14 ms·

Social media encourages us to follow those we envy

179 points by nomadictribe 11y ago

markatkinson 11y ago
I deleted (deleted, not deactivated) my Facebook profile 4 years ago. It had clearly become an addiction, kinda like my mobile phone is now (cost/benefit balance of mobile phone is still too good to throw away). I remember actually having withdrawals in the first few weeks. Not sure if it was withdrawals or muscle memory that kept kicking in to check my feed, but there was an element of angst not being connected to the feed. Now I am quite happy without it (almost liberated), and trying to spend that time I would have spent on Facebook doing something that adds value to my life like reading HN! Surprisingly my circle (more of a triangle) of friends still exists, even without Facebook.
- SmellyGeekBoy 11y ago
  Ex-heavy Facebook user here (multiple times per hour) - I stopped checking it altogether and uninstalled the app about 3 weeks ago, just to see how I would get on. I know exactly the feelings you're talking about. After a week cold turkey I'm now back to checking much more infrequently (a couple of times a day) but it takes a huge amount of willpower to use it passively and not like / comment / post anything. I'd delete my account altogether but I find the Messenger really useful and I manage a few pages / events on there, not to mention wanting to keep up with some distant family. It's amazing how they've managed to create this feeling of dependence. What's also amazing is just how much more productive I've been over the past few weeks without the constant (self-inflicted) interruptions!
  - markatkinson 11y ago
    Yea totally. I suppose a lot of people are actually using Facebook for work and their businesses (and Tinder) and so can't really get rid of their account. Also, I feel quite smug when someone asks to add me and I can say I don't use it... Maybe that is douchy...
    - SmellyGeekBoy 11y ago
      Haha, the smugness seems pretty common around here. Each to their own I say. Still, I do secretly envy the ones like yourself who have managed to escape!
  - benten10 11y ago
    I realize for an outsider it may feel like a support group or a bunch of complainers ranting, but I'd like to add here: Me Too! I left facebook late in 2011, for various reasons, but mostly because it was making me sad and depressed. I was an extremely heavy user before that. I can say for sure that leaving facebook has made me objectively happier and less sadder. I remember that XKCD comic about social network effects. Our minds are 'trained' to 'compare' ourselves with 10-15 of our friends, and assert that we lie around the 'average'. When we look at facebook, where everyone puts on their best (and in the hundreds) our brains 'think' we're doing a lot worse than the average, and we feel bad about ourselves. I've heard a lot of people talk about not comparing to people on facebook, but... you really can't help it. Full Disclosure: I opened a different facebook account. JUST for family, because my mom didn't _believe_ that I didn't have a facebook. I open it maybe once in a couple of weeks, and have gone for many months without logging in. Here's something I'd tell to other people: if you feel depressed after using facebook, delete it. Forget about 'not keeping in touch', 'being a loner', etcetera. Your mental health is way, way, wayyy more important than knowing what your freaking high school acquaintance's third child had for lunch on a random day. Have a small group of close friends, and call them, hang out with them. Your larger group of friends will always be yours. If you need social networking, get snapchat (I'm a critic turned fanboy). It's fleeting, so you don't feel as bad about yourself, and people are not as annoying. Addendum: Here's how people make non-FB friends. A friend of a friend wanted help with grad schools, so I agreed to talk to her. We chatted on Skype (second encounter, EVER), and we ended up talking for an hour. She wanted someone to talk to and asked if we could talk again soon, and I didn't mind one more friend so we're skyping again soon. You make friends out of nowhere; don't need facebook for that. Facebook gives you the illusion you're 'in-touch' with everyone, when all you're doing is gathering 'intelligence' on their lives.
    - SmellyGeekBoy 11y ago
      > I remember that XKCD comic about social network effects. Our minds are 'trained' to 'compare' ourselves with 10-15 of our friends, and assert that we lie around the 'average'. When we look at facebook, where everyone puts on their best (and in the hundreds) our brains 'think' we're doing a lot worse than the average, and we feel bad about ourselves. I've heard a lot of people talk about not comparing to people on facebook, but... you really can't help it. I'm quite fortunate to have been quite successful in life, especially recently, so it's not this aspect that creates problems for me. It's the constant sharing of political / religious opinions and ensuing bickering (especially among my family) that gets me down. I've actually seen a few family relationships completely break down as a result of arguments over petty things on Facebook, with real life consequences. I'd rather not be exposed to any of that anymore and that was my reason for massively reducing my involvement in it.
  - gnrme 11y ago
    It's the fear of missing out. All the social media services build their foundation on that addiction. Once you delete the accounts then the feeling slowly goes away and you get back to what life was like before all this nonsense started.
    - gherkin0 11y ago
      > It's the fear of missing out. All the social media services build their foundation on that addiction. Once you delete the accounts then the feeling slowly goes away and you get back to what life was like before all this nonsense started. And Facebook explicitly tries to prevent you from getting rid of that addiction. They have a "feature" that kicks in after a few days of non-use to incessantly remind you via email that you're missing out. So-and-so posted a picture, etc. As far as I can tell, there's no way to disable them without also disabling emails for event invites and direct messages, which is just shitty. I've had to setup gmail filters to get rid of them.
    - loceng 11y ago
      A caveat - if you have the skills and enough people in your life to actually facilitate a healthy lifestyle.
    - ArkyBeagle 11y ago
      I fear not missing out. If I need to hear about it, I will. I mainly use Facebook as a thing to waste time with while I'm waiting for it to be time to do something else.
  - eswat 11y ago
    FYI you can use the Messenger app without having a Facebook account (at least before attaching Messenger to a Facebook account, not sure what would happen if you’ve already done so).
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
  - markatkinson 11y ago
    Exactly, and I find not being invited to social events gives me a lot of time to do other things...
    - Jtsummers 11y ago
      You can always say no to an invitation.
- lsniddy 11y ago
  This is was any addiction feels like. Your brain aggressively telling you to do something and rewarding you when you do. I've been addicted to other things, but never got that dopamine rush from facebook. From the looks of it though facebook appears to me more addictive, or at least more available than your average addictive substance.
  - fucking_tragedy 11y ago
    Psychological addictions are insidious.
- moron4hire 11y ago
  I was fine with deactivation only. The way I saw it, I didn't much care to change the fact that my past was on Facebook. I just wanted to make sure my future wasn't. There is a certain bit of psychological hacking going on calling connections "friends". Facebook has allowed a lot of people to reconnect and stay in contact, but maybe that isn't a good thing. Maybe we're supposed to only have transient interaction with most people. Maybe not knowing more about our cousins or our friend's friends is a sort of social lubricant. It's easier to be polite to my bigoted grandfather at Thanksgiving if I don't have daily reminders of his racism and homophobia. Perhaps the fact that none of the kids I grew up with are on Twitter is a feature of Twitter. I could maybe get back on Facebook if I treated it like Twitter: I disconnect as soon as your stream turns to anything that even gives me the feeling of wanting to make a negative comment[0]. My twitter feed is full of a mix of on one hand very interesting people, and on the other very quiet people. I like it this way. [0] I'm mostly successful at avoiding making that negative comment, which is kind of scary considering how many negative comments I do end up making.
