ago
  When all the major players are switching to a different market. Sure, the installed base is still conventional office suites, but that's like saying that the car market is still gas-based even if all new cars sold are electrical (hypothetical situation). http://www.winbeta.org/news/office-365-overtakes-google-apps-in-business-market-triples-share-in-a-year http://www.winbeta.org/news/office-365-overtakes-google-apps... Bitglass also found that the share of companies using a cloud application for their productivity suite rose from 28% last year to 48% this year. Their report shows that Microsoft has successfully capitalized on the growth in cloud based productivity suite adoption rates to take the lead from Google.

jacquesm 11y ago

> It's a bit sad to see LibreOffice struggling to maintain relevance when the market it tried to address suddenly became nearly nonexistent. It works just fine for me and I'm not going anywhere for now so this little part of the 'market' will be around for a while. The ability to own and administer your files is severely under-rated.

ucaetano 11y ago
Oh yes, there will always be a very small niche market for almost any piece of technology. Open source projects never die, they just linger forever on the edges of oblivion. > The ability to own and administer your files is severely under-rated. Or severely over-rated depending who you ask :)
- jacquesm 11y ago
  > Or severely over-rated depending who you ask :) Give it some time.

coldtea 11y ago

>It's a bit sad to see LibreOffice struggling to maintain relevance when the market it tried to address suddenly became nearly nonexistent. If you mean that we've moved from desktop office apps to cloud-based Office apps that's absolutely not true. The numbers I've seen for Google Docs etc are insignificant compared to office workers using MS Office and the rest. People who think Cloud docs have "won" apparently don't share the sames experiences with 99% of office workers in enterprise/businesses/governments etc. In startup-land and small web businesses yes, cloud docs do well, but those are insignificant numbers-wise to the millions upon millions of classic office workers. LibreOffice might be irrelevant, but that's because not many care for a free/open source office suite that's not MS Office, not because we've moved to Cloud documents.

scholia 11y ago
This is true. However, the cloud is part of Office 365's ecosystem play. You get the full-strength Office programs installed locally (Windows and Mac), plus the ability to work in the cloud, plus the mobile apps for Windows, iOS and Android. Even if "99% of office workers in enterprise/businesses/governments etc" do their work on the desktop, there's still some appeal to being able to get what you want where you want it. This is where LibreOffice is trailing badly (as is Google Docs).
- workitout 11y ago
  >> there's still some appeal to being able to get what you want where you want it That implies most companies are willing to trust their business secrets to the cloud. That isn't what I see happening, not in medium sized business or enterprises.
  - scholia 11y ago
    Agreed, up to a point. But a lot of companies are already using hosted email, and a lot have signed up for Office 365 and/or Google Docs.... https://cloud.google.com/customers/ https://cloud.google.com/customers/ https://products.office.com/en-us/business/office-365-customer-stories-office-testimonials https://products.office.com/en-us/business/office-365-custom... Quite a lot use salesforce.com and other services. It isn't the majority, but the cloud business is big and it's growing fast. http://www.computerworld.com/article/2974016/enterprise-applications/office-365-tops-salesforce-as-most-popular-enterprise-service.html http://www.computerworld.com/article/2974016/enterprise-appl...
ucaetano 11y ago
Do you believe that will be the same 10 years from now? 15? It takes a lot of time to change an installed base, but that ship has sailed already.
- JustSomeNobody 11y ago
  In tech, all things old are new again every 10 years or so. You can't ever say "that ship has sailed."

andrepd 11y ago

>the market it tried to address suddenly became nearly nonexistent Can you give something to back the claim?

ucaetano 11y ago
I edited my post, my point was that the market for pure offline office productivity suites has become irrelevant, since the competition now is between a pure cloud-based service and a mix of offline and cloud based service :)
- RottenHuman 11y ago
  And why should LibreOffice not be able to integrate a "cloud service" into their suite? The extension interface of Libre Office even lets me think that this would be technically a triviality to integrate. Maybe with an open standard instead of a propriety and closed eco system, with the freedom to choose whom you trust with your data, or to host it yourself.
  - ucaetano 11y ago
    Oh, they can, no doubt about that. And that's what the post is about, trying to stay relevant in a changing market. But it adds a lot of complexity, since it switches from a product to a service.

downtide 11y ago

Which market are you referring to? I still crave for a really nice word processor, spreadsheet, and easy database app (in the style of Access). I've always found *Office a bit rough around the edges. My partner recently brought home an iPad from work. Word failed to play well with other (MS Word) Office documents, so file exchange and formats are still a complete pain in the neck. I will be using plain text until something better comes along.

scholia 11y ago
>I will be using plain text until something better comes along. Didn't RTF coma along a couple of decades ago?
- downtide 11y ago
  I should rephrase that then. The plain text is very portable. And easier to edit and read than RTF. That's not to say that there aren't good RTF editors out there. Even HTML is more readable.
  - scholia 11y ago
    Depends what you want to do. RTF can handle the presentation needs of most simple documents, and most word processors can edit RTF files, including WordPad and TextEdit. It's also very easy to convert RTF to plain text.....
ucaetano 11y ago
I think we can all agree that you're not representative of the market, and to be honest, I'd guess (with no data to back it up) that the majority of readers here aren't as well.
- downtide 11y ago
  I wouldn't say I was representative of the market. But I would like a good product. How do you define the market?

RottenHuman 11y ago

> replaced nearly nonexistent with irrelevant to make my point clearer I'm afraid your point is still not clear. What's your metric for declaring a market irrelevant? A conventional office suite is still the solution which is overwhelmingly dominating the market. Maybe look outside your own bubble and bias. A lot of business will never give away there confidential documents in the hands of third party cloud hosts. (which is the sane approach). So what's your criteria for calling that niche, irrelevant or even non-existent?

ucaetano 11y ago
When all the major players are switching to a different market. Sure, the installed base is still conventional office suites, but that's like saying that the car market is still gas-based even if all new cars sold are electrical (hypothetical situation). http://www.winbeta.org/news/office-365-overtakes-google-apps-in-business-market-triples-share-in-a-year http://www.winbeta.org/news/office-365-overtakes-google-apps... Bitglass also found that the share of companies using a cloud application for their productivity suite rose from 28% last year to 48% this year. Their report shows that Microsoft has successfully capitalized on the growth in cloud based productivity suite adoption rates to take the lead from Google.