5 ms·

I remember seeing a commercial for those things where they drafted the Top Chef brothers, and even in the commercial it looked extremely awkward to use. "Oh, l

I remember seeing a commercial for those things where they drafted the Top Chef brothers, and even in the commercial it looked extremely awkward to use. "Oh, let's just look up something...(walk over...bend down...glance at screen...slowly punch things in...)." Even if it were the best thing ever, I know technology and I know that fridges last years longer than any gadget ever has. Any choice of touchscreen, OS or even network connection technology would probably be a "bad idea" in 5-10 years.

humanrebar 11y ago
Agreed. So far, the best feature is a convenient dock for a tablet or phone. Same goes for cars.
- mdip 11y ago
  Also agreed - I found the best solution for me was a cheap Amazon Fire tablet and three large strips of velcro. It stays firmly attached to the side of the fridge with the cable running straight down beneath the cupboard routed over to the plug. It looks a lot better than expected and handles calendar/metric<->imperial conversions with ease.
JustSomeNobody 11y ago
> ... would probably be a "bad idea" in 5-10 years. This is what I don't think people quite understand. Same with (Android|Apple)Auto that's coming out. By the time you've paid it off, who is going to buy it?! You'll HAVE to trade it in at the dealership. That limits you in so many ways.
- ethbro 11y ago
  I thought that was the whole point of going with Android|Apple Auto vs the manufacturer's homebrew: at least you'd get updates for a few years.
  - JustSomeNobody 11y ago
    Good point, but I just don't see it ending well either way.
    - eclipxe 11y ago
      Why?
- eclipxe 11y ago
  Android Auto and CarPlay don't completely replace the head-unit functionality. Most units have standard functions built in, with the additional option of Android Auto/CarPlay features. In fact, the Android Auto/Carplay functionality is largely driven by the software on the phone, the headunit really just acts a dumb terminal when entering that mode. If anything, this is a WAY more future proof design than the current in-car entertainment and navigation functions which rarely see updates. It is likely that Android/Apple will be around in a few years with regular updates you can take advantage of in your car, vs a navigation system that will never see a change, even a security update. If the fridge for example, used "Android Fridge" or "Apple Chillplay" it is likely this problem wouldn't exist. An OTA on the phone which pushes the calendar to the fridge would solve this. This is how Android Auto and Apple Carplay work.
  - Shank 11y ago
    Both systems require somewhat dedicated connections to the phone. Android Auto uses remote display and doesn't really want you to interact with the device while running, for instance. For a fridge, a Chromecast style box that gets direct OTAs from Google would probably work best.
- robalfonso 11y ago
  I long for a world where my byo device (ipad,nexus tablet,whatever) can be slid into a cradle. We all agree that technology is bad when paired with long tail devices (tv's, fridges, even watches) So why not allow a universal cradle that fits the device dejour. After that an app and the appropriate hardware could be exposed via the cradle to cover all this and when the tablet is old hat, get a new one. Its not perfect but it is far better than the options we are getting now.
- rconti 11y ago
  My car has CarPlay/Android Auto/Mirrorlink. First of all, it's in addition to the built-in systems which have AM, FM, SD card reader, HD radio, Sirius XM, navigation, Sirius NavTraffic, local gas prices, sports scores. Secondly, why would nobody buy older tech? Third, if the car was worthless because of outdated tech, why would a dealership buy it? Fourth, even in this day and age, people still upgrade/replace the factory electronics.
Splines 11y ago
Anybody who has ever had a TV/VCR combo knows to avoid multi-function appliances.
- robodale 11y ago
  I have a 13 inch color TV with VCR combo for sale. The VCR can no longer play VCR tapes - only rewind. Great for rewinding tapes before you return them to the rental store! Msg me for details.
- ars 11y ago
  I have one of those, works OK, but it has a Y2K bug that makes it hard to program to record shows. I don't use it very often though.
qb45 11y ago
Forget 5-10 years, the choice of ARM SoC will be a bad idea in 3 years. You know this Moore Law thing, about software getting twice slower every two years to compensate for increasing transistor density... except that already deployed hardware doesn't grow these extra transistors in the meantime.
- snerbles 11y ago
  That already deployed hardware is now slow with the latest shiny firmware...time to buy more hardware like a good little consumer.
Shivetya 11y ago
appliances and the like should have no more hardware that go gather and display information which is sent and received from one central point in the home. you should be able to ask about anything you want from anywhere and get the information you want where you are. home, do I have milk? home, turn off the stove or whatever control word is used to indicate you want to talk to your system.
jaynos 11y ago
Same reason why GPS feature in a car is useless. I'm using google maps on my phone anyway due to the better interface and constant updates.
- sithadmin 11y ago
  Though I generally use Waze for plotting a course to an unfamiliar destination, I still heavily use my car's GPS nav system. Rather than relying on it for guidance, I use it as a reference for routing around small inconveniences (road work/construction, accidents, etc.) on familiar routes. I've found it quite useful in this regard, and the large screen size definitely comes in handy for at-a-glance usage.
  - stenius 11y ago
    What kind of navunit do you have? I wouldn't count on mine for anything helpful and it requires a sat radio subscription to get traffic updates.
    - sithadmin 11y ago
      Ford Sync. Whatever generation they were selling in 2013. I don't really rely on it for traffic information or anything, just maps. If I'm driving on local 'main' roads and visually pick up on indicators that there's something inconvenient ahead, I'll use the nav unit to identify appropriate sidestreets to take instead.