  - benten10 11y ago
    Excellent points throughout. Strongly agree with all of them. >Maybe not knowing more about our cousins or our friend's friends is a sort of social lubricant. It's easier to be polite to my bigoted grandfather at Thanksgiving if I don't have daily reminders of his racism and homophobia This has actually been how I connect to my friends lately, haha. I ask them what they've been upto, and they mostly go "you know, the same thing on facebook". And then they remember I'm not on facebook, so we go on hours and hours of heart-to-heart bringing up one another up to date with our lives. As the resident twitter fanboy (most of my karma comes from one pro-twitter comment), I couldn't agree with you more. To be fair though, twitter can be sometimes toxic too, but then I just mute the people and they fade from memory. Twitter feels more like the community I _want_ to be a part of, and facebook used to be the kind of community that I didn't particularly like (i.e, the facebooked version of my friends and family). I'll repeat what I say often on HN: the Twitter network/community makes me feel smarter and more excited about things in life. Facebook... never did. It made me want to gain the 'likes' (I wish they'd rename it to something less emotionally attached).
- LesZedCB 11y ago
  Yup I did the same thing is 2012. It has been the best. Except reddit quickly moved in to fill the void. However, at least reddit is anonymous people, and I generally filter on subreddits that have positive communities and generally quality content. I guess you could really implement the same sort of filter with facebook though. I guess I just think the medium for sharing content on reddit or HN is better.
- tushar-r 11y ago
  Same here. Deactivate when on a business trip a few months back and I found myself opening the app first thing when I woke up. Feel so much better about it. Still have muscle memory that makes me open the page once in a while, but it really feels better without it. Of course, now reddit has taken over some of that time, but it is primarily in the sysadmin/tech subreddits, so it is less depressy :-P
- bluedino 11y ago
  I de-activated my profile 4 months ago. It's nice. It was weird at first, but now I can't imagine checking it so many times an hour. I removed the app from my phone because after swiping to unlock, my thumb had a muscle memory to touch the corner of the screen the icon was in. I'd be on Facebook without even thinking about it. I still check sports, news, and other sites on my phone. But it's read-only. ESPN, Instagram, Imgur. I'm not sharing anything. I'm not reading the same types of status updates from 'friends' every couple days (but then again I'm still here on HN). At Thanksgiving I had family members asking why I haven't been on Facebook. Even my own father had asked my aunt "What is he up to?", since he doesn't have an account but she's always telling him about food I posted or places I checked in at.
- xux 11y ago
  For those who find it too difficult to delete your profile, consider just unfollowing random people. Whenever I see an update, I ask myself "would I go to this person's birthday party?" Answer turns out to be "no" 95% of the time. Overtime, my timeline got more and more boring, and sometimes when I log on I would still see updates from days ago. Now I only check it once or twice a week because it's so useless.
  - sharkweek 11y ago
    I use a slightly less stringent policy, "if I saw this person in the grocery store and they hadn't seen me yet, would I go say 'hi' or active avoid them" Deleted anyone who fell into the second bucket - worked out really nicely
    - xux 11y ago
      Yeah that could work too. Though personally I don't like deleting people.
  - tajen 11y ago
    Follow people you don't know, unfollow friends, like things you don't like, change the email address, let it expire (If you don't log in at Yahoo for 1 year, they delete it), change the password, lose it, don't update your phone number. There's always a way back because they're really keen to give you access to your account, but as you progressively get bored of it, you'll feel like you don't need to install it on your new phone. On top of that, they now have to filter our false information. The only problem is to explain to the TSA agent that you've falsified your identity on a US corporation website, but I've given up going to US too ;)...
grobbles 11y ago
Gamification is a demand dropped on users, seemingly forcing self-promotion and social reciprocity in an endless circle. And for what? In the end there is absolutely no gain, but many like and favorite and heart primarily to ensure that people like and favorite and heart whatever they do. We follow to be followed. We comment to be noticed. Because the metrics are front and center. I stopped using Flickr when I couldn't post a simple picture for any random passerby or my own storage without having the embarrassment of a low view count sitting highlighted on the page, the site imploring me to evangelize for me. If you build a site and try to leverage users by forced social metrics to encourage them to become ambassadors and self promoters...well I'd like to pretend it will hurt you, but sadly it won't.
jarmitage 11y ago
In a perfect world we would have the social plumbing without the psychological manipulation. But we're not, so here's how I've found how to make do with Facebook without it poisoning my brain. And yes I do benefit from it a lot, which is why I'm not leaving. This is what my redux version of Facebook looks like, using custom uBlock filters - basically just news feed and notifications. Manages to eliminate ~90% of their manipulation attempts I reckon. http://i.imgur.com/kRTI7Un.png http://i.imgur.com/kRTI7Un.png Other tips: unsubscribe from anything/one whose posts you don't want to see (sounds obvious if you're disciplined about this it makes a lot of difference), stick to messages only but inbox 0 it so you aren't storing useful info there, get event requests sync'd to an external calendar, untick 'remember' when you login. I've found it totally manageable this way, and am cautiously hopeful that one day it wont be necessary once the Silicon Valley psychopaths grow up.
- legulere 11y ago
  Also don't use the like button for anything except stuff friends post themselves. Otherwise you will get spammed with that stuff and you will get less of what your actual facebook friends post. You can remove likes also afterwards.
jerf 11y ago
Here on HN, over the years I've mentioned my "spouse firewall" for Facebook, which I considered to be the perfect level of involvement. Well, about a month ago my spouse firewall very nearly failed entirely. The problem was that with her mature Facebook account, with dozens of "friends" with a ton of other "friends", the stream of continuous bad news just became too much. Partially that's particular to some relationships we have, but even ignoring those, it was still an unrelenting stream of people having surgery, complications, financial troubles, and then very bizarrely mixed in with cute puppy photos, and then mixed in with political shitfits, to say nothing of some other family's "drama", all mixed with a "healthy" helping of continuous ads. As it turns out, my firewall "recovered", but usage has been toned way down, and a lot of people got themselves hidden. It gets said on HN every so often, but MySpace and the previous social networks often collapsed virtually overnight. I still think there's a good chance Facebook could still go that way. Edit: Sorry, my "spouse firewall" is that my wife is on Facebook and I have no account. I hear about the family gatherings and other such things announced only on Facebook that way, but don't have to have an account myself. So it's like a "firewall" filtering out only the most important stuff.
- sageikosa 11y ago
  "Spouse firewall" might be better described as using your spouse as a Mentat to social media.
  - Jtsummers 11y ago
    Firewall is more appropriate. A Mentat, in that sense, remembers things for you. Like whose birthday is coming up, which holiday party is Friday, etc. A firewall just tells you, and you have to act on that information yourself or in concert with them, but not strictly at their direction. They're a filter (my youngest cousin's new relationship has no bearing on my partner's wellbeing or life, especially given my cousin's history; if it lasts a few months, then it'll be worth mentioning).
