4 ms·

I had bad RSI, then took a couple weeks, and switched to Dvorak (it took a bit longer to get proficient in Vim again though). Anyhow, RSI problems were gone, a

by dylanz 17y ago

I had bad RSI, then took a couple weeks, and switched to Dvorak (it took a bit longer to get proficient in Vim again though). Anyhow, RSI problems were gone, and never returned. So, regardless of any debunking myths, it prevented my pain from ever coming back again.

gnosis 17y ago
Or maybe the pain went away for some reason unrelated to Dvorak, and would have gone away on its own even if you hadn't switched.
- nostrademons 17y ago
  It seems unlikely given how many people report that same benefit. On this thread alone, there are 4 people that report it's much easier on the wrists (to which I'll add myself - I'm a Dvorak user and found it physically much easier to type on than Qwerty) and 1 person that reports it's worse.
  - jauco 17y ago
    Ouch, I don't know the english word for it, but you're making a severe error by assuming that pro's and cons are as likely to report here. If you really want to know whether it's coincidental or not you'd have to phone people chosen at random from the total population (just humans, just americans or just american programmers for example)
    - nostrademons 17y ago
      "Selection bias" is the term you're looking for. ;-) And yes, I know I'm making it, and choosing to make it anyway. Mostly because it squares with my own experience (there's a term for that too: "anecdotal evidence"), and because we don't have any evidence the other way.
      - mnemonicsloth 17y ago
        it squares with my own experience The placebo effect can make cancer go away for a while. Vanishing RSI is trivial. You're especially at risk because you've already sunk time and effort into retraining yourself, and have made a conscious decision to separate yourself from everybody else. That's Big Magic, psychosomatically speaking. None of this means you have to go back to QWERTY (or for that matter, that QWERTY is any less broken). But if Dvorak's research really was shoddy and self-serving, and you want to take care of the hands you presumably use to earn a living, wouldn't it be a good idea at this point to look into other keyboard layouts with better-documented benefits? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escalation_of_commitment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escalation_of_commitment http://www.paulgraham.com/identity.html http://www.paulgraham.com/identity.html
        richardw 17y ago
        I'd really like to find some research on people that were proficient with Dvorak first and then were asked to learn QWERTY. I suspect the take-up (even for those desperately wanting to be different) would be lower! There's quite a cost to re-learning how to type, so let's not discount that some people still think it's worth it. Personally, I did it because a couple of my mates were still happy with it after a year and it started making sense on day 1, before any Big Magic kicked in :)

by dylanz 17y ago

gnosis 17y ago

Or maybe the pain went away for some reason unrelated to Dvorak, and would have gone away on its own even if you hadn't switched.

nostrademons 17y ago
It seems unlikely given how many people report that same benefit. On this thread alone, there are 4 people that report it's much easier on the wrists (to which I'll add myself - I'm a Dvorak user and found it physically much easier to type on than Qwerty) and 1 person that reports it's worse.
- jauco 17y ago
  Ouch, I don't know the english word for it, but you're making a severe error by assuming that pro's and cons are as likely to report here. If you really want to know whether it's coincidental or not you'd have to phone people chosen at random from the total population (just humans, just americans or just american programmers for example)
  - nostrademons 17y ago
    "Selection bias" is the term you're looking for. ;-) And yes, I know I'm making it, and choosing to make it anyway. Mostly because it squares with my own experience (there's a term for that too: "anecdotal evidence"), and because we don't have any evidence the other way.
    - mnemonicsloth 17y ago
      it squares with my own experience The placebo effect can make cancer go away for a while. Vanishing RSI is trivial. You're especially at risk because you've already sunk time and effort into retraining yourself, and have made a conscious decision to separate yourself from everybody else. That's Big Magic, psychosomatically speaking. None of this means you have to go back to QWERTY (or for that matter, that QWERTY is any less broken). But if Dvorak's research really was shoddy and self-serving, and you want to take care of the hands you presumably use to earn a living, wouldn't it be a good idea at this point to look into other keyboard layouts with better-documented benefits? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escalation_of_commitment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escalation_of_commitment http://www.paulgraham.com/identity.html http://www.paulgraham.com/identity.html
      - richardw 17y ago
        I'd really like to find some research on people that were proficient with Dvorak first and then were asked to learn QWERTY. I suspect the take-up (even for those desperately wanting to be different) would be lower! There's quite a cost to re-learning how to type, so let's not discount that some people still think it's worth it. Personally, I did it because a couple of my mates were still happy with it after a year and it started making sense on day 1, before any Big Magic kicked in :)