3 ms·

If we are discrediting nation by a single incident, are you sure about the Japanese? The 2009–11 Toyota vehicle recalls didn't really help to keep the trust, di

by patates 11y ago

If we are discrediting nation by a single incident, are you sure about the Japanese? The 2009–11 Toyota vehicle recalls didn't really help to keep the trust, did they? In anyway, this kind of thinking is really harmful to the global economy and welfare. Please evaluate the companies on their own.

a3n 11y ago
Well, it's a personal decision to be sure. The difference between the Toyota issues and the Volkswagon issues is that Toyota did not (as far as we know) engineer a part of their car to do something that they asserted it did not do, and didn't cheat on testing. They likely foot-dragged the investigation. Volkswagon did exactly that, with malice aforethought. It was on purpose, by design. Volkswagon owns other brands. Not all, but others. I have read that the German auto industry as a whole has has been successfully heavy handed in influencing emission standards in Europe. EDIT: And this refusal to buy is the only leverage I have in influencing corporate conduct. At the least, it's a personal decision not to award actual or suspected behavior. The German auto industry as a whole has been tainted, and this may be their chance to clean up their act and really be what they say they are. Rather than merely any set of corporations that happens to make cars instead of breakfast cereal. Fuck 'em.
- tremon 11y ago
  Why exactly is the German auto-industry as a whole been tainted? I can understand avoiding the entire Volkswagen group (including non-German Seat, Skoda, Bugatti, Bentley, Ducati), but I don't see why this situation should give you a similar distrust for Mercedes or BMW. Similarly, Chrysler was German-owned (through Daimler) between 1998 and 2007. Are Chrysler, Jeep and Dodge models from those years now tainted as well? What about the years after 2007?
  - a3n 11y ago
    Again, personal choice, there are an infinite number of choices on how to spend my time and money. I also don't watch Tom Cruise movies, because Scientology. As for the German car industry as a whole, as I said, I've read that the industry has been successful at influencing emission standard and limiting testing. Volkswagon is part of that group, and everyone else in the group is part of that group. I'm pretty sure Germany is not overly concerned about me. But they may be concerned about Volkswagon's 24% drop in sales in America in November, and as I speculated above, that may get enough of the industry's attention that they may feel compelled to execute in a way that shows without ambiguity that they are far and away the most honest companies in the world. I'd buy cars from that group. Meantime, there's Japan, America, Britain, Sweden, France, Italy, and probably some that I haven't mentioned. You have to choose, so choose according to what you want to reward or change.
    - tremon 11y ago
      Fair choice. As for me, I don't go out to watch movies at all, because Hollywood. But then I would guess your aversion against the car industry to be more general, and that the recent revelations about emissions cheating have done little to sway your opinion. You're basically using the actions of a single actor to reinforce your biases against an entire group. I do hope you are aware enough not to use that same line of reasoning against racial, ethnic or religious groups though.

by patates 11y ago

a3n 11y ago

Well, it's a personal decision to be sure. The difference between the Toyota issues and the Volkswagon issues is that Toyota did not (as far as we know) engineer a part of their car to do something that they asserted it did not do, and didn't cheat on testing. They likely foot-dragged the investigation. Volkswagon did exactly that, with malice aforethought. It was on purpose, by design. Volkswagon owns other brands. Not all, but others. I have read that the German auto industry as a whole has has been successfully heavy handed in influencing emission standards in Europe. EDIT: And this refusal to buy is the only leverage I have in influencing corporate conduct. At the least, it's a personal decision not to award actual or suspected behavior. The German auto industry as a whole has been tainted, and this may be their chance to clean up their act and really be what they say they are. Rather than merely any set of corporations that happens to make cars instead of breakfast cereal. Fuck 'em.

tremon 11y ago
Why exactly is the German auto-industry as a whole been tainted? I can understand avoiding the entire Volkswagen group (including non-German Seat, Skoda, Bugatti, Bentley, Ducati), but I don't see why this situation should give you a similar distrust for Mercedes or BMW. Similarly, Chrysler was German-owned (through Daimler) between 1998 and 2007. Are Chrysler, Jeep and Dodge models from those years now tainted as well? What about the years after 2007?
- a3n 11y ago
  Again, personal choice, there are an infinite number of choices on how to spend my time and money. I also don't watch Tom Cruise movies, because Scientology. As for the German car industry as a whole, as I said, I've read that the industry has been successful at influencing emission standard and limiting testing. Volkswagon is part of that group, and everyone else in the group is part of that group. I'm pretty sure Germany is not overly concerned about me. But they may be concerned about Volkswagon's 24% drop in sales in America in November, and as I speculated above, that may get enough of the industry's attention that they may feel compelled to execute in a way that shows without ambiguity that they are far and away the most honest companies in the world. I'd buy cars from that group. Meantime, there's Japan, America, Britain, Sweden, France, Italy, and probably some that I haven't mentioned. You have to choose, so choose according to what you want to reward or change.
  - tremon 11y ago
    Fair choice. As for me, I don't go out to watch movies at all, because Hollywood. But then I would guess your aversion against the car industry to be more general, and that the recent revelations about emissions cheating have done little to sway your opinion. You're basically using the actions of a single actor to reinforce your biases against an entire group. I do hope you are aware enough not to use that same line of reasoning against racial, ethnic or religious groups though.