- CodeCube 11y ago
  I've never seen this "spouse firewall" concept ... can you provide a link to one of your previous comments?
tonylemesmer 11y ago
I haven't got the app installed and only check it once or twice a week via browser. Its useful for invitations every now and again, but its still a conscious effort to keep it out of my life for the most part.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
aburan28 11y ago
Absolutely, you only see positive things on Facebook and if your not doing great I have no doubt it negatively affects depression
- pc86 11y ago
  That's the opposite of what the article argues.
- morganvachon 11y ago
  I have the opposite issue, especially in the current political climate. I have people I consider true friends who are on both extremes of the current election cycle, so right now my news feed is nothing but extremely negative left vs right bullshit. It's made me stop following people who I genuinely care about and would otherwise like to keep up with, and it's so depressing that it's beginning to affect my daily life. The only positive posts I see anymore are silly memes or the occasional "I accomplished something cool" status updates.
  - explorer666 11y ago
    > current election cycle In the US or where?
    - morganvachon 11y ago
      The US. It's always a circus during presidential election season, but this year seems to be particularly insane.
BenderV 11y ago
For people who also feel this feeling, I suggest you to try some browser extensions that will hide the news feed while letting you use the fb messengers & group function. I basically turn the notification for my best friends post, etc and delete the FB app. So I'm always connected and only receive notifications when one of my best friend posted something. I admit that it's not the ideal solution but it's the best one so far. - https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/news-feed-eradicator-for/fjcldmjmjhkklehbacihaiopjklihlgg https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/news-feed-eradicat... - https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/kill-news-feed/hjobfcedfgohjkaieocljfcppjbkglfd https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/kill-news-feed/hjo... (no inspirational quote but will also hide group recommendation).
markyc 11y ago
i manually unfollowed everyone on my list, so now my facebook home page is empty. i still go on other people's profiles from time to time, but way less than i used to this way it feels like i'm more in control of my activity and not getting flooded with "news" helps a lot for my peace of mind
- xyzzy4 11y ago
  I did this also. You get all the benefits of deactivating your Facebook account, but without feeling like you lost something.
compactmani 11y ago
Hmm, I've always thought that communication filtered and manipulated by corporate incentive was the most depressing part of Facebook. It looks like there are other reasons to find Facebook depressing.
jonstokes 11y ago
This is probably the primary reason that I can't get behind the Zuckerberg worship, no matter how much philanthropy he's involved in or how dedicated he is to self-improvement and so on. The man's main contribution to humanity is the spiritual equivalent of cigarettes -- toxic, addictive by design, and marketed to young people. It's gross. FB is gross, and that makes Zuckerberg gross.
- BenderV 11y ago
  Zuckerberg is not responsable for the existence of the Friendship Paradox or our natural instinct to envy, etc. Facebook mission in itself, is good. We have no reason to doubt Zuckerberg honesty to do good. Do you have any example where Facebook did something that they knew was bad but still did it? It's true that social network bring bad side effects, everything does. They can only try to correct them.
  - maxmouchet 11y ago
    They at least did doubtful experiments [1]. [1] http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/30/technology/facebook-tinkers-with-users-emotions-in-news-feed-experiment-stirring-outcry.html http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/30/technology/facebook-tinker...
  - creshal 11y ago
    > Zuckerberg is not responsable for the existence of the Friendship Paradox or our natural instinct to envy, etc. Nor is the tobacco industry responsible for nicotine's addictive effects. The question is, do the benefits outweigh the problems? As I've never used Facebook, I can't really judge.
    - robryk 11y ago
      > Nor is the tobacco industry responsible for nicotine's addictive effects. Devil's advocate: this is not the main problem with tobacco industry. The main issue is that other components of tobacco smoke are carcinogenic.
mapleoin 11y ago
It's weird how this article finds so many things wrong with Facebook, but it cannot even think of an alternative. Instea it talks about how Facebook can adapt (and has adapted by every year introducing a revolutionary feature like "unfollow"), how it's not so bad, how we need to change to adapt to it like it's a new body in the sky. How about just spend more time in real-life and less time photoshopping and broadcasting life-in-front-of-a-selfie-stick?
- cactux 11y ago
  > It's weird how this article finds so many things wrong with Facebook, but it cannot even think of an alternative. Why should we think of an alternative? One can "find so many things wrong with smoking or using drugs", without being requested to "think of an alternative". Did I miss something?
  - mapleoin 11y ago
    I guess I misspoke. I was thinking more of looking beyond/away from Facebook rather than looking for a Facebook replacement.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
iolothebard 11y ago
I just unsubscribed from everyone's feed. No need to be that drastic (deleting facebook). If I want to catch up on someone's life, I simply look at their page (like in 2005 pre-feed). If you're so concerned about people's "staged moments", it seems you should create the life you want for yourself instead of assuming their moments are "staged". I'll never understand envy, such a childish emotion.
- realusername 11y ago
  On my case I've just installed the 'News Feed Eradicator' extension which deletes all the news feed and replaces it with inspirational quotes. So I have the best of both worlds, I still use Facebook to contact people but I don't see all the bad stuff, I essentially use Facebook as MSN.
- cylinder 11y ago
  Yep, this is the key. I like occassionally sharing our photos with family, and the messaging is convenient. Feed doesn't make me depressed, it makes me annoyed at how stupid my "friends" are. I've just been hiding people more and more and then I'm liberated of their stressful stupidity.
- ljk 11y ago
  > staged moments That's such an accurate way of describing it! reminded me of the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxVZYiJKl1Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxVZYiJKl1Y
- Splines 11y ago
  I like that approach. I'm going to give it a shot, thanks for the idea. I'm a very infrequent Facebook user. I'll like posts from close family occasionally, and that's about it. I took my birthday off my profile and haven't posted anything in probably about a year.
joonoro 11y ago
>no matter how much philanthropy he's involved in Not even that, I had the fortune of glossing over this gem earlier today: https://www.jwz.org/blog/2015/12/zuckerberg-has-not-donated-anything-you-gullible-credulous-pinheads/ https://www.jwz.org/blog/2015/12/zuckerberg-has-not-donated-... EDIT: apparently the site I linked doesn't like linking from HN, sorry folks I had no idea.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- l1n 11y ago
  That site seems to block hotlinking from HN: here's a mirror https://archive.is/jjS21 https://archive.is/jjS21
  - cronjobber 11y ago
    JWZ actually blocks links from HN, specifically. No love lost there, it seems.
  - striking 11y ago
    Your link is blocked too. As long as you paste it into a new tab you're fine. I'm not going to bother looking up the specific tweet he said this in but jwz has "no time for HN"
    - kuschku 11y ago
      Breaking the web in such a way is completely inacceptable. http://www.donotlink.com/hkjc http://www.donotlink.com/hkjc
      - striking 11y ago
        It's his website. By design, the Internet lets you do whatever you think is best, even if what you think is best is totally misguided. I actually almost agree, that perhaps HN should create some sort of gateway that decreases the bandwidth costs of content creators.
l1n 11y ago