- jonknee 11y ago
  I do appreciate my car GPS for when I'm outside of cell range though (which is frequently--mountains and radios don't work well together).
  - ethanbond 11y ago
    A mistake I'll make only once: driving to Montreal only to realize my phone was useless once I got to the city limits and needed to figure out how to get to my hotel.
drzaiusapelord 11y ago
This is why I love my Chromecast so much. In the past I had a bulky media PC or a game console. I'd dig around for remotes, turn on the box, make sure everything was charged, etc. Now I just fire up whatever I want to watch on my phone, press cast, and off I go. I think centralizing smartdevices on your phone makes a lot of sense. I don't need yet another remote or config to worry about. If IoT happens correctly, it'll be mostly headless. The head end will be your phone or smartwatch. As a side note, the Amazon reviews for this thing are pretty terrible in regards to loud buzzing, ice maker issues, etc. We bought a new place three years ago and I was really tempted by the shiny Samsung fridges (LED lighting, little smart display, etc), but ended up going with a more conservative and pricier GE which has been rock-solid. Feels like I dodged a bullet here.
toast0 11y ago
> Any choice of touchscreen, OS or even network connection technology would probably be a "bad idea" in 5-10 years. Ethernet via RJ45 has really good staying power; IEEE standard in 1990. A refrigerator at 10Mbps is probably sufficient, but if not, 10GBase-T is approaching affordability, and a standard for 40GBase-T is expected next year, although you may need to pull new wires.
- simoncion 11y ago
  802.11a/b (1999) are looking pretty good, too. Everything I've ever seen with a 2GHz radio supports b, [0] and with a 5GHz radio supports a. [0] Even though some AP admins deactivate 802.11b support for entirely valid throughput raisins. AIUI, 802.11a doesn't suffer from those issues.
  - jdcarter 11y ago
    Problem with 802.11 isn't the radio layer, it's the security. Early 802.11 didn't do security right at all, then we had WEP and that got broken, then WPA, then WPA2... Example: I created wifi drivers for a handheld platform back in the 90's (Magic Cap), including support for the earliest 802.11 PC cards. Fans of the platform (both of them) encouraged me to update the drivers so they could continue using their handhelds over wireless, but it's simply not possible to get a 1999 wifi card on a modern wifi network in any half-secure fashion.
    - simoncion 11y ago
      > Problem with 802.11 isn't the radio layer, it's the security. True. It's a damn shame about WEP, and WPA2 didn't happen until 2004. But, 2004 is eleven years ago. Disgregarding the shitfest that is WPS-PIN, WPA2 with CCMP is looking rather good. Are you aware of breaks in WPA2 with CCMP-only crypto and either a well-chosen passphrase, or WPA2-Enterprise with a proper client authorization scheme? > ...it's simply not possible to get a 1999 wifi card on a modern wifi network in any half-secure fashion. Not saying that there are any WiFi cards that behave in this manner, [0] but would a hypothetical WiFi card that only knows how to how to establish and pass around -er- frames(?) on a 802.11a/g link and relies on the client PC to use the frames passed back and forth to do link crypto & etc be * Possible * Reasonably sufficiently fast, given enough CPU power on the client * Able to cope with any likely enhancements (such as the addition of WPA2 back in 2004) with a driver update, rather than a firmware update ? [0] Even though I thought that pre 802.11ac Atheros cards had open firmware and open drivers, so one got pretty close to this.
eclipxe 11y ago
Top Chef brothers? Or do you mean HGTV brothers?
- vonmoltke 11y ago
  The commercial featured the Voltaggio brothers, who were both on the 6th season of "Top Chef".
thedudemabry 11y ago
I was recently in the market for a newer SUV and the thing that struck me about every single touchscreen jammed into them was how obsolete they would seem in the near future. Even now, they're clunky and unappealing visually. My microwave has a MyPlate.gov button on it. May have seemed like a good idea when our home's previous owner renovated back in 2011, but it's silly now. My "smart" TV has an app called WebVideos on it, which does nothing but apologize for being shut down. This trend of timely design rather than timeless design in appliances is not great for the consumer. It reminds me of bundling crapware OS-extensions onto budget PC laptops. Design that respects the orthogonal-nature of connectedness to a device's primary purpose should be praised. One counterexample that comes to mind is my Nest thermometer. It's super convenient, works great. And if Nest ever goes under and turns out the lights on their API, or if wifi becomes an irrelevant network connection technology, it reverts to being a thermostat with a really nice UI.
- coldpie 11y ago
  Last winter I walked into a Subaru dealership, ready to plunk down for a brand new Impreza. I live in Minnesota. I wanted AWD and I know how hard it is to find used Subarus, especially when you insist on a stick shift. So I figured I'd just give in and buy new. They didn't have any of the 2015 models at the time, so we test drove a 2014 model. Except for the inadequate number of pedals, it seemed fine. I was ready to place an order. Then the dealer, who was riding with us, said "and the new 2015s will all have the new infotainment stuff!" "Oh," I said, knowing he meant a shitty touch screen. "Can you show me?" We get back to the dealership and he walks me over to some other, larger model with the new infotainment system. He sits down, turns the key, and what do I see on the infotainment system? A loading bar. I walked out and bought a 2011 Mazda3.
  - FraaJad 11y ago
    buying a mazda for not liking the infotainment when living in MN is like cutting off your nose to spite your face.. or something.. You could have bought an older version of Subie ...
    - 11y ago
xrstf 11y ago
> fridges last years longer than any gadget You are clearly holding^W using it wrong. You are supposed to buy new fridges way more often, duh...</sarcasm>

