5 ms·

> It's fundamentalist opposition to welfare and social programs and universal healthcare We have welfare and a multitude of social programs design to assist th

by maratd 11y ago

> It's fundamentalist opposition to welfare and social programs and universal healthcare We have welfare and a multitude of social programs design to assist those who need help. You can walk into any emergency room in the country and receive whatever care you need even without insurance or payment on-hand. Mind you, the government provides insurance to the poor and elderly. It has been this way for a very long time. A full 66% of our federal budget is devoted to exactly these types of programs. That's over 2 trillion dollars. Every year. http://www.heritage.org/federalbudget/budget-entitlement-programs http://www.heritage.org/federalbudget/budget-entitlement-pro... Where are you getting your silly notions? > What are you basing that on? The EU is over 50 countries with their own languages and customs and politics. I wasn't talking about the country-level. Read what I wrote. The US is highly diverse on a street level. Rich live with the poor, side by side. This is not the case in Europe. In Europe, the classes are highly segregated. In the US, there is a very real attempt at having diverse neighborhoods with people of different backgrounds living side by side. Can you point to the same in the EU? And you want to talk about equality?

mavrc 11y ago
> You can walk into any emergency room in the country and receive whatever care you need even without insurance or payment on-hand. While this is a benefit of sorts (you won't actually be allowed to die due to lack of funds), it's not like the work you receive is free. You'll end up paying it back to someone. Where I live, for example, the county tends to pay off debt like this to the hospital for a significantly smaller portion of the cost. They will allow you to finance it for a very long time, but you will still pay for it. Until it's paid for, even if it takes a very long time. If the county decides not to help you (maybe, for example, you're not a taxpaying resident of the place you ended up going to the emergency room in) then the hospital will bill you for it. They might, after hounding you for a while, charge you only pennies on the dollar to pay it. Or they might be convinced to write it off - which they do occasionally, but only occasionally. The only sure way to avoid paying debt accrued through emergency medical services is to have no assets.
MAGZine 11y ago
So the millions of students with massive amounts of student debt or people losing their homes due to injury or disease don't need help? Anyhow, the point about rich and poor living side by side happens anywhere where there is gentrification. Some communities, too. I promise you that in some islands in greece there are beggars living side by side to people loading 50" plasmas onto donkeys
fapjacks 11y ago
> We have welfare and a multitude of social programs design to assist those who need help. We absolutely do not, and it is disingenuous to claim otherwise. Europe has vastly less wealth disparity, and many more social welfare programs that ensure a pretty high degree of social mobility. The United States doesn't hold a candle to most of Europe in this regard. And you know something infuriating? My tax rate is only 10% less where I live in the States than what it will be when I move to Sweden. Our taxes are high as hell and we get basically nothing for them. A nice weapons development program, and there's something to be said for that, and then the Social Security ponzi scheme. But nothing else. Sweden has a huge number of beneficial programs that actually help people when they need it. And your one citation is from the Heritage Foundation.
- pc86 11y ago
  > Europe has vastly less wealth disparity How does the income disparity between Flint and San Francisco compare to the income disparity between Luxembourg and Bulgaria? Between Germany and Romania? > My tax rate is only 10% less where I live in the States than what it will be when I move to Sweden. No. The Swedish deduction is $2,690 - in the US it's between $6,300 and $12,600. Not to mention that our federal tax rates top out at about 2/3 of the maximum Swedish tax rate (sub-40% compared to 59.7%). Highest state sales tax is under 12% while Swedish VAT is up to 25%. Not to mention capital gains in Sweden is twice what it is in the US unless you make nearly half a million a year, in which case it's only 10 points higher (30% v. 15%/20%) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_rates https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_rates > And your one citation is from the Heritage Foundation. I would say the source has little relevance if what it's saying is accurate (which it is).
  - fapjacks 11y ago
    So, for what it's worth, you're using some pretty useless numbers without context. And they are giving you a pretty distorted picture of the reality (much like the Heritage Foundation). You're looking at some numbers on Wikipedia. I am talking about my experience earning income and paying taxes in both countries. I'm telling you, my taxes right this minute are only about 10% less than my taxes in Sweden. This is the reality. If that makes you mad, make sure you're getting mad at the right people.

by maratd 11y ago

mavrc 11y ago

> You can walk into any emergency room in the country and receive whatever care you need even without insurance or payment on-hand. While this is a benefit of sorts (you won't actually be allowed to die due to lack of funds), it's not like the work you receive is free. You'll end up paying it back to someone. Where I live, for example, the county tends to pay off debt like this to the hospital for a significantly smaller portion of the cost. They will allow you to finance it for a very long time, but you will still pay for it. Until it's paid for, even if it takes a very long time. If the county decides not to help you (maybe, for example, you're not a taxpaying resident of the place you ended up going to the emergency room in) then the hospital will bill you for it. They might, after hounding you for a while, charge you only pennies on the dollar to pay it. Or they might be convinced to write it off - which they do occasionally, but only occasionally. The only sure way to avoid paying debt accrued through emergency medical services is to have no assets.

MAGZine 11y ago

So the millions of students with massive amounts of student debt or people losing their homes due to injury or disease don't need help? Anyhow, the point about rich and poor living side by side happens anywhere where there is gentrification. Some communities, too. I promise you that in some islands in greece there are beggars living side by side to people loading 50" plasmas onto donkeys

fapjacks 11y ago

> We have welfare and a multitude of social programs design to assist those who need help. We absolutely do not, and it is disingenuous to claim otherwise. Europe has vastly less wealth disparity, and many more social welfare programs that ensure a pretty high degree of social mobility. The United States doesn't hold a candle to most of Europe in this regard. And you know something infuriating? My tax rate is only 10% less where I live in the States than what it will be when I move to Sweden. Our taxes are high as hell and we get basically nothing for them. A nice weapons development program, and there's something to be said for that, and then the Social Security ponzi scheme. But nothing else. Sweden has a huge number of beneficial programs that actually help people when they need it. And your one citation is from the Heritage Foundation.

pc86 11y ago
> Europe has vastly less wealth disparity How does the income disparity between Flint and San Francisco compare to the income disparity between Luxembourg and Bulgaria? Between Germany and Romania? > My tax rate is only 10% less where I live in the States than what it will be when I move to Sweden. No. The Swedish deduction is $2,690 - in the US it's between $6,300 and $12,600. Not to mention that our federal tax rates top out at about 2/3 of the maximum Swedish tax rate (sub-40% compared to 59.7%). Highest state sales tax is under 12% while Swedish VAT is up to 25%. Not to mention capital gains in Sweden is twice what it is in the US unless you make nearly half a million a year, in which case it's only 10 points higher (30% v. 15%/20%) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_rates https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_rates > And your one citation is from the Heritage Foundation. I would say the source has little relevance if what it's saying is accurate (which it is).
- fapjacks 11y ago
  So, for what it's worth, you're using some pretty useless numbers without context. And they are giving you a pretty distorted picture of the reality (much like the Heritage Foundation). You're looking at some numbers on Wikipedia. I am talking about my experience earning income and paying taxes in both countries. I'm telling you, my taxes right this minute are only about 10% less than my taxes in Sweden. This is the reality. If that makes you mad, make sure you're getting mad at the right people.