Nautil.us seems to be down right now. Cache link: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:lhjrzN6OLJ0J:nautil.us/issue/31/stress/is-facebook-luring-you-into-being-depressed+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:lhjrzN6... EDIT: seems to be back up now. Archive just in case: https://archive.is/l2oWo https://archive.is/l2oWo
JimboOmega 11y ago
I always thought the depressing aspect of Facebook wasn't the demands or negative content, but the "positive" content: The feeling that everyone else is more successful and doing cooler things than me.
jMyles 11y ago
Micah Daigle pointed out to me, four years ago now, that Facebook forces to user to view their life as "my day-to-day compared to all my friends' highlight reels." It was at that moment that I realize that Facebook leverages the darkest parts of emotional hurt in order to convert sales. It took my another year before I quit, but once I did, I felt better almost immediately and have never gone back. And I don't feel any less socially connected.
dayon 11y ago
I've been depressed since I quit Facebook. I no longer have access to the groups I used for countless purposes. Yea, there's alternatives, but I'm starting to see how many bridges I burned deleting a useful tool.
- Jtsummers 11y ago
  How'd you burn the bridges? You closed one channel of communication. If it was your only channel to those individuals and groups, then that may have been a mistake. I use FB strictly for scheduling and coordinating events with friends, it's easier and it shows up on everyone's calendar (except the handful that I text because they don't have FB). But I did this just as well, with a bit more friction, before by using texts and emails (primarily texts, it proved more reliable with more people). It takes more effort to maintain relationships without the passive FB connection, but it's very doable. EDIT: Leaving what I wrote, but an apology since, on rereading, it's dismissive of your plight. But I'll maintain, unless it was your only channel of communication the bridges aren't burned. And if it was, they still aren't, you can go back. If folks don't accept you back, then that's on them, not you.
  - dayon 11y ago
    For many of the connections I refer to, Facebook was my only way of contacting them. You're right, I could return. It still makes me think that this implicit claim that leaving Facebook improves our mood is faulty. Rarely or never do I see disclaimers about possibly increasing depression by quitting.
    - Jtsummers 11y ago
      I think it depends on how people use Facebook more than merely presence or absence on it. I barely use it. I have an account for two things: An exercise/health accountability group I started with friends (so we could post achievements, and failures, in a private to us spot that doesn't come off as bragging and doesn't discourage honest discussion of issues); to organize events (movies out, dinners in, parties, trips, etc.) with friends. I'm effectively not a Facebook user 99% of the time, and I'm happier for it. If someone really wants me to know about their accomplishments or pains they'll let me know, or they're too many degrees away (off Facebook) for my awareness to matter to either of us. The depression you're experiencing from quitting is the depression of social isolation (opinion from two comments, but this was my experience with moving cross country several times and not having any connections in the new locale, so maybe projecting a bit too). Explore other social connections in your physical area if it's possible, or reestablish your Facebook connections if it's not.
sjg007 11y ago
I really want a tool besides a chrome or no script add on to mass edit friends and friends lists.. I have so many people I want to remove.
kartan 11y ago
"...we inadvertently make our friends feel like losers and contribute to a swirling vortex of envy, in which we ourselves risk drowning." I always had the feeling that this attitude is worst in the United States than in other places. I guess that it is related to the way society tries to categorize others as winners/losers instead of looking at life as a shadow of greys. And how it blames people for being poor instead of taking into account different circumstances. (But, of course, is not an USA only problem) If you want to be happier on-line and off-line stop looking at others with envy and begin to look them for inspiration. Have they meaningful lives? How can I improve mine? If being connected to social networks makes you unhappy disconnecting is the right thing to do. But if envy is what makes you disconnect then your problem is also off-line and sooner or later you will need to get over it if you want to be realised and happy.
- isleyaardvark 11y ago
  This passage from Slaugterhouse Five has really stuck with me: >America is the wealthiest nation on Earth, but its people are mainly poor, and poor Americans are urged to hate themselves. To quote the American humorist Kin Hubbard, 'It ain’t no disgrace to be poor, but it might as well be.' It is in fact a crime for an American to be poor, even though America is a nation of poor. Every other nation has folk traditions of men who were poor but extremely wise and virtuous, and therefore more estimable than anyone with power and gold. No such tales are told by the American poor. They mock themselves and glorify their betters. The meanest eating or drinking establishment, owned by a man who is himself poor, is very likely to have a sign on its wall asking this cruel question: 'if you’re so smart, why ain’t you rich?' http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/158414-america-is-the-wealthiest-nation-on-earth-but-its-people http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/158414-america-is-the-wealth...
- unclebucknasty 11y ago
  >envy is what makes you disconnect then your problem is also off-line and sooner or later you will need to get over it if you want to be realised and happy. While I somewhat agree with this in spirit, the truth of it is that our well-being is a relative proposition. We are social creatures, living within a social construct. Hence, even in your suggestion that we look to others to ask whether they have meaningful lives and seek inspiration from them, you are encouraging people to measure themselves against others. But that begs the question that is the subject of this article. The notion that others have more meaningful lives is itself skewed by Facebook. So, viewed through that lens, nothing I do will make my life as meaningful as it "should" be. And, this need not have anything to do with the typical negative connotation of envy--that is, jealousy--in order to be harmful. I can be genuinely happy for the success I perceive in others, while simultaneously receiving the message that my own life is lacking.
Mikeb85 11y ago
The main problem with social media is that we (generally) post only the good moments in our lives. Leading to the idea that everyone else's lives are always awesome. We see the good and bad in our own lives, but see only the absolute best of other peoples' lives, leading to feelings of inadequacy. Now that's not to say it's Facebook's fault. We also generally keep pictures of our 'best' moments in our house. The problem is that, when everyone else's 'best' is on tap, visible so easily, we often forget that everyone is mortal. If someone were to look on my Facebook (which is now deactivated), they'd see travel adventures, me and my wife dressed up, doing fun things, etc... They wouldn't see me stressed out drinking cup after cup of coffee before a test. Even if I post the dinner I make every day, they wouldn't see the pile of dishes afterwards. Anyhow, I don't think Facebook is necessarily the cause, it just magnifies our weaknesses. And people have become so vain that I see people who go out just to get that 1 picture to post, not to enjoy themselves. The current generation are becoming more vain, because too many are obsessed with social media and the need to always appear perfect. In the old days when you saw your friends only once a week, it was far easier to hide weakness. As far as following celebrities, the problem is that it's a celebrity's JOB to appear perfect all the time. The 40-60 hours we spend trying to be good at our profession is 40-60 hours they spend trying to be good at promoting themselves and appearing perfect. Furthermore, celebrity worship just reinforces the lottery nature of our society. It's not good enough any more to have money, or to have friends. You need to be rich, and have followers...
VOYD 11y ago
Cult of Celebrity knows no bounds.