humanrebar 11y ago

Agreed. So far, the best feature is a convenient dock for a tablet or phone. Same goes for cars.

mdip 11y ago
Also agreed - I found the best solution for me was a cheap Amazon Fire tablet and three large strips of velcro. It stays firmly attached to the side of the fridge with the cable running straight down beneath the cupboard routed over to the plug. It looks a lot better than expected and handles calendar/metric<->imperial conversions with ease.

JustSomeNobody 11y ago

> ... would probably be a "bad idea" in 5-10 years. This is what I don't think people quite understand. Same with (Android|Apple)Auto that's coming out. By the time you've paid it off, who is going to buy it?! You'll HAVE to trade it in at the dealership. That limits you in so many ways.

ethbro 11y ago
I thought that was the whole point of going with Android|Apple Auto vs the manufacturer's homebrew: at least you'd get updates for a few years.
- JustSomeNobody 11y ago
  Good point, but I just don't see it ending well either way.
  - eclipxe 11y ago
    Why?
eclipxe 11y ago
Android Auto and CarPlay don't completely replace the head-unit functionality. Most units have standard functions built in, with the additional option of Android Auto/CarPlay features. In fact, the Android Auto/Carplay functionality is largely driven by the software on the phone, the headunit really just acts a dumb terminal when entering that mode. If anything, this is a WAY more future proof design than the current in-car entertainment and navigation functions which rarely see updates. It is likely that Android/Apple will be around in a few years with regular updates you can take advantage of in your car, vs a navigation system that will never see a change, even a security update. If the fridge for example, used "Android Fridge" or "Apple Chillplay" it is likely this problem wouldn't exist. An OTA on the phone which pushes the calendar to the fridge would solve this. This is how Android Auto and Apple Carplay work.
- Shank 11y ago
  Both systems require somewhat dedicated connections to the phone. Android Auto uses remote display and doesn't really want you to interact with the device while running, for instance. For a fridge, a Chromecast style box that gets direct OTAs from Google would probably work best.
robalfonso 11y ago
I long for a world where my byo device (ipad,nexus tablet,whatever) can be slid into a cradle. We all agree that technology is bad when paired with long tail devices (tv's, fridges, even watches) So why not allow a universal cradle that fits the device dejour. After that an app and the appropriate hardware could be exposed via the cradle to cover all this and when the tablet is old hat, get a new one. Its not perfect but it is far better than the options we are getting now.
rconti 11y ago
My car has CarPlay/Android Auto/Mirrorlink. First of all, it's in addition to the built-in systems which have AM, FM, SD card reader, HD radio, Sirius XM, navigation, Sirius NavTraffic, local gas prices, sports scores. Secondly, why would nobody buy older tech? Third, if the car was worthless because of outdated tech, why would a dealership buy it? Fourth, even in this day and age, people still upgrade/replace the factory electronics.

Splines 11y ago

Anybody who has ever had a TV/VCR combo knows to avoid multi-function appliances.

robodale 11y ago
I have a 13 inch color TV with VCR combo for sale. The VCR can no longer play VCR tapes - only rewind. Great for rewinding tapes before you return them to the rental store! Msg me for details.
ars 11y ago
I have one of those, works OK, but it has a Y2K bug that makes it hard to program to record shows. I don't use it very often though.

qb45 11y ago

Forget 5-10 years, the choice of ARM SoC will be a bad idea in 3 years. You know this Moore Law thing, about software getting twice slower every two years to compensate for increasing transistor density... except that already deployed hardware doesn't grow these extra transistors in the meantime.

snerbles 11y ago
That already deployed hardware is now slow with the latest shiny firmware...time to buy more hardware like a good little consumer.

Shivetya 11y ago

appliances and the like should have no more hardware that go gather and display information which is sent and received from one central point in the home. you should be able to ask about anything you want from anywhere and get the information you want where you are. home, do I have milk? home, turn off the stove or whatever control word is used to indicate you want to talk to your system.

jaynos 11y ago

Same reason why GPS feature in a car is useless. I'm using google maps on my phone anyway due to the better interface and constant updates.

sithadmin 11y ago
Though I generally use Waze for plotting a course to an unfamiliar destination, I still heavily use my car's GPS nav system. Rather than relying on it for guidance, I use it as a reference for routing around small inconveniences (road work/construction, accidents, etc.) on familiar routes. I've found it quite useful in this regard, and the large screen size definitely comes in handy for at-a-glance usage.
- stenius 11y ago
  What kind of navunit do you have? I wouldn't count on mine for anything helpful and it requires a sat radio subscription to get traffic updates.
  - sithadmin 11y ago
    Ford Sync. Whatever generation they were selling in 2013. I don't really rely on it for traffic information or anything, just maps. If I'm driving on local 'main' roads and visually pick up on indicators that there's something inconvenient ahead, I'll use the nav unit to identify appropriate sidestreets to take instead.
jonknee 11y ago
I do appreciate my car GPS for when I'm outside of cell range though (which is frequently--mountains and radios don't work well together).
- ethanbond 11y ago
  A mistake I'll make only once: driving to Montreal only to realize my phone was useless once I got to the city limits and needed to figure out how to get to my hotel.

drzaiusapelord 11y ago

This is why I love my Chromecast so much. In the past I had a bulky media PC or a game console. I'd dig around for remotes, turn on the box, make sure everything was charged, etc. Now I just fire up whatever I want to watch on my phone, press cast, and off I go. I think centralizing smartdevices on your phone makes a lot of sense. I don't need yet another remote or config to worry about. If IoT happens correctly, it'll be mostly headless. The head end will be your phone or smartwatch. As a side note, the Amazon reviews for this thing are pretty terrible in regards to loud buzzing, ice maker issues, etc. We bought a new place three years ago and I was really tempted by the shiny Samsung fridges (LED lighting, little smart display, etc), but ended up going with a more conservative and pricier GE which has been rock-solid. Feels like I dodged a bullet here.

toast0 11y ago

> Any choice of touchscreen, OS or even network connection technology would probably be a "bad idea" in 5-10 years. Ethernet via RJ45 has really good staying power; IEEE standard in 1990. A refrigerator at 10Mbps is probably sufficient, but if not, 10GBase-T is approaching affordability, and a standard for 40GBase-T is expected next year, although you may need to pull new wires.