179 points by nomadictribe 11y ago

I deleted (deleted, not deactivated) my Facebook profile 4 years ago. It had clearly become an addiction, kinda like my mobile phone is now (cost/benefit balance of mobile phone is still too good to throw away). I remember actually having withdrawals in the first few weeks. Not sure if it was withdrawals or muscle memory that kept kicking in to check my feed, but there was an element of angst not being connected to the feed. Now I am quite happy without it (almost liberated), and trying to spend that time I would have spent on Facebook doing something that adds value to my life like reading HN! Surprisingly my circle (more of a triangle) of friends still exists, even without Facebook.

SmellyGeekBoy 11y ago
Ex-heavy Facebook user here (multiple times per hour) - I stopped checking it altogether and uninstalled the app about 3 weeks ago, just to see how I would get on. I know exactly the feelings you're talking about. After a week cold turkey I'm now back to checking much more infrequently (a couple of times a day) but it takes a huge amount of willpower to use it passively and not like / comment / post anything. I'd delete my account altogether but I find the Messenger really useful and I manage a few pages / events on there, not to mention wanting to keep up with some distant family. It's amazing how they've managed to create this feeling of dependence. What's also amazing is just how much more productive I've been over the past few weeks without the constant (self-inflicted) interruptions!
- markatkinson 11y ago
  Yea totally. I suppose a lot of people are actually using Facebook for work and their businesses (and Tinder) and so can't really get rid of their account. Also, I feel quite smug when someone asks to add me and I can say I don't use it... Maybe that is douchy...
  - SmellyGeekBoy 11y ago
    Haha, the smugness seems pretty common around here. Each to their own I say. Still, I do secretly envy the ones like yourself who have managed to escape!
- benten10 11y ago
  I realize for an outsider it may feel like a support group or a bunch of complainers ranting, but I'd like to add here: Me Too! I left facebook late in 2011, for various reasons, but mostly because it was making me sad and depressed. I was an extremely heavy user before that. I can say for sure that leaving facebook has made me objectively happier and less sadder. I remember that XKCD comic about social network effects. Our minds are 'trained' to 'compare' ourselves with 10-15 of our friends, and assert that we lie around the 'average'. When we look at facebook, where everyone puts on their best (and in the hundreds) our brains 'think' we're doing a lot worse than the average, and we feel bad about ourselves. I've heard a lot of people talk about not comparing to people on facebook, but... you really can't help it. Full Disclosure: I opened a different facebook account. JUST for family, because my mom didn't _believe_ that I didn't have a facebook. I open it maybe once in a couple of weeks, and have gone for many months without logging in. Here's something I'd tell to other people: if you feel depressed after using facebook, delete it. Forget about 'not keeping in touch', 'being a loner', etcetera. Your mental health is way, way, wayyy more important than knowing what your freaking high school acquaintance's third child had for lunch on a random day. Have a small group of close friends, and call them, hang out with them. Your larger group of friends will always be yours. If you need social networking, get snapchat (I'm a critic turned fanboy). It's fleeting, so you don't feel as bad about yourself, and people are not as annoying. Addendum: Here's how people make non-FB friends. A friend of a friend wanted help with grad schools, so I agreed to talk to her. We chatted on Skype (second encounter, EVER), and we ended up talking for an hour. She wanted someone to talk to and asked if we could talk again soon, and I didn't mind one more friend so we're skyping again soon. You make friends out of nowhere; don't need facebook for that. Facebook gives you the illusion you're 'in-touch' with everyone, when all you're doing is gathering 'intelligence' on their lives.
  - SmellyGeekBoy 11y ago
    > I remember that XKCD comic about social network effects. Our minds are 'trained' to 'compare' ourselves with 10-15 of our friends, and assert that we lie around the 'average'. When we look at facebook, where everyone puts on their best (and in the hundreds) our brains 'think' we're doing a lot worse than the average, and we feel bad about ourselves. I've heard a lot of people talk about not comparing to people on facebook, but... you really can't help it. I'm quite fortunate to have been quite successful in life, especially recently, so it's not this aspect that creates problems for me. It's the constant sharing of political / religious opinions and ensuing bickering (especially among my family) that gets me down. I've actually seen a few family relationships completely break down as a result of arguments over petty things on Facebook, with real life consequences. I'd rather not be exposed to any of that anymore and that was my reason for massively reducing my involvement in it.
- gnrme 11y ago
  It's the fear of missing out. All the social media services build their foundation on that addiction. Once you delete the accounts then the feeling slowly goes away and you get back to what life was like before all this nonsense started.
  - gherkin0 11y ago
    > It's the fear of missing out. All the social media services build their foundation on that addiction. Once you delete the accounts then the feeling slowly goes away and you get back to what life was like before all this nonsense started. And Facebook explicitly tries to prevent you from getting rid of that addiction. They have a "feature" that kicks in after a few days of non-use to incessantly remind you via email that you're missing out. So-and-so posted a picture, etc. As far as I can tell, there's no way to disable them without also disabling emails for event invites and direct messages, which is just shitty. I've had to setup gmail filters to get rid of them.
  - loceng 11y ago
    A caveat - if you have the skills and enough people in your life to actually facilitate a healthy lifestyle.
  - ArkyBeagle 11y ago
    I fear not missing out. If I need to hear about it, I will. I mainly use Facebook as a thing to waste time with while I'm waiting for it to be time to do something else.
- eswat 11y ago
  FYI you can use the Messenger app without having a Facebook account (at least before attaching Messenger to a Facebook account, not sure what would happen if you’ve already done so).
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
- markatkinson 11y ago
  Exactly, and I find not being invited to social events gives me a lot of time to do other things...
  - Jtsummers 11y ago
    You can always say no to an invitation.
lsniddy 11y ago
This is was any addiction feels like. Your brain aggressively telling you to do something and rewarding you when you do. I've been addicted to other things, but never got that dopamine rush from facebook. From the looks of it though facebook appears to me more addictive, or at least more available than your average addictive substance.
- fucking_tragedy 11y ago
  Psychological addictions are insidious.
moron4hire 11y ago
I was fine with deactivation only. The way I saw it, I didn't much care to change the fact that my past was on Facebook. I just wanted to make sure my future wasn't. There is a certain bit of psychological hacking going on calling connections "friends". Facebook has allowed a lot of people to reconnect and stay in contact, but maybe that isn't a good thing. Maybe we're supposed to only have transient interaction with most people. Maybe not knowing more about our cousins or our friend's friends is a sort of social lubricant. It's easier to be polite to my bigoted grandfather at Thanksgiving if I don't have daily reminders of his racism and homophobia. Perhaps the fact that none of the kids I grew up with are on Twitter is a feature of Twitter. I could maybe get back on Facebook if I treated it like Twitter: I disconnect as soon as your stream turns to anything that even gives me the feeling of wanting to make a negative comment[0]. My twitter feed is full of a mix of on one hand very interesting people, and on the other very quiet people. I like it this way. [0] I'm mostly successful at avoiding making that negative comment, which is kind of scary considering how many negative comments I do end up making.
- benten10 11y ago
  Excellent points throughout. Strongly agree with all of them. >Maybe not knowing more about our cousins or our friend's friends is a sort of social lubricant. It's easier to be polite to my bigoted grandfather at Thanksgiving if I don't have daily reminders of his racism and homophobia This has actually been how I connect to my friends lately, haha. I ask them what they've been upto, and they mostly go "you know, the same thing on facebook". And then they remember I'm not on facebook, so we go on hours and hours of heart-to-heart bringing up one another up to date with our lives. As the resident twitter fanboy (most of my karma comes from one pro-twitter comment), I couldn't agree with you more. To be fair though, twitter can be sometimes toxic too, but then I just mute the people and they fade from memory. Twitter feels more like the community I _want_ to be a part of, and facebook used to be the kind of community that I didn't particularly like (i.e, the facebooked version of my friends and family). I'll repeat what I say often on HN: the Twitter network/community makes me feel smarter and more excited about things in life. Facebook... never did. It made me want to gain the 'likes' (I wish they'd rename it to something less emotionally attached).
LesZedCB 11y ago
Yup I did the same thing is 2012. It has been the best. Except reddit quickly moved in to fill the void. However, at least reddit is anonymous people, and I generally filter on subreddits that have positive communities and generally quality content. I guess you could really implement the same sort of filter with facebook though. I guess I just think the medium for sharing content on reddit or HN is better.
tushar-r 11y ago
Same here. Deactivate when on a business trip a few months back and I found myself opening the app first thing when I woke up. Feel so much better about it. Still have muscle memory that makes me open the page once in a while, but it really feels better without it. Of course, now reddit has taken over some of that time, but it is primarily in the sysadmin/tech subreddits, so it is less depressy :-P
bluedino 11y ago
I de-activated my profile 4 months ago. It's nice. It was weird at first, but now I can't imagine checking it so many times an hour. I removed the app from my phone because after swiping to unlock, my thumb had a muscle memory to touch the corner of the screen the icon was in. I'd be on Facebook without even thinking about it. I still check sports, news, and other sites on my phone. But it's read-only. ESPN, Instagram, Imgur. I'm not sharing anything. I'm not reading the same types of status updates from 'friends' every couple days (but then again I'm still here on HN). At Thanksgiving I had family members asking why I haven't been on Facebook. Even my own father had asked my aunt "What is he up to?", since he doesn't have an account but she's always telling him about food I posted or places I checked in at.
xux 11y ago
For those who find it too difficult to delete your profile, consider just unfollowing random people. Whenever I see an update, I ask myself "would I go to this person's birthday party?" Answer turns out to be "no" 95% of the time. Overtime, my timeline got more and more boring, and sometimes when I log on I would still see updates from days ago. Now I only check it once or twice a week because it's so useless.
- sharkweek 11y ago
  I use a slightly less stringent policy, "if I saw this person in the grocery store and they hadn't seen me yet, would I go say 'hi' or active avoid them" Deleted anyone who fell into the second bucket - worked out really nicely
  - xux 11y ago
    Yeah that could work too. Though personally I don't like deleting people.
- tajen 11y ago
  Follow people you don't know, unfollow friends, like things you don't like, change the email address, let it expire (If you don't log in at Yahoo for 1 year, they delete it), change the password, lose it, don't update your phone number. There's always a way back because they're really keen to give you access to your account, but as you progressively get bored of it, you'll feel like you don't need to install it on your new phone. On top of that, they now have to filter our false information. The only problem is to explain to the TSA agent that you've falsified your identity on a US corporation website, but I've given up going to US too ;)...