simoncion 11y ago
802.11a/b (1999) are looking pretty good, too. Everything I've ever seen with a 2GHz radio supports b, [0] and with a 5GHz radio supports a. [0] Even though some AP admins deactivate 802.11b support for entirely valid throughput raisins. AIUI, 802.11a doesn't suffer from those issues.
- jdcarter 11y ago
  Problem with 802.11 isn't the radio layer, it's the security. Early 802.11 didn't do security right at all, then we had WEP and that got broken, then WPA, then WPA2... Example: I created wifi drivers for a handheld platform back in the 90's (Magic Cap), including support for the earliest 802.11 PC cards. Fans of the platform (both of them) encouraged me to update the drivers so they could continue using their handhelds over wireless, but it's simply not possible to get a 1999 wifi card on a modern wifi network in any half-secure fashion.
  - simoncion 11y ago
    > Problem with 802.11 isn't the radio layer, it's the security. True. It's a damn shame about WEP, and WPA2 didn't happen until 2004. But, 2004 is eleven years ago. Disgregarding the shitfest that is WPS-PIN, WPA2 with CCMP is looking rather good. Are you aware of breaks in WPA2 with CCMP-only crypto and either a well-chosen passphrase, or WPA2-Enterprise with a proper client authorization scheme? > ...it's simply not possible to get a 1999 wifi card on a modern wifi network in any half-secure fashion. Not saying that there are any WiFi cards that behave in this manner, [0] but would a hypothetical WiFi card that only knows how to how to establish and pass around -er- frames(?) on a 802.11a/g link and relies on the client PC to use the frames passed back and forth to do link crypto & etc be * Possible * Reasonably sufficiently fast, given enough CPU power on the client * Able to cope with any likely enhancements (such as the addition of WPA2 back in 2004) with a driver update, rather than a firmware update ? [0] Even though I thought that pre 802.11ac Atheros cards had open firmware and open drivers, so one got pretty close to this.

eclipxe 11y ago

Top Chef brothers? Or do you mean HGTV brothers?

vonmoltke 11y ago
The commercial featured the Voltaggio brothers, who were both on the 6th season of "Top Chef".

thedudemabry 11y ago

I was recently in the market for a newer SUV and the thing that struck me about every single touchscreen jammed into them was how obsolete they would seem in the near future. Even now, they're clunky and unappealing visually. My microwave has a MyPlate.gov button on it. May have seemed like a good idea when our home's previous owner renovated back in 2011, but it's silly now. My "smart" TV has an app called WebVideos on it, which does nothing but apologize for being shut down. This trend of timely design rather than timeless design in appliances is not great for the consumer. It reminds me of bundling crapware OS-extensions onto budget PC laptops. Design that respects the orthogonal-nature of connectedness to a device's primary purpose should be praised. One counterexample that comes to mind is my Nest thermometer. It's super convenient, works great. And if Nest ever goes under and turns out the lights on their API, or if wifi becomes an irrelevant network connection technology, it reverts to being a thermostat with a really nice UI.

coldpie 11y ago
Last winter I walked into a Subaru dealership, ready to plunk down for a brand new Impreza. I live in Minnesota. I wanted AWD and I know how hard it is to find used Subarus, especially when you insist on a stick shift. So I figured I'd just give in and buy new. They didn't have any of the 2015 models at the time, so we test drove a 2014 model. Except for the inadequate number of pedals, it seemed fine. I was ready to place an order. Then the dealer, who was riding with us, said "and the new 2015s will all have the new infotainment stuff!" "Oh," I said, knowing he meant a shitty touch screen. "Can you show me?" We get back to the dealership and he walks me over to some other, larger model with the new infotainment system. He sits down, turns the key, and what do I see on the infotainment system? A loading bar. I walked out and bought a 2011 Mazda3.
- FraaJad 11y ago
  buying a mazda for not liking the infotainment when living in MN is like cutting off your nose to spite your face.. or something.. You could have bought an older version of Subie ...
  - 11y ago

xrstf 11y ago

> fridges last years longer than any gadget You are clearly holding^W using it wrong. You are supposed to buy new fridges way more often, duh...</sarcasm>