grobbles 11y ago

Gamification is a demand dropped on users, seemingly forcing self-promotion and social reciprocity in an endless circle. And for what? In the end there is absolutely no gain, but many like and favorite and heart primarily to ensure that people like and favorite and heart whatever they do. We follow to be followed. We comment to be noticed. Because the metrics are front and center. I stopped using Flickr when I couldn't post a simple picture for any random passerby or my own storage without having the embarrassment of a low view count sitting highlighted on the page, the site imploring me to evangelize for me. If you build a site and try to leverage users by forced social metrics to encourage them to become ambassadors and self promoters...well I'd like to pretend it will hurt you, but sadly it won't.

jarmitage 11y ago

In a perfect world we would have the social plumbing without the psychological manipulation. But we're not, so here's how I've found how to make do with Facebook without it poisoning my brain. And yes I do benefit from it a lot, which is why I'm not leaving. This is what my redux version of Facebook looks like, using custom uBlock filters - basically just news feed and notifications. Manages to eliminate ~90% of their manipulation attempts I reckon. http://i.imgur.com/kRTI7Un.png http://i.imgur.com/kRTI7Un.png Other tips: unsubscribe from anything/one whose posts you don't want to see (sounds obvious if you're disciplined about this it makes a lot of difference), stick to messages only but inbox 0 it so you aren't storing useful info there, get event requests sync'd to an external calendar, untick 'remember' when you login. I've found it totally manageable this way, and am cautiously hopeful that one day it wont be necessary once the Silicon Valley psychopaths grow up.

legulere 11y ago
Also don't use the like button for anything except stuff friends post themselves. Otherwise you will get spammed with that stuff and you will get less of what your actual facebook friends post. You can remove likes also afterwards.

jerf 11y ago

Here on HN, over the years I've mentioned my "spouse firewall" for Facebook, which I considered to be the perfect level of involvement. Well, about a month ago my spouse firewall very nearly failed entirely. The problem was that with her mature Facebook account, with dozens of "friends" with a ton of other "friends", the stream of continuous bad news just became too much. Partially that's particular to some relationships we have, but even ignoring those, it was still an unrelenting stream of people having surgery, complications, financial troubles, and then very bizarrely mixed in with cute puppy photos, and then mixed in with political shitfits, to say nothing of some other family's "drama", all mixed with a "healthy" helping of continuous ads. As it turns out, my firewall "recovered", but usage has been toned way down, and a lot of people got themselves hidden. It gets said on HN every so often, but MySpace and the previous social networks often collapsed virtually overnight. I still think there's a good chance Facebook could still go that way. Edit: Sorry, my "spouse firewall" is that my wife is on Facebook and I have no account. I hear about the family gatherings and other such things announced only on Facebook that way, but don't have to have an account myself. So it's like a "firewall" filtering out only the most important stuff.

sageikosa 11y ago
"Spouse firewall" might be better described as using your spouse as a Mentat to social media.
- Jtsummers 11y ago
  Firewall is more appropriate. A Mentat, in that sense, remembers things for you. Like whose birthday is coming up, which holiday party is Friday, etc. A firewall just tells you, and you have to act on that information yourself or in concert with them, but not strictly at their direction. They're a filter (my youngest cousin's new relationship has no bearing on my partner's wellbeing or life, especially given my cousin's history; if it lasts a few months, then it'll be worth mentioning).
CodeCube 11y ago
I've never seen this "spouse firewall" concept ... can you provide a link to one of your previous comments?

tonylemesmer 11y ago

I haven't got the app installed and only check it once or twice a week via browser. Its useful for invitations every now and again, but its still a conscious effort to keep it out of my life for the most part.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

aburan28 11y ago

Absolutely, you only see positive things on Facebook and if your not doing great I have no doubt it negatively affects depression

pc86 11y ago
That's the opposite of what the article argues.
morganvachon 11y ago
I have the opposite issue, especially in the current political climate. I have people I consider true friends who are on both extremes of the current election cycle, so right now my news feed is nothing but extremely negative left vs right bullshit. It's made me stop following people who I genuinely care about and would otherwise like to keep up with, and it's so depressing that it's beginning to affect my daily life. The only positive posts I see anymore are silly memes or the occasional "I accomplished something cool" status updates.
- explorer666 11y ago
  > current election cycle In the US or where?
  - morganvachon 11y ago
    The US. It's always a circus during presidential election season, but this year seems to be particularly insane.

BenderV 11y ago

For people who also feel this feeling, I suggest you to try some browser extensions that will hide the news feed while letting you use the fb messengers & group function. I basically turn the notification for my best friends post, etc and delete the FB app. So I'm always connected and only receive notifications when one of my best friend posted something. I admit that it's not the ideal solution but it's the best one so far. - https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/news-feed-eradicator-for/fjcldmjmjhkklehbacihaiopjklihlgg https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/news-feed-eradicat... - https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/kill-news-feed/hjobfcedfgohjkaieocljfcppjbkglfd https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/kill-news-feed/hjo... (no inspirational quote but will also hide group recommendation).

markyc 11y ago

i manually unfollowed everyone on my list, so now my facebook home page is empty. i still go on other people's profiles from time to time, but way less than i used to this way it feels like i'm more in control of my activity and not getting flooded with "news" helps a lot for my peace of mind

xyzzy4 11y ago
I did this also. You get all the benefits of deactivating your Facebook account, but without feeling like you lost something.

compactmani 11y ago

Hmm, I've always thought that communication filtered and manipulated by corporate incentive was the most depressing part of Facebook. It looks like there are other reasons to find Facebook depressing.

jonstokes 11y ago

This is probably the primary reason that I can't get behind the Zuckerberg worship, no matter how much philanthropy he's involved in or how dedicated he is to self-improvement and so on. The man's main contribution to humanity is the spiritual equivalent of cigarettes -- toxic, addictive by design, and marketed to young people. It's gross. FB is gross, and that makes Zuckerberg gross.

BenderV 11y ago
Zuckerberg is not responsable for the existence of the Friendship Paradox or our natural instinct to envy, etc. Facebook mission in itself, is good. We have no reason to doubt Zuckerberg honesty to do good. Do you have any example where Facebook did something that they knew was bad but still did it? It's true that social network bring bad side effects, everything does. They can only try to correct them.
- maxmouchet 11y ago
  They at least did doubtful experiments [1]. [1] http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/30/technology/facebook-tinkers-with-users-emotions-in-news-feed-experiment-stirring-outcry.html http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/30/technology/facebook-tinker...
- creshal 11y ago
  > Zuckerberg is not responsable for the existence of the Friendship Paradox or our natural instinct to envy, etc. Nor is the tobacco industry responsible for nicotine's addictive effects. The question is, do the benefits outweigh the problems? As I've never used Facebook, I can't really judge.
  - robryk 11y ago
    > Nor is the tobacco industry responsible for nicotine's addictive effects. Devil's advocate: this is not the main problem with tobacco industry. The main issue is that other components of tobacco smoke are carcinogenic.

mapleoin 11y ago

It's weird how this article finds so many things wrong with Facebook, but it cannot even think of an alternative. Instea it talks about how Facebook can adapt (and has adapted by every year introducing a revolutionary feature like "unfollow"), how it's not so bad, how we need to change to adapt to it like it's a new body in the sky. How about just spend more time in real-life and less time photoshopping and broadcasting life-in-front-of-a-selfie-stick?

cactux 11y ago
> It's weird how this article finds so many things wrong with Facebook, but it cannot even think of an alternative. Why should we think of an alternative? One can "find so many things wrong with smoking or using drugs", without being requested to "think of an alternative". Did I miss something?
- mapleoin 11y ago
  I guess I misspoke. I was thinking more of looking beyond/away from Facebook rather than looking for a Facebook replacement.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

iolothebard 11y ago

I just unsubscribed from everyone's feed. No need to be that drastic (deleting facebook). If I want to catch up on someone's life, I simply look at their page (like in 2005 pre-feed). If you're so concerned about people's "staged moments", it seems you should create the life you want for yourself instead of assuming their moments are "staged". I'll never understand envy, such a childish emotion.

realusername 11y ago
On my case I've just installed the 'News Feed Eradicator' extension which deletes all the news feed and replaces it with inspirational quotes. So I have the best of both worlds, I still use Facebook to contact people but I don't see all the bad stuff, I essentially use Facebook as MSN.
cylinder 11y ago
Yep, this is the key. I like occassionally sharing our photos with family, and the messaging is convenient. Feed doesn't make me depressed, it makes me annoyed at how stupid my "friends" are. I've just been hiding people more and more and then I'm liberated of their stressful stupidity.
ljk 11y ago
> staged moments That's such an accurate way of describing it! reminded me of the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxVZYiJKl1Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxVZYiJKl1Y
Splines 11y ago
I like that approach. I'm going to give it a shot, thanks for the idea. I'm a very infrequent Facebook user. I'll like posts from close family occasionally, and that's about it. I took my birthday off my profile and haven't posted anything in probably about a year.

joonoro 11y ago

>no matter how much philanthropy he's involved in Not even that, I had the fortune of glossing over this gem earlier today: https://www.jwz.org/blog/2015/12/zuckerberg-has-not-donated-anything-you-gullible-credulous-pinheads/ https://www.jwz.org/blog/2015/12/zuckerberg-has-not-donated-... EDIT: apparently the site I linked doesn't like linking from HN, sorry folks I had no idea.

deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
l1n 11y ago
That site seems to block hotlinking from HN: here's a mirror https://archive.is/jjS21 https://archive.is/jjS21
- cronjobber 11y ago
  JWZ actually blocks links from HN, specifically. No love lost there, it seems.
- striking 11y ago
  Your link is blocked too. As long as you paste it into a new tab you're fine. I'm not going to bother looking up the specific tweet he said this in but jwz has "no time for HN"
  - kuschku 11y ago
    Breaking the web in such a way is completely inacceptable. http://www.donotlink.com/hkjc http://www.donotlink.com/hkjc
    - striking 11y ago
      It's his website. By design, the Internet lets you do whatever you think is best, even if what you think is best is totally misguided. I actually almost agree, that perhaps HN should create some sort of gateway that decreases the bandwidth costs of content creators.

l1n 11y ago

Nautil.us seems to be down right now. Cache link: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:lhjrzN6OLJ0J:nautil.us/issue/31/stress/is-facebook-luring-you-into-being-depressed+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:lhjrzN6... EDIT: seems to be back up now. Archive just in case: https://archive.is/l2oWo https://archive.is/l2oWo

JimboOmega 11y ago

I always thought the depressing aspect of Facebook wasn't the demands or negative content, but the "positive" content: The feeling that everyone else is more successful and doing cooler things than me.

jMyles 11y ago

Micah Daigle pointed out to me, four years ago now, that Facebook forces to user to view their life as "my day-to-day compared to all my friends' highlight reels." It was at that moment that I realize that Facebook leverages the darkest parts of emotional hurt in order to convert sales. It took my another year before I quit, but once I did, I felt better almost immediately and have never gone back. And I don't feel any less socially connected.

dayon 11y ago

I've been depressed since I quit Facebook. I no longer have access to the groups I used for countless purposes. Yea, there's alternatives, but I'm starting to see how many bridges I burned deleting a useful tool.

Jtsummers 11y ago
How'd you burn the bridges? You closed one channel of communication. If it was your only channel to those individuals and groups, then that may have been a mistake. I use FB strictly for scheduling and coordinating events with friends, it's easier and it shows up on everyone's calendar (except the handful that I text because they don't have FB). But I did this just as well, with a bit more friction, before by using texts and emails (primarily texts, it proved more reliable with more people). It takes more effort to maintain relationships without the passive FB connection, but it's very doable. EDIT: Leaving what I wrote, but an apology since, on rereading, it's dismissive of your plight. But I'll maintain, unless it was your only channel of communication the bridges aren't burned. And if it was, they still aren't, you can go back. If folks don't accept you back, then that's on them, not you.
- dayon 11y ago
  For many of the connections I refer to, Facebook was my only way of contacting them. You're right, I could return. It still makes me think that this implicit claim that leaving Facebook improves our mood is faulty. Rarely or never do I see disclaimers about possibly increasing depression by quitting.
  - Jtsummers 11y ago
    I think it depends on how people use Facebook more than merely presence or absence on it. I barely use it. I have an account for two things: An exercise/health accountability group I started with friends (so we could post achievements, and failures, in a private to us spot that doesn't come off as bragging and doesn't discourage honest discussion of issues); to organize events (movies out, dinners in, parties, trips, etc.) with friends. I'm effectively not a Facebook user 99% of the time, and I'm happier for it. If someone really wants me to know about their accomplishments or pains they'll let me know, or they're too many degrees away (off Facebook) for my awareness to matter to either of us. The depression you're experiencing from quitting is the depression of social isolation (opinion from two comments, but this was my experience with moving cross country several times and not having any connections in the new locale, so maybe projecting a bit too). Explore other social connections in your physical area if it's possible, or reestablish your Facebook connections if it's not.

sjg007 11y ago

I really want a tool besides a chrome or no script add on to mass edit friends and friends lists.. I have so many people I want to remove.

kartan 11y ago

"...we inadvertently make our friends feel like losers and contribute to a swirling vortex of envy, in which we ourselves risk drowning." I always had the feeling that this attitude is worst in the United States than in other places. I guess that it is related to the way society tries to categorize others as winners/losers instead of looking at life as a shadow of greys. And how it blames people for being poor instead of taking into account different circumstances. (But, of course, is not an USA only problem) If you want to be happier on-line and off-line stop looking at others with envy and begin to look them for inspiration. Have they meaningful lives? How can I improve mine? If being connected to social networks makes you unhappy disconnecting is the right thing to do. But if envy is what makes you disconnect then your problem is also off-line and sooner or later you will need to get over it if you want to be realised and happy.

isleyaardvark 11y ago
This passage from Slaugterhouse Five has really stuck with me: >America is the wealthiest nation on Earth, but its people are mainly poor, and poor Americans are urged to hate themselves. To quote the American humorist Kin Hubbard, 'It ain’t no disgrace to be poor, but it might as well be.' It is in fact a crime for an American to be poor, even though America is a nation of poor. Every other nation has folk traditions of men who were poor but extremely wise and virtuous, and therefore more estimable than anyone with power and gold. No such tales are told by the American poor. They mock themselves and glorify their betters. The meanest eating or drinking establishment, owned by a man who is himself poor, is very likely to have a sign on its wall asking this cruel question: 'if you’re so smart, why ain’t you rich?' http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/158414-america-is-the-wealthiest-nation-on-earth-but-its-people http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/158414-america-is-the-wealth...
unclebucknasty 11y ago
>envy is what makes you disconnect then your problem is also off-line and sooner or later you will need to get over it if you want to be realised and happy. While I somewhat agree with this in spirit, the truth of it is that our well-being is a relative proposition. We are social creatures, living within a social construct. Hence, even in your suggestion that we look to others to ask whether they have meaningful lives and seek inspiration from them, you are encouraging people to measure themselves against others. But that begs the question that is the subject of this article. The notion that others have more meaningful lives is itself skewed by Facebook. So, viewed through that lens, nothing I do will make my life as meaningful as it "should" be. And, this need not have anything to do with the typical negative connotation of envy--that is, jealousy--in order to be harmful. I can be genuinely happy for the success I perceive in others, while simultaneously receiving the message that my own life is lacking.

Mikeb85 11y ago

The main problem with social media is that we (generally) post only the good moments in our lives. Leading to the idea that everyone else's lives are always awesome. We see the good and bad in our own lives, but see only the absolute best of other peoples' lives, leading to feelings of inadequacy. Now that's not to say it's Facebook's fault. We also generally keep pictures of our 'best' moments in our house. The problem is that, when everyone else's 'best' is on tap, visible so easily, we often forget that everyone is mortal. If someone were to look on my Facebook (which is now deactivated), they'd see travel adventures, me and my wife dressed up, doing fun things, etc... They wouldn't see me stressed out drinking cup after cup of coffee before a test. Even if I post the dinner I make every day, they wouldn't see the pile of dishes afterwards. Anyhow, I don't think Facebook is necessarily the cause, it just magnifies our weaknesses. And people have become so vain that I see people who go out just to get that 1 picture to post, not to enjoy themselves. The current generation are becoming more vain, because too many are obsessed with social media and the need to always appear perfect. In the old days when you saw your friends only once a week, it was far easier to hide weakness. As far as following celebrities, the problem is that it's a celebrity's JOB to appear perfect all the time. The 40-60 hours we spend trying to be good at our profession is 40-60 hours they spend trying to be good at promoting themselves and appearing perfect. Furthermore, celebrity worship just reinforces the lottery nature of our society. It's not good enough any more to have money, or to have friends. You need to be rich, and have followers...

VOYD 11y ago

Cult of Celebrity knows no bounds.